kbg32
neo-romanticist
This was taken just two weeks before the towers fell. View from DUMBO before gentrification.
I Love Film
Well-known
I live less than two blocks from the WTC site and was present during the attacks. I had to evacuate my home and was almost killed.
Enough is enough. It was a LONG time ago. For my children, who were not born yet, it is ancient history.
I'd say it was a successful attack. They destroyed our civil liberties, bankrupted our country, decimated the military by causing long, worthless wars, changed the face of the country forever.
We spend too much time indulging in maudlin sentiment. It's over, the dead won't come back.
Time to give it a rest.
Enough is enough. It was a LONG time ago. For my children, who were not born yet, it is ancient history.
I'd say it was a successful attack. They destroyed our civil liberties, bankrupted our country, decimated the military by causing long, worthless wars, changed the face of the country forever.
We spend too much time indulging in maudlin sentiment. It's over, the dead won't come back.
Time to give it a rest.
kbg32
neo-romanticist
I was waiting outside Tower 1 when the first plane hit. I lost a friend.
ianstamatic
Well-known
From my rooftop in Crown Heights Brooklyn
daveleo
what?
Actually, 90 countries lost people in that event; 12% of the people killed were not US citizens.
Nonetheless . . . my neighbor plants 3000 (US) flags on his lawn every year for one day . . . .
EDIT: I came back here and deleted my picture because, as usual, the schoolyard bullies showed up and hijacked the thread . . . . (little photo-forum terrorist themselves, huh?)
Nonetheless . . . my neighbor plants 3000 (US) flags on his lawn every year for one day . . . .
EDIT: I came back here and deleted my picture because, as usual, the schoolyard bullies showed up and hijacked the thread . . . . (little photo-forum terrorist themselves, huh?)
tightsqueez
Well-known
Of all the days...
Of all the days...
OF ALL THE DAYS TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT… A DAY OF REMEMBRANCE AND HONOR!! I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU SAY THAT TO SOMEONE AT THE 9/11 MEMORIAL RIGHT NOW.
Of all the days...
OF ALL THE DAYS TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT… A DAY OF REMEMBRANCE AND HONOR!! I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU SAY THAT TO SOMEONE AT THE 9/11 MEMORIAL RIGHT NOW.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
From an outsider's point of view I have no issues here and it's certainly not ancient history IMO.
Down under the sense of disbelief and horror was indescribable ... and it doesn't seem that long a go at my age.
Down under the sense of disbelief and horror was indescribable ... and it doesn't seem that long a go at my age.
I Love Film
Well-known
I am a lifelong New Yorker and I miss the Twin Towers as much as anyone else.
I was also standing right at the base of the WTC during the attacks.
For kids who were not born at that time, yes, it is ancient history, as much as WWII was ancient history to kids born in the 1950's, even though for vets it was as frightening and real as the days it happened.
There's a time for mourning and a time to move on. We don't need all this endless media regurgitation and false sentimentality forever.
And what "honor"? We were caught flat-footed, completely gobsmacked by people we allowed in this country, even permitted the attackers to go to flight school. (there are still thousands of Saudis attending sensitive schools)
And in response, Bush invaded a country which had nothing to do with the attacks. They claimed the "oil" would pay for the war. We spend trillions and got nothing. They were so incompetent, that even if the war was for "oil", we didn't get any.
Not to mention the daily announcements of surveillance on our own citizens, breaches of the Constitution, invasion of privacy, war on photographers, the rise of the police state, you name it, it's happening. And how about the theft of all the money from and the destruction of the middle class?
Yeah, it was a big day of "national honor".
You can yell and scream from Ohio. I'm a New Yorker, and I feel the loss more than anyone else. I'm also not blind.
I was also standing right at the base of the WTC during the attacks.
For kids who were not born at that time, yes, it is ancient history, as much as WWII was ancient history to kids born in the 1950's, even though for vets it was as frightening and real as the days it happened.
There's a time for mourning and a time to move on. We don't need all this endless media regurgitation and false sentimentality forever.
And what "honor"? We were caught flat-footed, completely gobsmacked by people we allowed in this country, even permitted the attackers to go to flight school. (there are still thousands of Saudis attending sensitive schools)
And in response, Bush invaded a country which had nothing to do with the attacks. They claimed the "oil" would pay for the war. We spend trillions and got nothing. They were so incompetent, that even if the war was for "oil", we didn't get any.
Not to mention the daily announcements of surveillance on our own citizens, breaches of the Constitution, invasion of privacy, war on photographers, the rise of the police state, you name it, it's happening. And how about the theft of all the money from and the destruction of the middle class?
Yeah, it was a big day of "national honor".
