50mm 'Cron or Nokton decision

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jamiewakeham

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Hi all

Wow - my first post in the Leica M forum. Nice.

I have a recently-acquired M3 to play with and currently my only glass is an I-61 L/D. A nice lens, for sure, but I feel the need for a little more. My significant other has authorised my spending £200 or so (ie $400).

I've a friend in the US who's coming back home who'll bring glass through customs for me, so I've been browsing Cameraquest and KEH with more vigour than usual!

I started at KEH where I saw stuff like BGN-grade DR Summicrons for a tad more than $400 and thought "wow - I must buy Leitz glass." The influence of the legend is strong indeed!

Then I spotted that the Bartender will sell me a brand new 50mm Nokton for $340 and I got very confused indeed.

I understand my basic choice here - on one hand I've got lower contrast, possibly sharper (?), a bit slower, and bearing the magic L-name and alleged glow. On the other hand I have almost a whole extra stop, more weight, a box and guarantee and $70.

Anyone want to convince me either way? Both options are very tempting. If I went for the 'cron I'd most likely look for a good J-3 too for those moments when I need that extra stop. If I went for the Nokton I'd be tempted to put the extra money towards a cheap 90mm Elmarit, so I'd get more focal lengths covered faster.

Other stuff I own is covered in my sig, so you can see what I already have. This is going to become my only RF outfit (bar my Canonet) but my 35mm SLRs get a lot of use - I kind of consider my RF gear to be my low-light and quiet kit.

Thanks for any input!

Jamie
 
I guess you can't really go wrong either way. I personally would choose the DR summicron (or other chrome rigid) simply for the matched build quality and feel of the equipment. The M3 with a rigid summi would feel so lovely to use. Or splurge and find a chrome Summilux Type I (not THAT expensive), and you can have the best of all worlds, IMO
 
jamiewakeham said:
Hi all

Wow - my first post in the Leica M forum. Nice.

I have a recently-acquired M3 to play with and currently my only glass is an I-61 L/D. A nice lens, for sure, but I feel the need for a little more. My significant other has authorised my spending £200 or so (ie $400).

I've a friend in the US who's coming back home who'll bring glass through customs for me, so I've been browsing Cameraquest and KEH with more vigour than usual!

I started at KEH where I saw stuff like BGN-grade DR Summicrons for a tad more than $400 and thought "wow - I must buy Leitz glass." The influence of the legend is strong indeed!

Then I spotted that the Bartender will sell me a brand new 50mm Nokton for $340 and I got very confused indeed.

I understand my basic choice here - on one hand I've got lower contrast, possibly sharper (?), a bit slower, and bearing the magic L-name and alleged glow. On the other hand I have almost a whole extra stop, more weight, a box and guarantee and $70.

Anyone want to convince me either way? Both options are very tempting. If I went for the 'cron I'd most likely look for a good J-3 too for those moments when I need that extra stop. If I went for the Nokton I'd be tempted to put the extra money towards a cheap 90mm Elmarit, so I'd get more focal lengths covered faster.

Other stuff I own is covered in my sig, so you can see what I already have. This is going to become my only RF outfit (bar my Canonet) but my 35mm SLRs get a lot of use - I kind of consider my RF gear to be my low-light and quiet kit.

Thanks for any input!

Jamie
Click to expand...

Hey there, and welcome to the forum. You will love your M3, I have an M6 and M8. I would say first buy the CV Nokton for $340 and use that. You probably cannot tell the difference in most of your photography, and the modern Nokton is far better than the last generation Leica glass. The current aspherical Leica is somewhat stronger in performance, but for my level of photography, that difference is not worth paying ten times the cost ($3500). I doubt many Leica photographers actually press their equipment to the Leica Limit, despite their saying otherwise, so the Voigtlander brand of lenses are superb values for the money. The CV (Cosina-Voigtlander) 15mm, 28mm f/1.9 Ultron, 35mm f/1.7 Ultron, 50mm f/1.5 Nokton, 75mm, and 90mm are especially worth leneses (go to Sean Reid's website at www.reidreviews.com I think). You cannot go wrong!😉
 
One is much bigger than the other. One has much better build quality than the other. One has more character than the other.
 
