3.5 Planar on Rollei F front cell question

[x-ray]

Can anyone tell me if the front cell / grouping of the 5 element Planar on the 3.5F is a sealed cell? Can it be disassembled for cleaning? A service tech said they're sealed but I'm not sure I trust what he says.

Also I e read the front assembly has to be removed to remove the cell from the shutter. I've seen a tech use a cup shaped rubber stopper to remove beauty rings. Actually I use a rubber stopper to remove the front group from a Rolleicord V. The Planar front element protrudes farther out than a Xenar though. I was thinking of trying to remove the group with a crutch tip but wanted your thoughts. I don't want to disassemble the front of the camera and if it's a sealed group there's no reason to mess with it.

Thanks!
Don

 

[papaki]

O.k. Got the lens group in front of the shutter out. The first element comes off with the name ring. the rest of the group is in a tube that unscrews from its base via two tabs, done with a spanner.
I have cleaned the fog and luckily the fungi on the front face of the second element. There is a spot that seems the fungus has etched on the lens, but it is o.k., I am happy with that. No other problems further in.

 

[x-ray]

O.k. Got the lens group in front of the shutter out. The first element comes off with the name ring. the rest of the group is in a tube that unscrews from its base via two tabs, done with a spanner.
I have cleaned the fog and luckily the fungi on the front face of the second element. There is a spot that seems the fungus has etched on the lens, but it is o.k., I am happy with that. No other problems further in.

Thanks for the info. Exactly what I was hoping.

 

[papaki]

Thanks for the info. Exactly what I was hoping.

And here is a surprise! I have been to a friend of mine yesterday and he has a 3.5F with a Planar.
He was working on it, trying to CLA it and something completely different. He removed the front face of the camera. Then he unscrewed the entire lens block in front of the shutter, and then a small setting screw on the side of the block.
That splits its in two parts where the elements can be easilly removed with spanners.

 

[x-ray]

Thanks again for this info.

Are you aware there are two different versions of the Planar. I think it was late in the F series that Zeiss / Rollei went from a 5 element to a 6 element Planar. This probably explains the difference. My camera has the 5 element.

I'll post the serial number where the lens changed later. It would be interesting to know which lens both of you have.

Last night I ordered some rubber grippers to remove the beauty ring. Hopefully I can access the front of the second element without taking the front of the camera off.

If I do have to remove the front, I'm not sure how to get the self timer lever off. I don't see any screw to to loosen it. Some have a leather Dot over a set screw in the center of the timer, mine doesn't.

My 3.5F is a type III with the 5 element Planar. I believe it was late in the type III that it went to 6 elements and all type IV have the 6 element.

 

[x-ray]

Looks like the Planar went from 5 to 6 elements around number 2753xxx. My 3.5F is 2294xxx which is 5 element.

These are body numbers not lens numbers.

 

[papaki]

So yours must be the same as mine 2231xxx, a 5 element Plannar.
He shown me how to take off the front plate. You set the shutter at 1/500 and the apperture at F/22, you remove the retention ring of the flash shocket and its lever, the four screws under the leather, and you lift the plate. Nothing else needs to be removed unscrewed. The self timer goes with the plate.

 

[x-ray]

So yours must be the same as mine 2231xxx, a 5 element Plannar.
He shown me how to take off the front plate. You set the shutter at 1/500 and the apperture at F/22, you remove the retention ring of the flash shocket and its lever, the four screws under the leather, and you lift the plate. Nothing else needs to be removed unscrewed. The self timer goes with the plate.

Really appreciate the help!

Sounds like yours is a 5 element too. I also have a 2.8D with a Xenotar and while it's a fine lens I think the 3.5 Planar is even better. I'll probably wind up selling the D at some point.

I've read several theories why the Planar went from 5 to 6 elements. Also about the same time the 3.5 Xenotar went from 5 to 6. One theory which I think was likely was the 2 cemented elements were easier and cheaper to produce than one element with a high degree of curvature. Another was that the 6th element was actually a warming filter. Supposedly this was to make the color film of the day look more neutral. ?? I question that theory. Also some say it was to improve corner sharpness. Possible but the corners are really sharp on my copy. It's possible that making that single highly curved element in one piece was more difficult which could have lead to less consistent lens to lens performance. Again just theory, perhaps two cemented elements with each having a flat surface could have been easier to make and made for more consistent performance. Just theory though. In any case the 5 element Planar is outstanding.

 

[f16sunshine]

I have always understood that the 6 element was less expensive to produce and rolleiflex was in trouble with slumping sales and costs to manufacture at that time.
It's only years later now that folks seek the 6 element model.
No one really cared previously. Sort of like bokeh 😀

 

[papaki]

I had a look at that double element of the 6 piece Planar. The 5 element planar might be more sought after due to that single curvy thing being not prone to separation issues as that double element could be.

 

[x-ray]

Thats possible. I don't think there's any advantage optically of one over the other. At leas nothing I'm going to worry about.

Your info has been a big help. As soon as my grippers get here I'll remove and clean the front cell.

Andy, that's reasonable. Usually changes are motivated by cost savings.

 

[papaki]

I have tried again with mine by opening the front panel to clean and lubricate the lever that actuates the shutter as the shutter button returns after each shot a bit slowly.
I have removed again the name plate, no setting screws. Just unscrew it and the front element comes off. Worth noting is that it was easier to take off that ring with the front plate removed. If you cannot get a grip on it and remove it, let me know and I will detail with pictures the front plate removal.