dkreindler
Established
My foto username is also dkreindler, if anyone would like to follow me
The rise and fall of Instagram (?)
- Thread starter p.giannakis
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bulevardi
Well-known
Ok, still unavailable on my phone here though... Perhaps later it will.Should be available after release in February as the FotoApp.
There a link on their website to the Google Play store:
Foto
fotoapp.co
But I can open it on the computer with your link.
I see they're going to make a desktop version too, seems promising.
However, there's too much choice out there in those photo sharing apps nowadays.
We have Flickr, 500px, Glass, ... Foto app, Instagram, Pixelfed, Flashes coming soon...
It's getting too shattered, or you have to post on 10 apps simultaneously to reach your total audience.
There should only be one photo app available worldwide, and one profile app aswel, all linked to your identity card, so no one can post under a fake profile or user.
DownUnder
Vamoosed (for a while)
Well written, but - too much social engineering for my liking here.
We have room for many photo apps. Think - different strokes for different folks.
The obvious way to go is research and think, then pick and choose.
And remember, none are perfect.
bulevardi
Well-known
Well, that's exactly what I want to prevent...
Why is it that one people is allowed to have multiple personalities.
I have a colleague who claims to have 8 different profiles on Instagram, she uses this to appear different, to have different opinions, to spy on ex-lovers, ...... some use it for phishing or harm others.
And yes, you can do that on non-commercial apps like Fediverse.
What if an official democratic authority is involved (like governmental) which only allows one user per person per app, linked to your ID. Or if you're using the app for your company, it's linked to your registered company/tax number or so.
In this case you can avoid social engineering.
JohnGellings
Well-known
I followed you: @JohnGellings
Mos6502
Well-known
Interesting to see this thread still going. Recently decided to deshittify my online presence by deleting my facebook account and my twitter account, two poorly designed sites/apps I've always hated, and only used because I was compelled to by peer pressure. With so many people jumping ship it was nice to no longer have any reason for remaining on either of them.
I've stated before that flickr feels like the "old internet", and a year ago I got on Bluesky, which also feels like the old internet thanks to a lack of algorithms only feeding me what a giant corporation wants me to see (to be fair, Bluesky does have a rudimentary algorithm driven feed, but its use is optional, and they recently added a "trending" topics list, which thankfully is also optional, and which I promptly deleted from my account). Which brings me to this: a few days ago one of my favorite youtube presenters made a very interesting video on the topic of algorithms and social media:
The "old internet" was filled with curious (and often also productive, creative) people, all trying to see what they could find or do, or make work online. The new internet, controlled by a handful of corporate dullards and dimwits, caters to passive audiences who want a constant stream of content which they never have to apply their own thoughts to, and which they'll forget completely in a day or two, unless an algorithm keeps bringing it in front of them. This is a large part of why instagram is so bad, aside from being incredibly ugly, and having a terrible UI. I can go on flickr, and in seconds click back through favorite images that are a decade old. Instagram, perhaps it's different now, but last time I tried using that site, faving images meant nothing. There was no easy way to look at images you liked after you liked them. Instagram farmed their clicks and nothing else mattered to them beyond that. And if you didn't click enough stuff, don't worry, they'll find stuff to show you so you don't even have to make friends or follow anybody you're actually interested in!
I've stated before that flickr feels like the "old internet", and a year ago I got on Bluesky, which also feels like the old internet thanks to a lack of algorithms only feeding me what a giant corporation wants me to see (to be fair, Bluesky does have a rudimentary algorithm driven feed, but its use is optional, and they recently added a "trending" topics list, which thankfully is also optional, and which I promptly deleted from my account). Which brings me to this: a few days ago one of my favorite youtube presenters made a very interesting video on the topic of algorithms and social media:
The "old internet" was filled with curious (and often also productive, creative) people, all trying to see what they could find or do, or make work online. The new internet, controlled by a handful of corporate dullards and dimwits, caters to passive audiences who want a constant stream of content which they never have to apply their own thoughts to, and which they'll forget completely in a day or two, unless an algorithm keeps bringing it in front of them. This is a large part of why instagram is so bad, aside from being incredibly ugly, and having a terrible UI. I can go on flickr, and in seconds click back through favorite images that are a decade old. Instagram, perhaps it's different now, but last time I tried using that site, faving images meant nothing. There was no easy way to look at images you liked after you liked them. Instagram farmed their clicks and nothing else mattered to them beyond that. And if you didn't click enough stuff, don't worry, they'll find stuff to show you so you don't even have to make friends or follow anybody you're actually interested in!
