A Photo that got me in a fight

useless generation said:
I was shooting some photos in Berlin a few weeks back and someone got up off a bench and started yelling "hey. heyyy what the hell are you doing" i just kept walking away pretending not to see them and then two guys come over and start giving me the whole why are you taking my picture your not allowed to unless you ask someone. I tried explaining what my intentions were but they were very aggressive. I was more scared of them robbing me for my Leica gear or trying to damage my camera more than anything. They just kept arguing with me in the end i just walked away from them i guess i was lucky it was a crowded place
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In Germany, that is the law. They were right, you were wrong.
 
I was head attacked once a couple of years ago. I was playing pool with a friend and pointed my camera at a girl who had challenged us to a game, while she was taking a shot. The girl said "don't take a picture of me". She saw the focussing light and assumed I had taken one. This was out in the sticks in Australia and I don't think they had seen many digital cameras. I tried to show her that I hadn't taken a picture of her and even offered to delete all of the pics on the card. She went over to her friends and one of them came over and head butted me while I was explaining.
So I was attacked and I hadn't even taken a picture.
 
It does make you feel like you violated someone's space when they object to you taking a picture. Makes you second guess why you did it. I've had it happen a few times and it kept me from taking more that day. I have not had good luck asking so stealth is what I do and I've still been caught a few times. Once was in a candy store and I completely agreed with the store owner, he was proud of his display and didn't want someone to steal the idea, not sure why I did it without asking.

Lastly it's another good reason to carry a Leica M, they make good weapons on the end of a wrist strap if you have someone go crazy on you.

Cheers!
Jim
 
Thankfully, there has only been two occurrences where I felt that something could escalate beyond those silly words all street photographers hear at least once in their life.

I was able to diffuse the situation, but the whole time I was talking my inadvertent (or not) subject down, I was planning on how to defend myself by judging their body language.. It always gets the adrenaline flowing. The feeling is awesome, but I would rather not have to deal with it, if you know what I mean.

Glad to hear it ended mostly positive, considering it IS LA you're talking about. 😉
 
Field said:
In my opinion the law in Germany is wrong, all citizens should disregard it.
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that too, absolutely. but it's still not as simple as "you can't take photos with people in them." at the moment either.


ScottAlexander said:
Glad to hear it ended mostly positive, considering it IS LA you're talking about. 😉
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- hey scott 😉
 
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Nikonsnapper said:
I was head attacked once a couple of years ago. I was playing pool with a friend and pointed my camera at a girl who had challenged us to a game, while she was taking a shot. The girl said "don't take a picture of me". She saw the focussing light and assumed I had taken one. This was out in the sticks in Australia and I don't think they had seen many digital cameras. I tried to show her that I hadn't taken a picture of her and even offered to delete all of the pics on the card. She went over to her friends and one of them came over and head butted me while I was explaining.
So I was attacked and I hadn't even taken a picture.
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Yeh well .... there's parts of this country where you can get this type of treatment for just being at the wrong latitude and longtitude at the wrong moment in time! 😀

The 'sticks' as you refer to it is a danger zone where anything/person that looks different is fair game quite often!
 
Yea dude choose your words wisely when you get in situations like this. I've been in similar situations here in NYC. I get out of it by just smiling making small talk sometimes they ask me what I'm doing I'll explain and give them a card or something. Never got into a fight and I'm around people all the time.
 
Keith said:
Yeh well .... there's parts of this country where you can get this type of treatment for just being at the wrong latitude and longtitude at the wrong moment in time! 😀

The 'sticks' as you refer to it is a danger zone where anything/person that looks different is fair game quite often!
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Sad but true...

I find that making it obvious I'm waiting for people to move out of the shot I'm trying to take gets me completely ignored (at least from the POV of being some kind of threatening camera-wielding weirdo). But then street shooting with an emphasis on people is not my bag anyway, so it's no great loss.

Scott
 
I think the most dangerous part of what you did (you already acknowledge most of it - being a little inflammatory etc.) is that even after this event you are still entirely intractable. You may have despised that car and have "preferred to delete the photo of it" than to say you were taking a photo of it (why ? That's what you were doing), but the "deletion of photo" method may not have appeased the neanderthals - by that stage the situation was already out of your hands. What would have been so wounding to your pride about telling the truth - that you were taking a photo of the car (whether you "despised it" or not is information they do not need to know) ? Seriously, forget the law and your rights - if you want to engage in a practice which many people view as intrusive, especially in an alcohol-fuelled environment, then it would behove you to be more accommodating and tractable. Sure, it's a free country, but there is no shortage of people spoiling for a fight and if you choose not to be tactful ANY time you are in public, don't be surprised at the result.