ErikFive said:
Nokton....
Click to expand...

Yep...............

Image+may060082.jpg
 
I have Cron and Nokton. For your first lens, I recommend 'cron as it's Leica define the rules and standards in this world. Nokton is a good performer too, but u need to learn what's Leica first.
 
I have the Nokton and like it a lot, but it is relatively big and heavy. On my M6 it makes it look like an SLR which is what I got into rfs to get away from. I recently bought a Planar 50/f2 (a lot smaller and lighter, I guess more like a 'cron in size).

I find that out street shooting it is a lot more pleasant using the Planar. It is less obtrusive and fits more easily into a small bag with another small lens. I have hardly used the Nokton since I got it.

The Nokton I use more indoors in low light (although the extra stop is not always such a big deal).

Maybe you should consider what type of shooting you will be doing most before you decide. I think they are both good choices, but maybe for different purposes.
 
Hi,

i've both, they're different but great lenses, the Nokton is very sharp and the break from the differents focal planes are great.

The summicron is a lens with a soul, sharp and with a three-d effect that only Leica lenses ,and some CV, have.

If you do only B&W i say Summicron.
 
Uses. Hmm. Mostly B&W; when I shoot colour I tend to use the 35mm or MF SLRs. This will almost certainly be my primary B&W camera for weddings.

Comparing the images is hard. I've been to Flickr and had a look, but there's so much in the film, the dev, the PS - does anyone have a photo that absolutely screams "Summicron" or "Nokton" they could link to?

Thanks to everyone for their input!
Jamie
 
Remember the Nokton has a close focus of 1 metre, this can be annoying indoors. I'm finding myself using the CV 40/1.4 instead because of this.

Also, you need to factor in the cost of an LTM >> M adapter.

Having said all of that, I really like the look of the Nokton, it's not heavy and for me the size issue is not a big deal. But that's just ergonomics, are these important to you?
 
 
If you want a modern rendition for colour as well as for B&W, then go for the Nokton asph. 50/1.5. It's great performer - see Nico's pictures!
If you want a more classic look, then go for the DR/Rigid Summicron. It's as simple as that.
I had both; I sold the Nokton and I got a Summicron. What you have to know: the Nokton is a bit bigger than the Summicron, but on the M it's acceptable. And it has an extra stop. It's cheaper, it's well built but not as well as the DR/Rigid Summicron of course. Plus, the Nokton doesn't flare - the Summicron, even the DR/rigid and even with its hood, is prone to flare.
But in order to take the right decision, you should focus on the rendition you want. That's only what really matters.
Best,
Marc-A.
 
Nokton IMO outshines the Summicron. I've had 4 versions of the Summicron and the nokton. Also have the planar and highly recommend that lens over all others but otherwise the Nokton. I even like the Planar over my asph summilux 50.
 
Yes, it boils down to whether you want a lower-contrast vintage look (perhaps consistent w/the age of your camera) or something more high-contrast & modern (& flare-resistant). BTW, although it is large (52mm filter ring), the CV Nokton is actually pretty lightweight (1 reason why I use mine as a travel lens) & certainly not heavier than the old DR & Rigid Summicrons, which are dense little beasts.

jamiewakeham said:
I understand my basic choice here - on one hand I've got lower contrast, possibly sharper (?), a bit slower, and bearing the magic L-name and alleged glow. On the other hand I have almost a whole extra stop, more weight, a box and guarantee and $70.
Click to expand...
 
Marc-A. said:
....But in order to take the right decision, you should focus on the rendition you want. That's only what really matters.....
Click to expand...

I agree. Check the M-mount group on flikr to examine some photos by these lenses.

As aside, if you want the least flare-suspectible 5cm lens with a sharp pastle-like rendering, take a look at the ZM 50/2. It is not 400 dollars, but can be found used for around 500ish. It is about 600 new. Not sure if that's do-able?

Regards,

Thomas
 
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