Dogman
Veteran
How does she keep up with who she is from moment to moment? This is taking multiple personality disorder to a new--cyber--level.
I'm "old" internet. Maybe "pre-old" internet. I'm here and on Flickr. I used to be on a couple of other photo forums but I've not kept up with them in some time--RFF is about the max my brain can handle. There are three total blogs I read often. I window shop and read the news--mostly Drudge and The New York Times. I download books and music. I seldom use my phone for internet browsing--my eyes are too damn bad. Honestly, I find about 99% of what I see online is boring, crass, juvenile and incredibly stupid.
Being retired, I have a lot of spare time. I prefer to use it napping. It's more productive.
........................................
bulevardi
Well-known
All interesting insights here.
Talking about instagram... The things with social media, smartphones and internet, it has both advantages and disadvantages. Technologies can be time-saving and useful, but aswel time-consuming and harmful, as it wires our brain the bad way, as some are very addictive.
We walk into it with open eyes and don't directly see the negative parts.
I came across a few books about this topic, about how digital capitalism created the mental health crisis.
* Stolen Focus: why you can't pay attention - Johann Hari
* How to break up with your phone - Catherine Price
* An Anxious Generation: how the great rewiring of childhood cause... -Jonathan Haidt
* Essentialism: the disciplined pursuit of less - Greg McKeown
* Dopamine Detox: A Short Guide to Remove Distractions and Get Your Brain - Thibaut Meurisse
All these are very interesting and I'm quite willing to read it, but from what I've read about it in the meantime, the reviews, the videos, TED talks, ... I think I know it by now. It's all been summarized and explained before.
And then reading hundreds of pages of books is also a waste of time. Valuable time, and filling it meaningfully, is exactly what it's all about.
Unless someone recommends these (or other) books for other reasons?
Talking about instagram... The things with social media, smartphones and internet, it has both advantages and disadvantages. Technologies can be time-saving and useful, but aswel time-consuming and harmful, as it wires our brain the bad way, as some are very addictive.
We walk into it with open eyes and don't directly see the negative parts.
I came across a few books about this topic, about how digital capitalism created the mental health crisis.
* Stolen Focus: why you can't pay attention - Johann Hari
* How to break up with your phone - Catherine Price
* An Anxious Generation: how the great rewiring of childhood cause... -Jonathan Haidt
* Essentialism: the disciplined pursuit of less - Greg McKeown
* Dopamine Detox: A Short Guide to Remove Distractions and Get Your Brain - Thibaut Meurisse
All these are very interesting and I'm quite willing to read it, but from what I've read about it in the meantime, the reviews, the videos, TED talks, ... I think I know it by now. It's all been summarized and explained before.
And then reading hundreds of pages of books is also a waste of time. Valuable time, and filling it meaningfully, is exactly what it's all about.
Unless someone recommends these (or other) books for other reasons?
Coldkennels
Barnack-toting Brit.
I've been away from RFF for a couple of weeks due to work commitments, and I'm glad to see @Disappointed_Horse has been pushing for Mastodon in my absence.
I've dipped in on Bluesky for work and see absolutely no reason to throw my lot in there. All that achieves is replacing one corporate space with another; you don't own your space there, you don't have any say in your experience there, and you have no influence in how it develops in the future. The best analogy I can think of is trading in your Windows PC for a Mac; sure, it's better, that's without question - but you're still playing in someone else's yard. And I say this as a Mac user!
Mastodon is more like Linux (and, in fact, there's a lot of Linux users there). You can throw your hat in with a commonly used instance and have a fuss-free existence (mastodon.social is probably the Linux Mint of the Fediverse world, for instance), you can find a really niche instance to suit whatever your specific use case is, or you can go DIY and control every single aspect of your account. Hell, you don't even need to use Mastodon; you can go and play with Pixelfed, or Friendica, or micro.blog, or anything else that uses the Activity Pub protocol, and they'll all play nice with each other. I, as a Mastodon user, can pick up my friend's posts from his micro.blog, and I am followed by and get comments from people on Pixelfed all the time. It is, frankly, great.
