Contemplating an M4-p

-doomed-

-doomed-

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I currently use an M3 and a IIIf but for some reason I am drawn to the M4-p.

Are there any of you who wear glasses and use the M4-P who have also used an M3? Which you prefer and why? My M3 is a great camera and I use it just about everyday but I'm thinking of adding a second M body, being that it has the 28 and 35mm framelines as well as the 75. I'm partially drawn to the M4-P for the black finish as well. Other suggestions, if you have them, would also be great.
 
You will most likely have issues viewing the whole 28mm frame wearing glasses. If the 50mm frame is fine in the M3, then the 35mm frame SHOULD be fine in the M4-P, I would suggest looking through one before purchase.

I love my M4-P, it has been a great great camera. I have an M3 as well, which I prefer as I find myself mostly using the 50mm and 90mm lenses so will be selling the M4-P soon to fund a 4x5. I'm sure I will miss it.
 
The 28 frameline seems to be an issue with glasses , but then again I had an R2a that i used a 35 on and could never see the full 35mm framelines. Looks like i'll have to see if my local place still has that m4-p.
 
I used a friend's M4-P many years ago and recall that even the 35mm frame lines were difficult with the glasses I wore at the time.
 
I wear eye-glasses and the M4-P is my all-time favorite camera BUT ... forget about 28mm frame-lines when wearing eye-glasses. All Leica M with 0.72x VF were the same in this regard (MP, M6 classic, M7). BTW, 35mm frame-lines are visible but it is the limit (in my case).

For some time I had an M4-P and M3 in parallel, the M3 for 50mm (Noctilux, there is no better VF for this lens) and 21mm (with external VF) and M4-P for 35mm. I finally sold the M3 (and kept the M4-P) because not being able to use the M3 VF for 35mm FL was a big drawback in practical use for me.
 
I had an M4-P until a year or so ago. The combination of my spectacles and the shape of my face meant that the 35mm framelines were just a little too awkward to be comfortable. I always felt that I had to squish my glasses firmly against the eyepiece and to look around for the frames rather than them being obvious in front of me. I don't have particularly thick spectacles, I think it comes down to the individual shape of your face, the rigidity of your spectacle frames and your willingness to have them chewed up by the camera eyepiece. With my glasses on I would never have known that the 28mm framelines were there.
 
I have an m2 and an m4-p. The rangefinder patch on the m4-p (brass body, 1981 vintage) flares quite a bit more, however, it's brighter than the m2. It's a tradeoff, but it's annoying. I put a small piece of electrical tape (same size as the rf window) over the center of the frameline window, and that helps, but still. I would get an M2 and ballpark the 28 as the entire viewfinder--might be a small percentage off, but not enough to make a difference. However, I do like the black chrome, and thats something you won't find with the M2.

Argg. Brain hurts. Why must every advantage produce an equally annoying disadvantage? Why did I not go into dentistry like my dad wanted--then i could afford an a la carte MP and be done with this? Hell, I could probably get an M9. Damned liberal arts colleges with their attractive art major chicks, and their bullsh*t English degrees that seem so 'hip' when you're 20.

Alas, I digress. Good luck with your purchase.
 
There are two types of M4-P's. Earlier ones, with recessed viewfinder window have 35mm framelines the same size of the M2 and M4. Late ones, with "flat" viewfinder window have 35mm framelines the same size as in the M6, about 5% smaller and adjusted for 0.7m min. focus.

Due to your eye glasses, maybe you want to look for a late M4-P ? Or look for an M6 instead ? Nowadays, there is only a 2-300 US difference for good used models.

I often use a two camera combo of M4-P/M6 and M3, and like it very much.

Roland.
 
The m6 is something to think about , I hadn't really considered it. I appreciate the help I've been given so far. It's great to get info from those who have used them.

I bought my m3 based solely on it's price at the time. It's lack of a 35mm frameline is what pushes me to look for a second M. The m4-p being black seems to be part of the decision as well.

If I could afford the mp or a decent used m8 that'd be where I'd probably go. The digital M is very much on my list of future purchases but for now the film M's are perfect for me.
 
Went and looked through the m4-p today and an m6 the m4p is well used but is in great shape mechanically at $750. The m6 was nice but it was a ttl version that looked brand new and priced out of reach. The framelines look useable for me and as expected the full 28mm frame is hard to see in it's entirety but seems useable. Now all I need is for my tax return to hurry up and deposit itself
 
I think the best thing for us glasses wearers who use leicas is a viewfinder cover/guard. My has helped keep my spectacles scratch-less while using my m4p.

