Naumoski
Well-known
Hi,
I'm about to graduate this month so I would like to buy myself a present.
I have some issues about getting a Medium format camera, and lurking some long time about getting one, and if I'm going to MF I would like to get a quality camera and glass that would be seen on its larger 6x6 film / or saving some more money and getting a full frame digital camera and fixed lens.
The choices are:
Rolleiflex 3.5F or Canon 5D (+ 1 or 2 lens), both used.
(I live in Macedonia so the choice for getting a MF camera is very tiny, the rollei is the best MF I've found fore sell to date, so I'm looking in other RF/SLR/TLR medium format cameras too)
The rollei is in a good working condition for about 350 euro, and Canon 5D is rolling around for 750euro+ (body only). The price difference is quite huge, but as soon I go to FF digital - I think it's better, because the cameras would be cheaper in future, and a Rollei would have its price and maybe higher.
What do you think?
I'm about to graduate this month so I would like to buy myself a present.
I have some issues about getting a Medium format camera, and lurking some long time about getting one, and if I'm going to MF I would like to get a quality camera and glass that would be seen on its larger 6x6 film / or saving some more money and getting a full frame digital camera and fixed lens.
The choices are:
Rolleiflex 3.5F or Canon 5D (+ 1 or 2 lens), both used.
(I live in Macedonia so the choice for getting a MF camera is very tiny, the rollei is the best MF I've found fore sell to date, so I'm looking in other RF/SLR/TLR medium format cameras too)
The rollei is in a good working condition for about 350 euro, and Canon 5D is rolling around for 750euro+ (body only). The price difference is quite huge, but as soon I go to FF digital - I think it's better, because the cameras would be cheaper in future, and a Rollei would have its price and maybe higher.
What do you think?
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DNG
Film Friendly
The 5D will be more versatile in many areas. and the initial outlay will be more, and with the Rollie, you will have a film cost to consider (The 5D has no film cost). And has a normal lens only, plus a waist-level VF. For a street shooter, a TLR can be a benefit too. The 2x2 format is great for large enlargements too. 120/220 film is still around, and in a verity of flavors.
They are very different camera's, in how you view and focus.
What are needs for the camera?
This will help you out.
They are very different camera's, in how you view and focus.
What are needs for the camera?
This will help you out.
Naumoski
Well-known
I know the the both systems are tottaly different but so are the flavours:
I like to try medium format quality, 6x6 films, its classsy look, I would mostly use for portraits, musicians etc., so a longer lens might consider as better in this case.
I use 35mm film camera little less than a year, and since then, I use my Canon s5 is digital camera very less and less (only for vacations, with friends etc). If a go to digital I would sell it.
Canon 5D is a camera that would suite all my needs. I would only buy a FF digital, so I would can use real wides, manual lens and great digital quality for any use such as portraits, live performances and long exposures, for example.
But on the other side getting a 5D + 50mm 1.4 and optionaly some wide lens would be far more expensive against my enthusiastic/hobby budget.
I like to try medium format quality, 6x6 films, its classsy look, I would mostly use for portraits, musicians etc., so a longer lens might consider as better in this case.
I use 35mm film camera little less than a year, and since then, I use my Canon s5 is digital camera very less and less (only for vacations, with friends etc). If a go to digital I would sell it.
Canon 5D is a camera that would suite all my needs. I would only buy a FF digital, so I would can use real wides, manual lens and great digital quality for any use such as portraits, live performances and long exposures, for example.
But on the other side getting a 5D + 50mm 1.4 and optionaly some wide lens would be far more expensive against my enthusiastic/hobby budget.
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DNG
Film Friendly
The 5D is lowest FF in the used market...
Nikon (D700) and Sony (A850) are in around the 2k mark, body only, used...or more
Tough pickin's, A 6x6 TLR or a FF DSLR
Have you thought of a other MF cameras... Mamiya 6, Fuji GW690 II (6x9 RF) , both are 35mm style RF camera
Though not a TLR, may be more versatile if the 5D is too much.