But, as Alec from Technology Connections pointed out in the video @Mos6502 posted above, the freedom Mastodon gives you is also what is most alienating to people today. There is no algorithm pushing posts on you - but there's also no algorithm pushing your posts on other people. What this means is you get out of the Fediverse what you put in. Follow a hashtag or two, use a couple of precisely-targeted hashtags (you don't need twenty at the end of every post!), and interact with people. Eventually your network will grow organically. My feed is now an absolute joy to flick through, with no ads, suggested posts, or ragebait. It's the only social media account I've ever had anywhere that I can dip into while the kettle boils and see something genuinely interesting before the kettle's done without fail, and that has to mean something.
I've dipped in on Bluesky for work and see absolutely no reason to throw my lot in there. All that achieves is replacing one corporate space with another; you don't own your space there, you don't have any say in your experience there, and you have no influence in how it develops in the future. The best analogy I can think of is trading in your Windows PC for a Mac; sure, it's better, that's without question - but you're still playing in someone else's yard. And I say this as a Mac user!
Mastodon is more like Linux (and, in fact, there's a lot of Linux users there). You can throw your hat in with a commonly used instance and have a fuss-free existence (mastodon.social is probably the Linux Mint of the Fediverse world, for instance), you can find a really niche instance to suit whatever your specific use case is, or you can go DIY and control every single aspect of your account. Hell, you don't even need to use Mastodon; you can go and play with Pixelfed, or Friendica, or micro.blog, or anything else that uses the Activity Pub protocol, and they'll all play nice with each other. I, as a Mastodon user, can pick up my friend's posts from his micro.blog, and I am followed by and get comments from people on Pixelfed all the time. It is, frankly, great.
But, as Alec from Technology Connections pointed out in the video @Mos6502 posted above, the freedom Mastodon gives you is also what is most alienating to people today. There is no algorithm pushing posts on you - but there's also no algorithm pushing your posts on other people. What this means is you get out of the Fediverse what you put in. Follow a hashtag or two, use a couple of precisely-targeted hashtags (you don't need twenty at the end of every post!), and interact with people. Eventually your network will grow organically. My feed is now an absolute joy to flick through, with no ads, suggested posts, or ragebait. It's the only social media account I've ever had anywhere that I can dip into while the kettle boils and see something genuinely interesting before the kettle's done without fail, and that has to mean something.
Archiver
Veteran
That's big no because there is a huge downside to this kind of locked in identification. Online anonymity gives safety and a voice to people who would need it. There's nothing to stop an authoritarian government going after those who they claim are dissidents. Teenagers, minorities and other vulnerable people can voice their opinions without fear of harassment by others. There is potential for abuse, but the answer is not in overreaching government regulations and laws. We all have choices in how we conduct and protect ourselves online.
bulevardi
Well-known
Nice that you made the comparison with Linux Mint. I'm a Mint user for over 10 years already...
I wished it was getting more popular, or that Mastodon was more popular.
I've been uploading pictures for 7 weeks now to Pixelfed and BlueSky and Mastodon, all through Fedica - which is a very handy way of scheduling posts. ( I did that while doing an instagram detox in february - to see what the alternative could offer me )
Despite that I get likes on the pictures, I've got to admit there is no real connection or interaction like I experienced with Instagram.
Not even a comment, it seems too much for the users there...
Ok, Bluesky and Mastodon are more an X alternative, and more for discussions and not for pictures... So I can't blame them as they're actually not the right platform to share photography. (althought a lot of people do) I tried beginning a textual discussion there, but without any reply... where I would directly get replies if I did that same post on X..... So I removed the post again.
But Pixelfed... it's too static. I upload there... like I would upload photos on the cloud somewhere. But that's it.
Perhaps I'll stop with that for the lack of real interactions.
When logging back in to IG, I directly got into chat with my friends again... friends that don't take the step over to Pixelfed, and I understand them.
Wondering what Flashes will bring... If I'm still motivated to try it.
Social media makes you less creative:
wlewisiii
Veteran
I use #photography on bluesky. I don't get a lot of notice but I get more than I ever did on Insta. Good enough for me.
I tried the extinct elephant. Even though I've been a unix & lisp user since 1985, I don't care for it. It reminds me of the worst aspects of rms.