--michael
 
I have a M4-P and a M2. With my glasses on I can barely see the frame lines for the 90 (90 and 135 on the M4-P) . I'd pretty well given up on the idea of using the Leicas until I got correction diopters from a Chinese supplier on Ebay for about $35.00 each. (The prices for the diopters from Leica are at best ridiculous.) I take my glasses off and I can see all the frame lines on both cameras, perfectly. A better solution I guess would be contact lenses.

I just did a search on Ebay for these diopters but don't see them listed at the moment.
 
I'm in exactly the same boat as the OP. I wear glasses, have a M3 as my only body, and use it for 35 (goggled Summaron), 50 and 90. I don't have much interest in 28 so that makes it a little easier. The 35 Summaron works great and I've been pretty pleased with it so I suppose I really don't need another body. But it's rarely easy to balance wants and needs. I too would like another M body to dedicate to the 35 and the M4-P seems like just the ticket. I'll admit that the black color is a factor as well, they just look great. The thought is that the M3 is my 50/90 body and the M4-P is the 35 body.

If money were no object, I'd already have one but that's not the case. I feel I need to justify somewhat two M bodies so I'm right there. I wish I had something to say to help you out -doomed-, but maybe when you figure it out you can turn around and help a brother out : )

Chris
 
I'm pretty set on picking up the M4-P , the M3 is great for 50mm but Id like the option of a built in 35 frame on a Black M. I may have to sell the M3 and IIIf in the future , but I'm currently in a position where I can afford to get a hold of a second M(Tax return is large enough to pay outstanding credit card balances and have enough left for the M4-P) If the M4-P is gone before i go back to the local camera place it wasn't meant to be and I'll look into the M6 seriously possibly trading in the M3 and IIIf , or just waiting for an affordable M6 to pop up. I'm not sure ill have this chance again for a bit since I've recently returned to college. If neither come to fruition there is still my M3 , that is a great camera to use.
 
I have an M4P and have had for around 10 years, together with contemporary lenses - 35mm Summicron (4th version) tabbed 50mm Summicron and Tele Elmarit 90mm. I have always found it to be a pleasant camera to use although I think I prefer the M3 personally as I do not mind using an accessory finder. I am also not sure how I feel about not having a light meter though. It used never to worry to much - there is something about metering once with a hand held meter then putting it away and relying on the fact that lighting conditions do not change much in a short space of time usually so you can rely on judgment for the most part once you have a little experience.

I have not been shooting it regularly in recent years - tempted by the "dark side" - digital. But recently I got it out again and found a couple of problems that I now have discovered are endemic to M4Ps.

Firstly the viewfinder tends to fog due to something inside the camera (glue / plastic???) "outgassing" a chemical that fogs the finder. Easy to fix once the top plate is removed (incidentally check YouTube - there is a video that tells you how to do it for the almost identical M6. The only difference with the M4P so far as I can tell is that it has an extra screw at 12.00 o'clock postion in the lens mount under a wax seal). I am told that the way to remove the fogging is to clean the inside of the glass with - wait for it.....toothpaste. Incredible but its a fact confirmed by a couple of people including my local "camera guy."

The other endemic problem is that the two flash sync plugs at the back of the camera screw into a very flimsy plastic flash sync block assembly (which also includes the hotshoe.) I dont think this affects the hotshoe but the sync plugs not infrequently break away and can be lost. Again its not too hard to replace by removing the top plate if you can get the part. Recently I have bought the required part on ebay (around $30 up to $70 depending on what comes with it). I am now awaiting arrival of the necessary specialised tools (i.e. flexclamps which are needed to unscrew some of the retaining rings on the camera) to remove the top plate and then I will make the fix myself or if I get too stuck will turn it over to my mechanic.)

While these are not terrible problems and need not be rdeal breakers you should be aware of these potential issues and check for them before you buy the camera. (Arguably they should not have occurred , which only shows that even Leica does not always get it right and will sometimes compromise quality to save money. Another reason I like the M3 better although I am still more or less happy with the M4P.)

Bottom line for you - Check the item before you ante up the cash and if necessary negotiate to allow for at least a CLA in the price you pay.
 
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I wear glasses and have no real issue with my m4p.
I often use an external viewfinder but I do so as well with my m6. Try it out first and consider an external viewfinder as well. I know it is an expensive little guy but I find it really helps me to concentrate on the photo and composition.
 
Another option , sell my M3 to fund an M6 ? I don't know that I really need two M bodies and the meter in the m6 seems like a plus.
 
No, you don't need two.

You need three... or four... or...

My M4-P is the worst Leica I've ever owned. Flary finder; not as smooth as any other I've ever owned; rotten (fragile) black chrome finish...

Cheers,

R.
 
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