A tragic loss! Neopan 400!

[maddoc]

If they ever stopped making Tri-X I would probably cry. I must be the only guy on this forum that hasn't been able to get a good shot w/ Neopan. I saw some really good stuff on flickr and bought a few rolls and it just hasn't worked out. Mine looks like a flatter, lower contrast version of T-Max. Maybe it's the developer? The Tri-X always goes in D76, so that was what the Neopan went in, and it's just too gray for my tastes. This was 120, not 35mm, but I can't see how that would matter.

Fascinating thread though.

In HC-110 "B" it gave some good results (400PR). It is sad that it is gone, here in Sapporo it is sold out and and also out of stock already.

 

[andredossantos]

If they ever stopped making Tri-X I would probably cry. I must be the only guy on this forum that hasn't been able to get a good shot w/ Neopan. I saw some really good stuff on flickr and bought a few rolls and it just hasn't worked out. Mine looks like a flatter, lower contrast version of T-Max. Maybe it's the developer? The Tri-X always goes in D76, so that was what the Neopan went in, and it's just too gray for my tastes. This was 120, not 35mm, but I can't see how that would matter.

Fascinating thread though.

As with anything, it's all highly personal. I absolutely love Neopan 400 in 120. It's kind of flat, contrast wise and as such is very tweakable (I scan it).

Also, Ive said before that it kind of looks like Tmax and your the
first person I've seen echo that statement. Generally I like older
style b&w films (like neopan) but I'm a becoming a big fan of the
new tmax precidely because I really dig it's tonality.

 

[tensai]

There's an announcement here on the Fujifilm Japan website dated 5th February 2010. The new lineup of B&W film is here. Films marked with a (*1) are discontinued and once stock is all sold, that's it. Films marked with a (*2) will be sold from April this year. No number mean no change.

Thanks for that link! I thought perhaps they kept it going for the Japanese market and still can't believe they took away the only BW 120 400 iso film they have.. The official site really brings home the sad truth. I hope they introduce a new version - if not I'll have to switch to tri-x (closest look?).

I have 20~25 rolls in the fridge but tomorrow will be gather hunting day..

 

[Turtle]

Its not as bad as it looks because...

The 35mm will be continued and this is where it is most important IMHO as the finest grained traditional 400 film.

In 120 TriX competes better and the grain advantage of Neopan 400 is not quite as important.

In 120 you have the choice of Tmax 400 2 and D400 for the modern films and Hp5+/TriX for the big brand oldies. As much as I love Neopan 400 in 120 (my main film) I am less bothered than I was a week ago because I will just switch to TriX for general use and D400 when I must have min grain. Neopan was the better all rounder IMHO, but thats life.

 

[Freakscene]

Perfluorooctanesulfonic acid (PFOS) was added to Annex B of the Stockholm Convention on persistent organic pollutants (POPs) in May 2009:
COP4 - Geneva, 9 May 2009

Japan has just passed legislation to take up these new controls.

PFOS is a powerful immunosuppressant and can persist and concentrate in biological systems. I'd have considered avoiding using Neopan 400 120 had I known that the film contained PFOS.

Low-level exposures of PFOS can accumulate and the chemical can pass across skin; I am glad I've always worn gloves when processing. It also shows that films are very complex chemically and contain unexpected components.

Marty

 

[mh2000]

I tried it a few times in 35 and 120 and wasn't amazed or wowed... have also gone between Ilford and Kodak, mostly based on which is cheaper and gotten really good results from both... Fuji B&W just never grabbed me...

Do regret the loss for those that use the stuff though...

On the old theme, "you don't know what you've got till it's gone," what are the endearing features of Neopan 400 that make it so valuable? One poster has said "film is dead" for him should Neopan 400 be discontinued in 135. I must say, I've never used it, sticking pretty much to Ilford and Kodak products. Why is this film to be preferred to Kodak or Ilford? Now that it's going or gone already, I'd like to know what I've been missing.

 

[Dave Wilkinson]

...talk about 'the pot calling the kettle', the objectors to Picket Wilson's assertions don't mention the boring and repetitive weekly posts like - "film is cheap, plentiful, far superior - and will not disappear in our lifetime". And my opinion re. Neopan - for what it's worth.....I've tried it - and was not delighted! - I'm in agreement with Roger, 120 HP5+ is the best thing available for tonality, latitude, ease of use - and anything else you can think of!. And when the production of it ceases, I certainly won't give film up - providing both film and I are still around! 🙂

 

[funkpilz]

Is anyone else hoping they'll introduce a new Presto with slightly different materials like they did with RVP?

 

[Calzone]

I'm a fan of the contrast mainly ... the whites are very white and blacks have real depth. I was never able to achieve the same level with Tri-X and HP5+ is just plain bland!

I also really like the look of Neopan 400 pushed to 1600 and even 3200! Gritty with Rodinal and smooth as a baby's bum with Xtol ... it also scans very well IMO.

Roger (Hicks) hates the stuff for some reason! 😕

Keith,

I never shot Neopan 400, but I can get those very white whites and deep blacks with HP5 and Tri-x using Microphen 1+3. The HP5 is bumped to 650 and with Tri-x 500.

Standard developement in D-76 1:1 or in ID-11 1:1 produces grey negatives IMHO.

Just trying to ease the pain.

Cal

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

Keith,

I never shot Neopan 400, but I can get those very white whites and deep blacks with HP5 and Tri-x using Microphen 1+3. The HP5 is bumped to 650 and with Tri-x 500.

Standard developement in D-76 1:1 or in ID-11 1:1 produces grey negatives IMHO.

Just trying to ease the pain.

Cal

If normal development in a regular developer like D-76 gives grey negatives, you're not developing long enough.

