50 2.8 Elmar M vs 50 Summicron

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ktmrider

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I own the latest version of the 50 Summicron but there is a really nice collapseable 50 Elmar at KEH. I usually travel with a 35/90 combo but think the Elmar might be the ultimate lens to go on a single body/lens trip.

So how does the Elmar compare to the Cron? Anyone have any negative comments about the Elmar besides it being a stop slower?
 
Its sharper, has WAY more contrast and looks completely totally different. If you have used tessar lenses before, you'll immediately recognize the look of the Elmar. You get a BLACK from this lens... Stopped down its also totally 3-d which rarely gets commented upon.
 
I would say that the two current Summicrons I have used were sharper than my Elmar-M, in fact that was one of my problems with the Summicrons - they were painfully sharp - in a way that the 50/1.4 ASPH is not. As well as the Tessar look, I find the Elmar-M renders colors a little on the warm side compared to the Summicron. It is an excellent travel lens.
 
That's exactly the combo I take on trips where I can't take anything else. It can be crammed into a corner of a small carry-on. I've never used the Summicron, but the Elmar-M is really sharp, and I like the black-and-white pics I usually shoot with it.
 
Elmar is not really that small once you extend it and put the hood.

Extension takes time and you can sometimes lose the shot.

It's possible to forget to extend and get a very surrealistic picture.

The older Elmars are also more prone to haze (according to our head bartender).
 
waileong said:
Elmar is not really that small once you extend it and put the hood.

Extension takes time and you can sometimes lose the shot.

It's possible to forget to extend and get a very surrealistic picture.

The older Elmars are also more prone to haze (according to our head bartender).
Click to expand...

I don't personally find these issues to hinder my use of the Elmar-M. I don't mind how long it is when extended. I have no issues extending the lens. I find keeping it collapsed is excellent for traveling, and I keep it extended without using the hood for shooting. It is just about as long as the summicron when extended with the hood on, so do keep that in mind if compactness when in use is an issue.
 
I enjoy my latest version Elmar for its collapsability that makes my M6 into a pocket camera. Especially good when wearing cargo pants. Kinda keeps the camera hidden/protected when traveling.

For additinal protection/padding I bought a used Besner case that I padded further with a suede insert I made from scrap.The Elmar lens cover is more secure than the more typical clip on lense cap is also a bonus feature.

Cal
 
I have the older version Elmar, and I find it to be very sharp. Does anyone here know of a side by side comparison with the costlier Elmar M?
 
There is a comparison between the two Elmars and the Summicron in Puts, "Leica M-lenses, Their souls and secrets", available on-line, as pdf file. While I generally do not always trust Puts when he compares Leica against other brands, that specific comparison is fully trust-worthy, IMO, since it's Leica only. :)

Roland.
 
I have no experience w/any of the modern 50 Summicrons, but did own the modern Elmar-M. As others have posted, it's optically great, but does have some ergonomic peculiarities.

My take on your question would be to ask myself, "do I need f/2?" If not, & I suspect that your answer is no since you're considering the Elmar as a standalone travel lens, you'll be fine w/the Elmar.
 
ferider said:
There is a comparison between the two Elmars and the Summicron in Puts, "Leica M-lenses, Their souls and secrets", available on-line, as pdf file. While I generally do not always trust Puts when he compares Leica against other brands, that specific comparison is fully trust-worthy, IMO, since it's Leica only. :)

Roland.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link, Roland.

Referring to Puts:

1. First Version:

"At full aperture the low to medium contrast of this lens produces a slightly dull image and fine details in the field are
recorded with blurred edges. At f/4 the image markedly crispens and the on-axis performance is excellent, with the outer zones trailing behind
in image quality. "


2. Second Version:

"This redesign has been significantly improved. At full aperture very fine details are recorded with very crisp edges and
good clarity. This compact (collapsible) lens is a front-rank design for very high requirements."

This suggests to me that for portraits the first version Elmar could be better suited.
 