I tried the extinct elephant. Even though I've been a unix & lisp user since 1985, I don't care for it. It reminds me of the worst aspects of rms.
Coldkennels
Barnack-toting Brit.
You're right, there does seem to be a different culture on Mastodon compared to the reply/comment-heavy nature of Instagram. I think a part of that will be down to the reduced userbase (StatsUp reports 2 billion monthly active users for Instagram - a number I'd doubt, as Meta have been fiddling with their reports of late - compared to Mastodon's 1.5m), but also a difference in culture. The average Instagram user, I feel, is much more inclined to self-importance, and would be the class clown or jock in a 1980s high school movie. Mastodon users would be the quiet dorks in the corner who keep to themselves but come out on top at the end.
As a result, what I tend to find on Mastodon is that responding to people's posts - rather than expecting responses to your own as a "newbie" - tends to start conversation that then becomes reciprocal down the line. Looking at my Mentions feed today, I've got ongoing conversations with six or seven folks that have become something of my core Mastodon "circle", plus a couple of relative strangers. Most of my photo posts just get "favourites" and "boosts", but sometimes my friends will reply to them if there's something of note (but rarely "wow, that looks nice" - it's typically something more substantive than that).
Out of interest, what didn't you like about it? The only UNIX-related RMS I can think of is Richard Stallman, so I'm not sure what you're referring to.
Disappointed_Horse
Well-known
Whatever you think about Stallman as an individual, he's been right about a lot of things that have led us to the current technological dystopia that we're now living in.
Michael Markey
Veteran
Reading this thread has been somewhat of a revelation to me.
What I mean by that is that I`ve never thought of social media in the way its been described here or had the expectations of it the others seem to have.
I joined Flickr back when I joined this site only because that was the only way you could post stuff here.
I`ve stayed with it ever since.
The only other site I use is Instagram and there I find a greater variety of work than I do on Flickr but the downside is that the adverts are a pain .
To be brutally honest I have to make an effort to post on any of them.
What I mean by that is that I`ve never thought of social media in the way its been described here or had the expectations of it the others seem to have.
I joined Flickr back when I joined this site only because that was the only way you could post stuff here.
I`ve stayed with it ever since.
The only other site I use is Instagram and there I find a greater variety of work than I do on Flickr but the downside is that the adverts are a pain .
To be brutally honest I have to make an effort to post on any of them.
Michael Markey
Veteran
PS I probably post the most on FB
The majority of my output is for friends and social groups of which I belong to.
The majority of my output is for friends and social groups of which I belong to.
aw614
Well-known
Im on foto, same username as here. I need to upload more. The app still feels kind of buggy, but I do need to use it more often.
wlewisiii
Veteran
The ego of purity ponies thinking that they are the only way, the light side of the force, and that only they can bring "justice." Or whatever they think is their end goal today until they go off on another tangent tomorrow because like HURD, it'll never be something fully usable.
Meanwhile due to the the lack of central organization the perverts and Not-Sees have their Mastodon servers quite happily. In that, it reflects RMS quite accurately, unfortunately.
I'll continue to pass. Nothing is ever perfect but B'sky works acceptably well for me at the present. I'll stop using it if it changes as I have done previously.
bulevardi
Well-known
Currently shooting a roll on a Lomo LC-A since a week or so... It's been years since I'm doing analog again.
I just discovered I still have a "Lomohome" somewhere on the Lomography website.
I've been doing shooting with these cams since 2001 and maintained a bit a lomohome the years after.
I didn't visit anymore the last eh... 20 years I guess, but I can still log in. I'm going to clean it up there.
I see that community is still very alive and active. Perhaps a good place to upload the results of my roll and continue slower photography over there.
I just discovered I still have a "Lomohome" somewhere on the Lomography website.
I've been doing shooting with these cams since 2001 and maintained a bit a lomohome the years after.
I didn't visit anymore the last eh... 20 years I guess, but I can still log in. I'm going to clean it up there.
I see that community is still very alive and active. Perhaps a good place to upload the results of my roll and continue slower photography over there.
p.giannakis
Pan Giannakis
Oh yes they would.
Actually they sell their accounts. I very often find myself following accounts selling cloths or tools or services. I never followed them in the first place. They just sell their accounts with all the followers.
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