Finally got my Autocord !!

[pb908]

from the bay, with broken focus lever and missing focus scale. but it has mint optic and no issue on the shutter.not bad considering the price ($50). this is the RG version 2, with self timer.

after cleaning the lens helicoid and applying new grease,the focus lever is moving smooth, optic/miror/focus screen has been cleaned up nicely (just dust). i drill a hole in the old focus lever and install a PCB spacer, works well so far (as focus lever is so light/smooth)

now i am checking it with a new film, something weird is that i need to load a real film to test the frame counter mechanism, as the frame counter is in top spool area while the winding gear is in the bottom spool area. i can't test it with empty film spool, different than a rollei/yashica/mamiya (the winding gear is on the spool being detected by frame counter)
i hope my test roll will come out fine.

so far, comparing A-Cord (autocord) to a yashica 12 or Mamiya C330:
- build quality, A-Cord is way stronger/solid than yashica, but Mamiya C330 is the best !
- weight, A-Cord vs yashica is almost the same, but way lighter to a C330 which is the beast !
- film flatness, C330 and A-cord wins ! Yashica and Rollei will suffer for it
- Cocking indicator exist on my A-cord, Yashica, C330 don't have it
- I can do multiple exposure with A-cord and C330, yashica ? i don't think so. Rollei ?
- Cocking lever in A-cord feels strong and not wiggle, yashica is the weakest/filmsier, for C330, i can say on par with A-Cord
- Focusing screen brightness C330 > Yashica > A-cord, maybe due to f3.2 viewfing lens vs f2.8 on Mamiya and yashica.
- Optical quality, mamiya great, yashica suffers from flare issue (not a mint optic), i hope autocord can be at the same level with mamiya, or outclass it. test roll not finished yet.

so bottom line, mamiya is great machine, Autocord has bigger advantage over yashica, but until i can see the result of the lens i'll not sell my C330 set.

few question i have in mind :
1. does all version of autocord have self timer? according to http://www.wctatel.net/web/crye/a-cord.htm only 2 models having self timer (Optiper MVL). anyone can confirm this for the other type of shutter (Optiper MVX, Seikosha, or Citizen MVL) ?
2. i read somewhere that the older Chiyoko Rokkor have 10-11 aperture blade, mine with Minolta Rokkor lens have 8 blade. may i know which shutter have the 10-11 blades ?

thanks for all reply.

 

[wallace]

Congratulations!
My (late) Autocord with Citizen shutter has the self timer.
By the way: The Rolleicords can do multiple exposure. (V, Va,Vb at least)

 

[Shutterspark]

Congrats!

The Autocord comes with my favourite MF Tessar incarnation, automatically earning it a spot as one of my most used cameras. It has a distinctly different look than the non-tessar 5 element 80mm on Mamiyas, with different colours and less even sharpness distribution, so I wouldn't get rid of it just yet.

I think the self timers are only present in the Optiper/Citizen MVL models, but I don't remember. There are many more variations than there are listed on that site, especially when it comes to the domestic models.

The Optiper MX / Seikosha MX shutter and earlier models have a 10 bladed aperture (so that includes MXV and MXS). The Chiyoko/Minolta branding isn't related, as they weren't terribly consistent when changing from the former name to the latter.

 

[Brian Legge]

Sounds like you got an excellent deal on yours.

I purchased one locally that was in great shape with the exception of the lever which was snapped off at the bottom of the front standard; nothing of it left I could salvage. It was about the same price as yours though.

I ended up sending it to Karl Bryan and couldn't be happier with the results. I think it was something like 4 or 5 days from the time I mailed it to the day it arrived back. And at a fantastic price.

Its a great camera! Enjoy!

 

[pakeha]

Congrads, and I`m impressed with your solution to the broken focus lever. What ever works will do the job.
Take the veiwfinder off and give screen and mirror a clean, this may help a bit.Mine has just come back from a CLA and is much improved.Though mine is a bit of a hybrid.I have a Bronica eye level finder and a hasselblad split focus screen attached - very easy to do and with my eyesight a bit easier for me to focus.

 

[pb908]

Thanks all for the reply,
so now at least 2 shutter type have been confirmed to have self timer :
- Citizen MVL (the latest) ==> thanks to Wallace.
- Optiper MVL

@Brian Legge, i have heard good news of Karl Bryan. but i am in the other part of the world, so CLA-ing my self is a chalenging project for me.

@pakeha, yes, i have opened the focussing mirror dan clean the mirror/focussing screen. so far still good so no need to get newer screen. i wonder if the screen from Mamiya can be use here, it looks so da*m good seeing Mamiya screen while focusing C330.

will share the picture later next week.

 

[Brian Legge]

Oh, absolutely, I didn't intend that as a recommendation. The distance does make it much less practical.

I"m more impressed by your ability to fix it yourself as I decided to use someone else. I have my share of project cameras but wasn't confident in my ability to rebuild the focus lever.

 

[jwicaksana]

Good find, I wish I possess the technical ability to dismantle my cameras like you did.

 

[Dan Daniel]

You are going to have light leaks if you didn't plug the small holes where the focus scale screws in place. A hole at each side of the focus lever travel. These holes were drilled through to the film chamber- common practice for machining as it is cleaner and quicker than bottom-tapping. You'll find through-holes like this in film chambers all the time.