 

[FS Vontz]

If normal development in a regular developer like D-76 gives grey negatives, you're not developing long enough.

??

Take it I've missed something, I use D-76, all my negatives come out in varying shades of grey

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

??

Take it I've missed something, I use D-76, all my negatives come out in varying shades of grey

The guy I was responding too used the term "grey" to mean his pictures didn't have enough contrast, no whites or deep blacks. He blamed D-76 for that, when n fact he just needs to develop longer to increase contrast.

 

[Calzone]

The guy I was responding too used the term "grey" to mean his pictures didn't have enough contrast, no whites or deep blacks. He blamed D-76 for that, when n fact he just needs to develop longer to increase contrast.

Thanks Chris for the help, but what I do with Microphen at 1+3 is boost the contrast. Using ID-11 1:1 I get very nice negatives with lots of midtones, but they are lower contrast. I use a slight push to 650 and pump up the contrast when I develope rolls of film that were shot early morning and late afternoon. A lot of my shooting is walking to and from work during these times where the light is more diffused.

I was suggesting to Keith, while perhaps not like Neopan 400, perhaps Microphen and extended developement might provide or approach the favorable contrast he gets with Neopan. I also know that Keith has not had pleasing results with HP5, but I don't know if he has tried the HP5 with Microphen.

I realize you are being like me: trying to be helpful.

Calzone

 

[emraphoto]

Its not as bad as it looks because...

The 35mm will be continued and this is where it is most important IMHO as the finest grained traditional 400 film.

In 120 TriX competes better and the grain advantage of Neopan 400 is not quite as important.

In 120 you have the choice of Tmax 400 2 and D400 for the modern films and Hp5+/TriX for the big brand oldies. As much as I love Neopan 400 in 120 (my main film) I am less bothered than I was a week ago because I will just switch to TriX for general use and D400 when I must have min grain. Neopan was the better all rounder IMHO, but thats life.

pretty much sums it up... 100 rolls of tri-x on the way.

 

[stephaneb]

Their loss

Their loss

Come on guys, it is not the end of the world. Fuji has not been a major player in B&W in a very long time and has never shown a will to become one. Acros is a brilliant product, Neopan 400 and 1600 are very good, but none of them is impossible to replace. Maco is showing everyone what can be done with an actual will to build up a B&W films range, and they do it with excellent products.

Neopan 400 can easily be replaced by Rollei 400S, Tri-X or HP5+. Slight differences in graininess are not all that relevant in my opinion. I have never tried the Foma films, maybe their Fomapan 400 is good too.

 

[Juan Valdenebro]

Dear Pickett Wilson,

I have deleted my previous posts. I want to apologize for the personal tone I used, which was unfair to you, a respectful person to all of us forum members. I also want to tell you that I share most of your opinions, and I respect you as a person and as a photographer, and wish you all possible joys with film and digital.

Cheers,

Juan

 

[HHPhoto]

The day they stop making Neopan in 35mm will be the day film photography is over for me!

It's not looking good for fast MF black and white film ... I'm no fan of HP5 so only a couple of other choices left!

There are lots of different choices for 400 speed 120 BW film:

Ilford Delta 400
Ilford HP5+
Ilford XP2 Super

Kodak T-Max 400
Kodak Tri-X
Kodak BW 400CN

Rollei Retro 400S
Rollei IR (without IR filter a very good normal ISO 400 film)

Fomapan 400

InovisCoat / Adox Pan 400 will hit the market this year

And even two 200 speed 120 films:

Ilford SFX
Rollei Superpan 200

In addition in 35mm we have

Neopan 400
Filmotec TC 27
Filmotec 74
(you can order the Filmotec films directly at Filmotec in bulk; 30m afaik)

If a photograper is not able to find at least one film he likes among these alternatives, than he probably isn't a good photographer.

I started photography in the early eigthies. At that time there were less choices in 400 ISO BW film.

Cheers,
Jan

 

[Juan Valdenebro]

Jan, even if we have other options available, it's normal missing a film you already know how to use (how to expose and develop) under different light situations... That's where it really hurts... Taking a new film to a high quality image level isn't normally done after two rolls and two days...

Cheers,

Juan

 

[HHPhoto]

Jan, even if we have other options available, it's normal missing a film you already know how to use (how to expose and develop) under different light situations... That's where it really hurts... Taking a new film to a high quality image level isn't normally done after two rolls and two days...

Cheers,

Juan

Juan,

in my experience testing a new film is not a big issue. I even like that.

Digital photographers often buy a new camera every two years and have to test the new sensor and camera software how it works in different conditions.
They accept that and don't complain.

Film photographers complain when they have to use a new film after using one film for 20 years...😉.

Sorry, I think lots of film photographers are spoiled and a bit inflexible.
Stop crying, start shooting.

Cheers,
Jan

 

[jan normandale]

Dear Pickett Wilson,

I have deleted my previous posts. I want to apologize for the personal tone I used, which was unfair to you, a respectful person to all of us forum members. I also want to tell you that I share most of your opinions, and I respect you as a person and as a photographer, and wish you all possible joys with film and digital.

Cheers,

Juan

Juan, very refreshing attitude! I didn't follow the entire thread however you've taken a thoughtful approach. I respect that.


Regarding the concern for Neopan; one reason I like it is it is an excellent low light film for long exposures. If you look at reciprocity charts you will see the curves for this film are substantially flatter than most other films. It's entirely possible that there are similar product monographs from Kodak or Ilford but I haven't seen them.

It's a good film. I'll miss it and yes I'll shoot HP5+ and TriX like I have for years but that doesn't mean I should not be disappointed at the loss of a truly wonderful BW film.

@Jan... coffee, tea, water and wine have been around a long time too what's your point.