A Leitz lens puzzle

[Sean Moran]

Hello folks,

I'm sure there is a straightforward answer to this conundrum, but it has me bamboozled. If any fellow RFF-ers could reduce my bafflement, I would be most grateful. Here goes:


My recently-acquired f=5cm Summitar ...

has serial number 626212.

According to on-line info and Rogliatti's book, this dates it as

... 1946.

It is an M-lens.

The M-range started in ...

1954.


Cheers,

Seán.

 

[jaapv]

Leica is known to have used "old" parts for several products to use up stock, throwing all the numerical series out of order, if these parts were the number-carriers. I don't know for sure, but this may well be the case for your lens. Alternatively, somebody may have used an old part to repair your lens.

 

[Sean Moran]

Thanks for that Jaap.

Seán.

 

[merciful]

Alternatively, somebody may have used an old part to repair your lens.

Or, Leica really did produce the first Ms in 1946, and have been involved in a massive coverup conspiracy ever since. Expect a book from Puts (along the lines of The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail) to expose their nefariousness any time now.

 

[Sean Moran]

That's hilarious, Merciful. Or, for UK members, perhaps Leitz had a Tardis.

Seán.

 

[jaapv]

Something else: when was the first Summitar produced? Was it made for screw-mount? I don't have my books here. Somebody may well have done a M-mount conversion, which wasn't unusual in the fifties.

 

[merciful]

Thanks. We in the colonies dig the Doctor, too. I can't wait to be able to see new ones again around Christmas.

Summitars were first built before the war. Mine's a '41 if (and this is obviously a very big if, now, as I outline above) Leica can be trusted on any of this.

 

[FrankS]

My guess: it's a conversion, or it has a screw to M mount adaptor on it, or it actually is the holy grail, guarded for centuries by the Knights Templar and The Secret Order.

 

[ray_g]

Or, Leica really did produce the first Ms in 1946, and have been involved in a massive coverup conspiracy ever since. Expect a book from Puts (along the lines of The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail) to expose their nefariousness any time now.

It was a Konica plot.

 

[jaapv]

Fallen through a black hole?

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

Expect a book from Puts (along the lines of The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail) to expose their nefariousness any time now.

It would be riddled with so many typos, grammatical errors, and lack of focus that it would surely be a bomb, unlike the original book.

 

[the lobster]

Don't worry, when I searched my M3 serial number on the Leica site here:

http://www.leica-camera.com/cgi-bin/overview.pl/en/sn2p

it told me it was a IIf. Also, my M3 has no preview lever, although they were supposedly started before my serial number.

Apparently, someone faked an M3 top plate, put a serial number belonging to an earlier model on it, and mounted it on a M3 body which would have come earlier than the serial number on the top plate even though that number doesn't even belong to an M3 according to Leica anyway. Whewww.!

 

[JohnL]

According to the Leica pocket book, the first Summitar 2/50s were LTM and produced from 1939 to 1955. The Summitar designation was also used on 2 batches of early (1950) test series 2/50 Summicrons. Summicrons (1st model) were produced in both LTM and M mount from 1953 (LTM) / 1954 (M) through 1960 (LTM) / 1957 (M). Some of the early Summicrons contained radioactive glass. At least, that's what it says ...

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

The Summitar designation was also used on 2 batches of early (1950) test series 2/50 Summicrons. <snip> Some of the early Summicrons contained radioactive glass. At least, that's what it says ...

Actually, to straighten that out a bit, the first Summicron was actually a Summitar with an asterisk ("*") next to it, and the front element indeed contained a rare element (Lanthanium I think) w/low radiation. Those are highly coveted by the very loved collectors, and thus very pricey.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Hmmm... the plot thickens. My Summicron collapsible responds when called Summitrux (in jest). Why can this be? 😕

 

[phototone]

Just to add some more confusion to this thread. I have had for many years a couple of collapsable Summicrons that I purchased attached to M3 Leica's. Bought these cameras back in the 1970's. Never thought about them, and didn't use the lenses because the front elements were very abraded (the coating). Within the last year (after finding RFDR Forum, and getting all fired up about shooting with RFDR cameras again), I decided to have the front elements polished and recoated, and in the process of taking the front elements off to send off for polish and recoat, I began examining the lenses more closely, and found that they were actually LTM lenses with "M" adaptors on them, and the physical size of the lenses is such that an "M" adaptor is the same diameter as the rear of the lens barrel, and thus becomes practically invisible with mounted on the lens. I am wondering if this is what you have? as the Summitar
basically has the same physical size lens barrel in back to the Summicron. Could your lens have an "M" adaptor "hidden" on the back?

 

[jaapv]

Well, there you are Sean, plenty of straightforward answers.... Take your pick! 😀

 

[Sean Moran]

You are absolutely right Jaap!

Fascinating posts - many thanks everyone.

Cheers,

Seán.

BTW Phototone, I've just examined the lens carefully and can't see any signs that there's an LTM to M adaptor snuck on there.