You can yell and scream from Ohio. I'm a New Yorker, and I feel the loss more than anyone else. I'm also not blind.
Bob Michaels
nobody special
everything deleted as I do not want to be a part of this thread.
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Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
Thanks, I Love Film.
Seriously. We can remember and honor and all that but we do need to move on if only to stop the perpetuation of fear-mongering which continues to erode our civil liberties.
On this day in 2004 I was at Camp Fallujah, 4500 meters from the city center. I had just lost a friend to IDF and had to do the photo investigation after the incident. I wasn't in the mood for patriotic breast beating, nor was anyone out there. A Marine Staff SGT who worked for 1 MARDIV PAO knew me and stuck a camera in my face then asked me to say something about the significance of us being there 3 years after the attacks in 2001. I respectfully declined and then he ordered me to make a statement to which I replied "You're not going to like what I have to say Staff Sergeant but if you're ordering me to make a statement, I will. Nine-eleven 2001 had absolutely nothing to do with why we are here besides the foundation of fear which allowed the incursion of coalition forces into Iraq predicated on all lies."
I lost a lot of friends, not in the attacks (though two did die in the Pentagon attack) but in the conflicts that followed. I still am crossing off names from my caption book of people I was deployed with because they still keep dying. I'm still angry about it all too.
So, yeah, thank you for your candor. Day of remembrance or not, we're still at war 11 years later with the total casualty count of human beings at several hundred thousand.
Here's a shot of a site where a few hundred of them are being buried.
Seriously. We can remember and honor and all that but we do need to move on if only to stop the perpetuation of fear-mongering which continues to erode our civil liberties.
On this day in 2004 I was at Camp Fallujah, 4500 meters from the city center. I had just lost a friend to IDF and had to do the photo investigation after the incident. I wasn't in the mood for patriotic breast beating, nor was anyone out there. A Marine Staff SGT who worked for 1 MARDIV PAO knew me and stuck a camera in my face then asked me to say something about the significance of us being there 3 years after the attacks in 2001. I respectfully declined and then he ordered me to make a statement to which I replied "You're not going to like what I have to say Staff Sergeant but if you're ordering me to make a statement, I will. Nine-eleven 2001 had absolutely nothing to do with why we are here besides the foundation of fear which allowed the incursion of coalition forces into Iraq predicated on all lies."
I lost a lot of friends, not in the attacks (though two did die in the Pentagon attack) but in the conflicts that followed. I still am crossing off names from my caption book of people I was deployed with because they still keep dying. I'm still angry about it all too.
So, yeah, thank you for your candor. Day of remembrance or not, we're still at war 11 years later with the total casualty count of human beings at several hundred thousand.
Here's a shot of a site where a few hundred of them are being buried.
I Love Film
Well-known
I agree with you and your post.
Another monstrous adjunct to the senseless wars we have been fighting are the tens (or hundreds) of thousands of horribly maimed soldiers that will require lifelong care.
Medical science has advanced very far and a huge percentage of men who would have died in earlier wars are saved, but are damaged and mutilated almost beyond belief.
No limbs, blind, faces nothing but masses of scar tissue, massive internal injuries, all these poor young guys are now condemned to lifetimes of pain, loneliness and misery. Living death.
What were these wars for? The people we "saved" (our "allies") seem to delight in shooting our troops on a daily basis.
Would someone like to explain what national interest these wars are for? It is mass insanity.
Another monstrous adjunct to the senseless wars we have been fighting are the tens (or hundreds) of thousands of horribly maimed soldiers that will require lifelong care.
Medical science has advanced very far and a huge percentage of men who would have died in earlier wars are saved, but are damaged and mutilated almost beyond belief.
No limbs, blind, faces nothing but masses of scar tissue, massive internal injuries, all these poor young guys are now condemned to lifetimes of pain, loneliness and misery. Living death.
What were these wars for? The people we "saved" (our "allies") seem to delight in shooting our troops on a daily basis.
Would someone like to explain what national interest these wars are for? It is mass insanity.
Thanks, I Love Film.
Seriously. We can remember and honor and all that but we do need to move on if only to stop the perpetuation of fear-mongering which continues to erode our civil liberties.
On this day in 2004 I was at Camp Fallujah, 4500 meters from the city center. I had just lost a friend to IDF and had to do the photo investigation after the incident. I wasn't in the mood for patriotic breast beating, nor was anyone out there. A Marine Staff SGT who worked for 1 MARDIV PAO knew me and stuck a camera in my face then asked me to say something about the significance of us being there 3 years after the attacks in 2001. I respectfully declined and then he ordered me to make a statement to which I replied "You're not going to like what I have to say Staff Sergeant but if you're ordering me to make a statement, I will. Nine-eleven 2001 had absolutely nothing to do with why we are here besides the foundation of fear which allowed the incursion of coalition forces into Iraq predicated on all lies."