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I would suggest if you are interested in the Elmar-M go to a place where you can play with it for a few minutes. See if the ergonomics are to your liking. As it seems some find it not so great and others are perfectly content.
 
The current Elmar-M is my favorite 50 from Leica and I've tried every version before settling on this one. KEH tends to run a little high in price but you do have a return option. There have been several of these lenses for sale in our classifieds lately and typically they come with at least both caps, hood and sometimes the case and box for around $500-550 for mint condition. That's about $150-200 less than KEH charges for the same items.
 
Atom said:
I would suggest if you are interested in the Elmar-M go to a place where you can play with it for a few minutes. See if the ergonomics are to your liking. As it seems some find it not so great and others are perfectly content.
Click to expand...

Very true. I find My late model Elmar to be quicker to focus than my 35 Cron with a tab. For me it is a better lense for street photography because of this and also the Elmar (latest version) is not prone to flare.

Cal
 
Elmar-M @ 2.8
elmar2.8.jpg


Summicron @ 2.8
summicron2.8.jpg


Sorry for the small scans- these are all I can dig up.

I find the Elmar-M excellent in every way- and it seems to give a more 3-D rendering of things in the middle distance, there seems to be a more expansive space between objects that I've not seen in any other 50mm lens.

Handling is quite adequate even with my big fingers and arthritic hands- my example has a much more lubed focus ring than any other of my lenses, this may add to that ease of handling.
 
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Thanks for the input. Truthfully, it is attractive for travel when I am too lazy to carry the 35/90 which is not often. Even though I like the 50, I find the 35/90 combo amazingly versatile for travel. Am thinking the 50 Elmar and 15mm would make a super small and versatile kit and the 15 would add some interesting capabilities.

I also confess to wanting to add another lens to the kit just because and have been looking at the 35f1.2 and a few others although I don't do a lot of shooting where a f1.2 is needed. My present Leica kit consists of a M with 15/35/50/90 so a 21 or 24 would add something but again the idea of a Leica is to travel light and I have a Nikon F for wider/longer focal lens.

Ah, life is just too full of choices. It is great to live in a country with so many choices. As a psychologist friend of my says, searching for the best lens (or car or motorcycle or fill in the blank) fulfills our ancient urge to hunt.
 
I had old model of Elmar with my M3 - it was great combo while not extended. The one thing I didn't like about that lens was that you need two hands to change aperture, otherwise it's easy to change focus distance because both rings can easily rotate at the same time. Thats why I've sold it and bought Summicron (I think it's IV ver. - with no focusing tab). I prefer it's ergonomics and it's size is no problem for me.
So I agree with Atom - if possible go and try Elmar by yourself.

Maybe you could consider buying new Summarit 50/2.5 (or VC Color-Skopar 50/2.5).
I think it is not bigger (or mayby only slightly bigger) than not-extended Elmar.

best regards
Mechon
 
Prices for the current Elmar-M are probably trending up slowly since Leica discontinued the lens last year.
 
peter_n said:
Prices for the current Elmar-M are probably trending up slowly since Leica discontinued the lens last year.
Click to expand...

In December last year there was a Leica rebate offer. Knowing that it was a great opportunity, I got a written price quote from B&H and walked downtown to Adorama to look at a late version Elmar, sold as a Demo with case, box and papers. The Adorama price on the Demo was the same price at B&H after rebate.

I ended up knocking off another $150.00 and got a great lense in mint shape for no money.

Cal
 
I've posted here before about exactly this, and having owned the latest versions of both the Elmar-M and the Summicron I sold off the Summicron and haven't missed it at all. At the times where I would be wanting faster than f2.8 the 'cron wouldn't have been enough - even with faster film I would still have been shaky with f1.4. As for imaging, the blacks are black and the edges crisp with a 3D rendering I didn't see/couldn't get with the 'cron. In short, I was astonished with the summicron, but I love the way the elmar-M draws.

Ian
 
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