Nikon (D700) and Sony (A850) are in around the 2k mark, body only, used...or more
Tough pickin's, A 6x6 TLR or a FF DSLR
Have you thought of a other MF cameras... Mamiya 6, Fuji GW690 II (6x9 RF) , both are 35mm style RF camera
Though not a TLR, may be more versatile if the 5D is too much.
xxloverxx
Shoot.
I say get a Rollei — if they've lasted this long, they'll last for another few decades. Also, there's a feel about them.
Wcarpenter
Established
I've just recently started using a Rolleiflex, and its certainly a unique and wonderful experience. It's truly an anthropologists camera, as the face remains unobscured. The Planar lens is incredibly sharp and yet still has the old lens feel. Of the two options, the Rollei is certainly the most interesting and for me at least, the most rewarding.
I say, go for the Rollei.
I say, go for the Rollei.
gho
Well-known
I would say, think about what you want now and where you would like to go in future. A Rolleiflex is a standard by its own that gives you not much room for expansion (in terms of different focal length, etc.). On the other hand, it has a very distincitve signature. If you want to explore medium format, there are also the Czech Meopta TLRs that won't cost you a fortune, but are quite good in my opinion, if you manage to get one in good working condition. If you want to know if TLRs are something for you, I would chose this route and upgrade later, if you feel the need.
As for the 5D, I can't say much about it, but I suppose it is a good choice for a professional photographer, who needs a flexible and expandible system. All this comes at a cost, of course.
As for the 5D, I can't say much about it, but I suppose it is a good choice for a professional photographer, who needs a flexible and expandible system. All this comes at a cost, of course.
filmfan
Well-known
Go with the rollei, for it will last a long time and will be memorable to your graduation. The 5D will be obsolete in a few years.
sirius
Well-known
Don't forget to factor in a scanner if you get a rollei...unless you are going to develope/print yourself...with a rollei you are also facing increasingly expensive film and developing costs (commercial processing), unless you do black and white yourself and scan it (as opposed to printing it because you're talking about using the photos for commercial means and they will need digital).
I can help you with comments like that, but in creative matters, you are the only one who can decide what tool give the results you want. Used film camera prices seem pretty stable. You can buy a Rollei and see if you like the whole workflow, if you don't you can sell it and get your 5D.
5D is a great camera, already "obsolete," but I think digital has reached the "good enough" stage and that will give some stability to the usefulness of the tool. (But not to the resale value...)
I can help you with comments like that, but in creative matters, you are the only one who can decide what tool give the results you want. Used film camera prices seem pretty stable. You can buy a Rollei and see if you like the whole workflow, if you don't you can sell it and get your 5D.
5D is a great camera, already "obsolete," but I think digital has reached the "good enough" stage and that will give some stability to the usefulness of the tool. (But not to the resale value...)
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
I'd do the Rollei. 6x6 is my favorite format.
You'd also be making a great decision if you chose a Hasselblad 500 or 501 kit. One just sold here for $750USD.
I remember back about 15 years ago that getting into a Hassy kit was a serious investment, over $3000 easy. Sometimes used deals popped up but rarely. Now that much of that gear has been shelved, it's the perfect time to get into a truly professional kit.
Phil Forrest
You'd also be making a great decision if you chose a Hasselblad 500 or 501 kit. One just sold here for $750USD.
I remember back about 15 years ago that getting into a Hassy kit was a serious investment, over $3000 easy. Sometimes used deals popped up but rarely. Now that much of that gear has been shelved, it's the perfect time to get into a truly professional kit.
Phil Forrest
Kristopher
Established
Go for the Rollei!
My first analog camera was a rolleiflex, I still use it and it is awesome. I recently bought a bran new Hasselblad and I must say that even if the Planar 80mm CFE is one of the best MF lense available, they rollei is as good if not better (no need to clear the mirror of the body.)
A rolleiflex is probably also one of the best camera ever made! Its sturdyness is just AMAZING. I would even dare to say that it is better build than any post M3 Leica too.
Also, there is almost nothing to go wrong with the rollei, as long as the speeds don't stick, and that the lenses are properly matched for focusing everything should be fine for a long long time.