 

[pb908]

Quick update after browsing the bay picture :
- Optiper MXS, SN 140xxx (2nd gen autocord mxs ?), self timer exist, no cocking indicator
- Seikosha MX, SN 166xxx with sync M-F-X, no self timer, cocking indicator exist
- Seikosha MX, SN unknown, with sync M-F-X and selenium meter, no self timer, cocking indicator exist
- Optiper MXS, SN 190xxx with sync M-F-X, no self timer, cocking indicator exist
- Optiper MVL (mine) SN 271xxx, selftimer exist, cocking indicator exist
- Citizen MVL (the latest autocord) ==> thanks to Wallace.

short conclusion :
- all autocord M-F-X shutter have no self timer, i wonder what M-F-X stand for, maybe the self timer is set in one of them (M or F ?)
- all autocord after the 1st gen of autocord mxs have cocking indicator.
- my assumption (i can only verify few of them), all chiyoko rokkor have 10blades aperture, all minolta rokkor have 8 blade aperture, CMIIW.

any idea if the conclusion are right/wrong?

 

[pb908]

You are going to have light leaks if you didn't plug the small holes where the focus scale screws in place. A hole at each side of the focus lever travel. These holes were drilled through to the film chamber- common practice for machining as it is cleaner and quicker than bottom-tapping. You'll find through-holes like this in film chambers all the time.

thanks Dan,
i just realized after re-read your post. i tried to push a small screw driver into the focus scale screw hole. it went deep enough which i believe already touching the film spool. lucky i just start the film test. I believe I still have few frames saved by the unrolled film. problem solved with 2 small screws from junk fix lens RF !

 

[Dan Daniel]

M-F-X is actually a two-way lever, M or X, best as I can tell. 'F' stands for Flash? Meaning that the area of the lever is for Flash sync setting, and the choices are either M sync or X sync.

Having been 'under the hood' on a few of these, the actual lever sticking out is a tab on a ring that lies under the lens. Moving it back and forth simply rotates this ring and moves a lever on the shutter body from one side to another. There is no self-timer escapement in these shutters.

Those focus plate holes drove me crazy before I figured out what was going on. I didn't realize that they were needed and went through four rolls of film trying to track down and seal light leaks on an Autocord I was overhauling.

 

[graywolf]

M-F-X is actually a two-way lever, M or X, best as I can tell. 'F' stands for Flash? Meaning that the area of the lever is for Flash sync setting, and the choices are either M sync or X sync.

Having been 'under the hood' on a few of these, the actual lever sticking out is a tab on a ring that lies under the lens. Moving it back and forth simply rotates this ring and moves a lever on the shutter body from one side to another. There is no self-timer escapement in these shutters.

Those focus plate holes drove me crazy before I figured out what was going on. I didn't realize that they were needed and went through four rolls of film trying to track down and seal light leaks on an Autocord I was overhauling.

Actually they stand for
Medium Sync
Fast Sync
X Sync

M is about 20ms delay, F about 6ms delay, and X no delay. I seem to remember that #6 flashbulbs, and others, used F Sync.

 

[Dan Daniel]

Thnaks for the correction, Tom. I tend to ignore flash sync levers on cameras like this until I can get inside and remove them. I only remember the lever on the shutter block itself having two stops- each end of travel. I don't know if the F setting is a click stop on the shutter, or a mid-position setting that is set by the external switch.

 

[TLRgraphy]

My autocord also got stuck focus... who can save it.......!

 

[Uncle Fester]

My autocord also got stuck focus... who can save it.......!

If you do not mind shipping your camera to the U.S., Karl Bryan is THE man when it comes to Autocord repair. He repaired my Autocord a few months ago, and did a beautiful job. Price was very reasonable and the turnaround time was very fast.

 

[oftheherd]

I seem to have missed this thread before. I don't see where anyone answered you question on multi-exposure with the Yashica and Rollei. On the Rollei I have there is a ring around the wind/film transport crank. It has serations to impove your grip, and when moved (I forget if it has to be held or just moved once) will allow the crank to be rotated around to cock the shutter, but not advance the fiim. I think the Yashica MAT 124 G also had that, but I am not sure, and haven't had one for over 35 years.

Sounds like you got a good deal on the A-cord and have a fine camera.

 

[pb908]

thanks oftheherd.

i just play with Autocord multiple exposure button (slider).
i was wondering how it work, then finally find out when i load film into the camera.

with film, normal cocking condition will be winding the cocking lever to the front (clockwise) until it stop, then wind backward until it stop on the rest area.
once i take picture, then the multiexposure button can be slide counterclockwise. at the same time the lock holding the cocking lever is free backward so i can turn it again counterclockwise one rotation until it stop in rest area, i can do it again and again as many as i want.

without film, i rarely wind backward until it stop (mostly wind forward to cock the shutter and release the shutter, wind forward, release the shutter, and so on) so i was under impression that my multiple exposure button is not working. in reality i was not even winding in complete sequence.

 

[one90guy]

The Autocord looks a lot like my Ricoh, I am happy with results and enjoy using it. I had to expose a roll last year trying to figure out a Zeiss.

 

[Dan Daniel]

thanks oftheherd.

i just play with Autocord multiple exposure button (slider).
i was wondering how it work, then finally find out when i load film into the camera.

with film, normal cocking condition will be winding the cocking lever to the front (clockwise) until it stop, then wind backward until it stop on the rest area.
once i take picture, then the multiexposure button can be slide counterclockwise. at the same time the lock holding the cocking lever is free backward so i can turn it again counterclockwise one rotation until it stop in rest area, i can do it again and again as many as i want.

without film, i rarely wind backward until it stop (mostly wind forward to cock the shutter and release the shutter, wind forward, release the shutter, and so on) so i was under impression that my multiple exposure button is not working. in reality i was not even winding in complete sequence.

The real value of the double exposure option on early Autocords is the ability to get to or from 1/500 (or 1/400?) shutter speed. Cover the lens, fire the shutter, change the shutter speed, THEN re-cock the shutter with the double-exposure system.