Just as an aside, you do realise you also put your friends in danger - not necessarily by taking the photo, but by refusing to tell the truth about why you did so, which would have likely minimized the situation. Karate this/karate that - real fights are VERY different (even without the potential use of guns and knives), but I suspect you had your friends' skills and sizes, and the number of them, in the back of your mind as a kind of "security blanket", which is very unfair on your friends. As to them using the word "fag", yes I absolutely see how this would have made you angry, but seriously - these people were clearly not the elite of society and I'm sure you hear stuff like this virtually every day. You need to know when to pick your battles and when to let things go - because if you always battle, you won't last long. Overall, if I am to be honest (which I am being), I think you handled this situation poorly. I'm sorry that you were hurt, but I hope you have learnt something from the experience (and saying you would rather delete the photo than tell these people you were just taking a photo of this interesting car suggests to me you haven't).
 
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Gotta be careful, because these sorts of things aren't worth someone getting hurt over.

If you punch me, what am I supposed to do? You've already crossed the line into physical action and hit me so am I suppose to assume you are going to stop? Even if I don't want to respond will the adrenaline be so great that I react anyway?

IMO if you're going to go out at night, even in a group, it's worth it to invest in a flashlight. Something like a Surefire E2D. At night you're not gonna get away from 100+ lumens in your eyes. This can temporarily blind people in a lit area. I think the new LED lights are something like 200 too. Oh, and a strike bezel to the forehead isnt a joke either. All with a greatly reduced possibility of hospitalization than the use of a knife or gun.
 
DamenS said:
I think the most dangerous part of what you did (you already acknowledge most of it - being a little inflammatory etc.) is that even after this event you are still entirely intractable. ...etc... .
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No one should apologize for exercising their basic rights. Had the OP used his cell phone, he could have taken video of the f--ing idiots and no one would have been the wiser.

By the way, that's am excellent photo - why is it not a "keeper"?

Finally, we have a much better grade of thugs here in Philly.

Randy
 
jbf said:
aahahaha. sorry, but that was your fault. hollywood is hollywood, its always a ****show. all you had to do was be friendly and be like "yo dude that car is -effin' sick (awesome). i just wanted to take a pic of the car man. srory dude."

you wouldnt have had a single problem. ive gotten in peoples faces with a camera and snapped away (without conisent) and just smiled and made small talk and being open/honest and bout what i was doing and no one says a thing. they smile and are generally cool.

you gave off the wrong vibe and body language.
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superb post, and a good one for me to read since I have got myself into trouble countless times reacting to "type A" behavior, with equally type A remarks.

I haven't been hit or shot, but I have had verbal confrontations for all sorts of stupid reasons over the years.

Bottom line: it is never worth it, no matter how wrong they are. Because if you let things escalate, then that's all you think about for hours after it happened.

And as disgusting as that hummer was to you OP, many are equally disgusted by being "spied on", and maybe by your fancy leica too, hehe.
🙂
 
patrickjames said:
A lot of loose testosterone in this thread.
Tell them "Jesus loves you" or "dude, you are cute". Works every time. You always have to keep your best interests in mind. It never pays to fight unless your life is in grave danger.
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Hmmn - I don't see how telling a bunch of guys who are screaming that you a "fag" that they "are cute" is in any way aligned to your avowed aim not to get into a fight. That is more akin to waving a red flag at a bull.

I also think Zauhar's remark that "No one should apologize for exercising their basic rights" is an idealistic viewpoint which is both incredibly dangerous and (hence) incredibly stupid in many situations. Each situation needs to be judged on its merits, and you won't feel a "hero" for exercising your rights if you are dead or maimed as a result. A little common sense here people, PLEASE. Life is too precious for idiotic intractability like this. Your "rights" are not a bullet proof vest nor should they be an "all purpose all-terrain" mind-set. Exercising caution and judgement may be your salvation (the phrase "discretion is the better part of valour" springs to mind here).
 
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Always living in fear and never standing up for things you believe are perfectly fair, is important since otherwise you may end up a bitch with no value.

The sad part is that there are those that like to escalate things beyond a fist fight, but you can not live life assuming everyone will. It will be obvious at times, and others you will never know. If you can de-escalate with words that seems the best, but sometimes **** happens that nothing could of ever prevented (you don't even need a camera or speech to get in a fight). The real battle happens elsewhere; pushing for better education and quality of life (with opportunity to achieve) so incentive to be a real **** diminishes.
 
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