Best,
K
My first analog camera was a rolleiflex, I still use it and it is awesome. I recently bought a bran new Hasselblad and I must say that even if the Planar 80mm CFE is one of the best MF lense available, they rollei is as good if not better (no need to clear the mirror of the body.)
A rolleiflex is probably also one of the best camera ever made! Its sturdyness is just AMAZING. I would even dare to say that it is better build than any post M3 Leica too.
Also, there is almost nothing to go wrong with the rollei, as long as the speeds don't stick, and that the lenses are properly matched for focusing everything should be fine for a long long time.
Best,
K
Armoured
Well-known
Totally different cameras. So my proverbial two cents: 5D would be a 'smarter' choice if you're going to do a lot of photography. I mean a whole lot.
Rollei would be a better gift, even a self-gift. Memorable, will last forever, etc. It's not even a particularly extravagant gift.
Buy the Rollei and save up for the other camera down the road.
Rollei would be a better gift, even a self-gift. Memorable, will last forever, etc. It's not even a particularly extravagant gift.
Buy the Rollei and save up for the other camera down the road.
thegman
Veteran
Don't over think it too much, think about which one you'd like to take out on a shoot, and get that one.
Also, just because you're in Macedonia, don't think you can't order from all over the world...
Also, just because you're in Macedonia, don't think you can't order from all over the world...
Debusti Paolo
Well-known
another vote for rollei
Naumoski
Well-known
Thank you fellas for writing down your opinions.
A rollei defenitely is more memorable and more 'real' present
Looking to other versatile MF systems like Hass, Mamiya etc. it's a good option but that would cost me much more and that would be a more serious step in MF photography that in my reality for now is not needed. A rollei would be like having a Leica and 1 lens and waiting for the magic to expand
I have a Minolta srt 101 and Minolta 7sII, and I enjoy using both cameras (SLR and RF). I like using Srt 101 and 58mm 1.4 rokkor for shooting Live performance on low light and enjoy the struggle of the motion and low light; but I like to go on a beach with 7sII and to feel like the lightest man on the planet and forget about everything - I would like to explore a more deep feelings with using the Rollei.
I thinking more to get the Rollei; I could choose a digital camera anytime and I'll have more FF cameras to choose from soon.
A rollei defenitely is more memorable and more 'real' present
Looking to other versatile MF systems like Hass, Mamiya etc. it's a good option but that would cost me much more and that would be a more serious step in MF photography that in my reality for now is not needed. A rollei would be like having a Leica and 1 lens and waiting for the magic to expand
I have a Minolta srt 101 and Minolta 7sII, and I enjoy using both cameras (SLR and RF). I like using Srt 101 and 58mm 1.4 rokkor for shooting Live performance on low light and enjoy the struggle of the motion and low light; but I like to go on a beach with 7sII and to feel like the lightest man on the planet and forget about everything - I would like to explore a more deep feelings with using the Rollei.
I thinking more to get the Rollei; I could choose a digital camera anytime and I'll have more FF cameras to choose from soon.
uhligfd
Well-known
Ok, here is my experience from this summer, my second summer with a Rolleiflex. My camera of choice had been the Contax G2 with all its lenses: superb for a 35 mm camera, outstanding glass, easy to use etc. This summer I shot about 25 films (12 pics each) with the Rollei, versus about 20 films (36 each ) with the Contax that has won me prizes etc etc, was used used for 2 exhibitions etc.
Out of these around 1000 + film shots I recently enlarged 45 pics. I checked them for artistry, composition, color, impact, technicalities etc , and now I have selected between 11 and 15 as the best of that 2010 lot.
Guess what: 5 of them are Contax pics, the rest (9) are from my 1964 Rollei (double the success rate from around 1/3 of available pics! A factor of around 6 times "better" than the best other camera ... ) with which I have only shot 72 films total during the last 15 months.
So, what do you make out of it.
You are young, digital is for the young. Film is for the old. I have taken photos for 50 years, but the success rate with this old Rollei is amazing to me. I miss the Contax, its impact ... . What is wrong with me and 135 film? Or should I state/admit that something is amazingly right with that old Rollei, MF and film?