I lost a lot of friends, not in the attacks (though two did die in the Pentagon attack) but in the conflicts that followed. I still am crossing off names from my caption book of people I was deployed with because they still keep dying. I'm still angry about it all too.
So, yeah, thank you for your candor. Day of remembrance or not, we're still at war 11 years later with the total casualty count of human beings at several hundred thousand.
Here's a shot of a site where a few hundred of them are being buried.
Pablito
coco frío
The other September 11th: Sept 11th 1973
The other September 11th: Sept 11th 1973
It was the day the democratically elected socialist government of Salvador Allende was overthrown in Chile by military forces headed by Augusto Pinochet. It was the day Pinochet's forces attacked the national palace in Santiago de Chile with huge force. Allende was said to have committed suicide inside, but many believe he was likely assassinated.
Pinochet was responsible for severe repression of the Chilean people, and the torture of many individuals, including a dear friend of mine who remains permanently disfigured to this day from the torture. And of course there were many, many murders too.
The US involvement with Pinochet is well known.
I have my own close personal ties to the NYC Sept. 11th, but we should not forget what happened in Chile on Sept 11, and the evils that Pinochet's crimes helped facilitate, including Operation Condor (google it).
The other September 11th: Sept 11th 1973
It was the day the democratically elected socialist government of Salvador Allende was overthrown in Chile by military forces headed by Augusto Pinochet. It was the day Pinochet's forces attacked the national palace in Santiago de Chile with huge force. Allende was said to have committed suicide inside, but many believe he was likely assassinated.
Pinochet was responsible for severe repression of the Chilean people, and the torture of many individuals, including a dear friend of mine who remains permanently disfigured to this day from the torture. And of course there were many, many murders too.
The US involvement with Pinochet is well known.
I have my own close personal ties to the NYC Sept. 11th, but we should not forget what happened in Chile on Sept 11, and the evils that Pinochet's crimes helped facilitate, including Operation Condor (google it).
I Love Film
Well-known
Hey, that "Arab Spring" turned out to be a great idea, huh?
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...nghazi-libya-us-consulate-attacked/70000142/1
OK, I'm going to shut up about politics now.
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...nghazi-libya-us-consulate-attacked/70000142/1
OK, I'm going to shut up about politics now.
boomguy57
Well-known
We all have the responsibility to speak out about injustices that happen around us. None of us should be shamed into silence, no matter what the reason. Dissent is patriotic.
The 11th of September is just a day. True, 11 years ago thousands of people died in NYC; what happened was terrible, and I'm sure for the survivors it will be with them for life. However, we do not need a national hand-wringing every year to remind us of what happened. The world did not change that day.
What we got out of those catastrophic attacks were wars thousands of miles from home, killing far more of our citizens than died in NYC, and far more foreign nationals who had no involvement or knowledge of any of it. We have had our civil liberties attacked, and have spent billions of dollars a month for over a decade colonizing portions of the world for no good reason.
The reason this has been memorialized and dragged out was to accomplish a political agenda. Other terrorist attacks--the WTC bombing in the 90s, US embassies across the world, OK City, Beirut barracks, etc--don't have a "day". Most people would struggle to even name approximate dates, even years. We were all whipped up into a frenzy (and allowed ourselves to be) for political purposes. That is all plain as day now, and there is really no way to argue that point, IMO.
With all that said, clearly this was a tragedy for those directly affected. Sadly, as a member of the armed forces for over a decade myself now, I can count myself as one of the affected--and I am from Minnesota, thousands of miles from the attacks. It is patriotic to speak out, and it honors those who were killed or touched personally by the attacks to ensure that their memory is not used for a twisted, political agenda that they did not ask to be spokespeople for.
The 11th of September is just a day. True, 11 years ago thousands of people died in NYC; what happened was terrible, and I'm sure for the survivors it will be with them for life. However, we do not need a national hand-wringing every year to remind us of what happened. The world did not change that day.
What we got out of those catastrophic attacks were wars thousands of miles from home, killing far more of our citizens than died in NYC, and far more foreign nationals who had no involvement or knowledge of any of it. We have had our civil liberties attacked, and have spent billions of dollars a month for over a decade colonizing portions of the world for no good reason.
The reason this has been memorialized and dragged out was to accomplish a political agenda. Other terrorist attacks--the WTC bombing in the 90s, US embassies across the world, OK City, Beirut barracks, etc--don't have a "day". Most people would struggle to even name approximate dates, even years. We were all whipped up into a frenzy (and allowed ourselves to be) for political purposes. That is all plain as day now, and there is really no way to argue that point, IMO.