Out of these around 1000 + film shots I recently enlarged 45 pics. I checked them for artistry, composition, color, impact, technicalities etc , and now I have selected between 11 and 15 as the best of that 2010 lot.
Guess what: 5 of them are Contax pics, the rest (9) are from my 1964 Rollei (double the success rate from around 1/3 of available pics! A factor of around 6 times "better" than the best other camera ... ) with which I have only shot 72 films total during the last 15 months.
So, what do you make out of it.
You are young, digital is for the young. Film is for the old. I have taken photos for 50 years, but the success rate with this old Rollei is amazing to me. I miss the Contax, its impact ... . What is wrong with me and 135 film? Or should I state/admit that something is amazingly right with that old Rollei, MF and film?
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johannielscom
Snorting silver salts
Best argument here yet, from an emotional point of view. Getting yourself a camera as a graduation present is creating a 'feelgood-moment' as a reward for graduation.
The 5D will lose its financial value much faster, in a few years time you can buy one for little money to complement the Rolleiflex 3.5F.
mfogiel
Veteran
A MF film camera is only making sense if you are dedicated to B&W photography. If you want to shoot colour, forget the film altogether. Plus, even if you want to shoot B&W but have no access to a darkroom, it means that in order to make your MF film show its quality you need at least a Nikon CS 9000 scanner, which I believe will cost you at least 2000-2500 EUR second hand in good condition. My advice would be: if you are a B&W shooter, save up and get a Leica M2, this will last you forever if properly maintained (and will be a truly memorable present), and the dedicated 35mm scanners are much cheaper and plentiful on the second hand market. If you are a colour shoter, get ANY decent digital camera and a good prime lens, without insisting on the full frame. Full frame will only show its advantage on really big prints, you can make fantastic A3 prints with a 6 MP APS-C sensor.
This is a 6x6 Hasselblad shot - 180/4 Sonnar on Astia, scanned on CS 9000:
This is Fuji S3 Pro - a 6MP APS-C camera, shot with Zeiss Planar 85/1.4:
This is Rolleiflex 3.5 F Planar scanned on CS 9000
This is shot on an M4 - almost same as M2, + Super Angulon 21/3.4, scanned on CS 9000:
This is a 6x6 Hasselblad shot - 180/4 Sonnar on Astia, scanned on CS 9000:
This is Fuji S3 Pro - a 6MP APS-C camera, shot with Zeiss Planar 85/1.4:
This is Rolleiflex 3.5 F Planar scanned on CS 9000
This is shot on an M4 - almost same as M2, + Super Angulon 21/3.4, scanned on CS 9000:
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Naumoski
Well-known
Thanx for the advices.
I'm indeed to shoot more B&W on MF ( I wouldn't exclude the colour as well). The scanner you are pointing shows very impressive results, but maybe a descent flatbet scanner (or from the local photo-lab) would do the job right enough at least. Unfortunately I don't have access to darkroom.
Getting another 35mm camera is not my goal or need. My minoltas satisfy me well enough.
I'm indeed to shoot more B&W on MF ( I wouldn't exclude the colour as well). The scanner you are pointing shows very impressive results, but maybe a descent flatbet scanner (or from the local photo-lab) would do the job right enough at least. Unfortunately I don't have access to darkroom.
Getting another 35mm camera is not my goal or need. My minoltas satisfy me well enough.
mfogiel
Veteran
It is the same old story. You can scan MF on a flatbed - the results will be about the same as scanning photos from your Minolta on a dedicated film scanner, and the hassle of MF is immensely bigger than shooting 35mm. I doubt there are any good and reasonably priced labs in the whole of Eastern Europe - they are either totally crap or professional and more expensive than in the west. I would also advise against buying any digital camera second hand - these cameras are worth as much as their warranty, when it is over, you risk that the cost of a major repair will be almost as big as buying a new body. BTW no matter which Minolta you have it is nothing nearly as durable and beautiful as a Leica M. If you lenses are compatible with the Sony cameras, you could buy yourself one of the Sony Alphas.