With all that said, clearly this was a tragedy for those directly affected. Sadly, as a member of the armed forces for over a decade myself now, I can count myself as one of the affected--and I am from Minnesota, thousands of miles from the attacks. It is patriotic to speak out, and it honors those who were killed or touched personally by the attacks to ensure that their memory is not used for a twisted, political agenda that they did not ask to be spokespeople for.
tightsqueez
Well-known
So...
So...
First off, "And what "honor?" I'm sorry but what about all those who DID rise to this awful event. We HONOR all of those police officers, firemen and civilians who became heros in so many ways to help others, some sacrificing their lives. I'm about to get real nasty but don't EVER question me about honor!
Not too sure about your rant on Iraq… What does ANY of this have to do of honoring 9/11? And how many Iraqis do you know? Ever been there? How about Afghanistan? How about them Saudis you speak of?
And you're damned right I'll yell and scream from Ohio. You may be a New Yorker with a sense that your suffering is oh so worse than anyone else's, but it makes you quite un American doing so because a real American doesn't stay a victim forever.
So...
First off, "And what "honor?" I'm sorry but what about all those who DID rise to this awful event. We HONOR all of those police officers, firemen and civilians who became heros in so many ways to help others, some sacrificing their lives. I'm about to get real nasty but don't EVER question me about honor!
Not too sure about your rant on Iraq… What does ANY of this have to do of honoring 9/11? And how many Iraqis do you know? Ever been there? How about Afghanistan? How about them Saudis you speak of?
And you're damned right I'll yell and scream from Ohio. You may be a New Yorker with a sense that your suffering is oh so worse than anyone else's, but it makes you quite un American doing so because a real American doesn't stay a victim forever.
tightsqueez
Well-known
How does something so simple turn into so stupid?
The F'n thread is about remembering 9/11!!!!!!
The F'n thread is about remembering 9/11!!!!!!
boomguy57
Well-known
I think everyone so far has been remembering. Everyone remembers in their own way, and no one should determine for anyone else how to remember anything.
You seem to be quite agitated about this whole thing, and I'm not sure why. It's your business. We all have the right to discuss and debate anything from any viewpoint we please, whatever we may think of it.
Relax.
You seem to be quite agitated about this whole thing, and I'm not sure why. It's your business. We all have the right to discuss and debate anything from any viewpoint we please, whatever we may think of it.
Relax.
Pablito
coco frío
This is an international forum. There was more than one 9 / 11.
Anyway, back to something photographic. Magnum put out an excellent book of the images their photographers shot of the NYC attack. I got two, one for each of my kids. They were born in NYC and we lived very close to the WTC.
Unfortunately, far fewer good photos exist of the 9 / 11 / 73 coup d'etat in Santiago de Chile.
Anyway, back to something photographic. Magnum put out an excellent book of the images their photographers shot of the NYC attack. I got two, one for each of my kids. They were born in NYC and we lived very close to the WTC.
Unfortunately, far fewer good photos exist of the 9 / 11 / 73 coup d'etat in Santiago de Chile.
I Love Film
Well-known
We are remembering it.
What specifically would you like to remember? I was there, I remember it distinctly, every minute of it. I remember feeling the ground shake as the towers collapsed, choking on the dust and smoke. The bodies thudding on the sidewalk? The panic? I remember three friends dead in the Towers.
Here's photos I took of the Towers burning, the ash settling blocks away, and the empty hole years later.
What do you suggest we remember? Maybe put 3000 American flags (made in China) on your lawn?
p, li { white-space: pre-wrap; }
What specifically would you like to remember? I was there, I remember it distinctly, every minute of it. I remember feeling the ground shake as the towers collapsed, choking on the dust and smoke. The bodies thudding on the sidewalk? The panic? I remember three friends dead in the Towers.
Here's photos I took of the Towers burning, the ash settling blocks away, and the empty hole years later.
What do you suggest we remember? Maybe put 3000 American flags (made in China) on your lawn?
p, li { white-space: pre-wrap; }
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
The cool thing about the United States of America and being a citizen here, or even a person visiting this country, is that we all have the right, opportunity and responsibility to actually speak our minds, regardless of race, religious belief, political affiliation, gender identity, sexual preference, hair color, bad breath, whatever.
A part of that is that a few of us have served and still serve in forces where we are willing to both kill and possibly die for those principles that give you the right to yell at people you disagree with. But you also must give them a voice too or your honor is thrown away and we're left with nothing but blind, ill-educated "patriotism."
Phil Forrest