Agfa Super Solinette info wanted

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seany65

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Hello all, I've just bought an Agfa Super Solinette:



(Click on the thumbs to get 'bigger' pics.)

and while it looks in great shape, there are a couple of things that I need to ask about:

1) The rangefinder was out at infinity. I managed to adjust it via turning the little screw to the front, right bottom of the lens (as the you looke at the front of the camera). However it seems to go back to being out once I've focused on a different distance and refocused in infinity.

2) The rangefinder seems out at 3.5 feet. I measured 3.5 feet with a metal tape measure, turned the lens to that distance and the the image is out. When I focused the lens on the object, the distance scale showed 4.5 feet.

3) When I first fiddled with it, the shutter button wouldn't fire. I know to adjust the speed, tension the shutter, fire the shutter and then wind the film. Anyway, I managed to get the shutter firing, but now the camera seems to in 'film load' mode- I can only fire the shutter button if I've got/had the back open and turned the 'sprocket spool' till it stops. If I then tension the shutter and fire it it doesn't work and Ihvae to open the back again.*

*I've just tried it again in trying to explain that and it seems to be working. I'm presuming this probelm is intermittent.

4) The film counter doesn't work when I turn the wind-on knob. Is this correct?

Would these 'problems' still be there if I put a film in?

5) The lower milled ring on the rewind knob doesn't turn so I canm't chnage the film type in the little window. I know this doesn't actually matter, but it would be nice to get the whole thing working properly.

Do these problems seem to be curable and if so what sort of price should I expect to pay?

Any help would be much appreciated.
 
I've managed to put a film in and fire to frame 15 and rewind.

Apart from the very end of the film being chewed a little at the bottom sprocket bit that goes into the take-up spool, it seemed to work alright. apart from the focus issues that is.

So it seems I have managed to get answers to questions 3, 4 and 5 in the first post.
 
Some cameras need to have a film in them or you have to simulate it - the winding lever may only pull the film along, the rotation of the sprocket (done by the moving film) releases the double exposure prevention mechanism and/or tensions the shutter. The sprocket may even work the film counter as well.

Film disc, maybe just stiff, hard to say what to do with it from here!

In terms of focusing, you are presuming the RF matches the actual focused image. To set it up right, the image at the film plane (which is where you measure from) needs to be in focus and match the focus scale; you need to stick something at the film plane so you can see the image when the shutter is open at B. Then the RF has to match the same distance. I usually do these adjustments at 4-5 feet not infinity as it's a lot easier, and the shallow DoF is less forgiving of getting it wrong.
 
PS looking at the position of the focus ring, it looks like unit focus rather than front cell focus so is quite likely that the film image will match the focus scale. The RF then may be out of whack with these two. I did some googling just now that suggested the RF innards can become b it sticky so will go one way okay but can be slow to go back under only the pressure of the springs in it. The fix there would be to clean the old grease/crud out and reset it. I would start by taping over the film plane to check if the focus scale is accurate and see where the problem lies. As for cost of CLA, I would guess at £50 upwards if you can find someone but I've no idea really. I'd offer a hand but right now my life is just too busy for even my own cameras!
 
Thanks for the two replies johnnyrod. You're right about the sprocket releasing the double exposure prevention mechanism and the film counter and all of that stuff as the camera worked with a film in. You are also right about the 'unit focusing' as I've seen it mentioned in descriptions of the super solinette.

I haven't got the skills or tools to do any maintenance/CLA so it'll have to be done by a tech. Last year I made enquiries about adjustment of the RF of a ricoh 500gx I'd got from ebay at the shop I'll be taking this to, and they said their techs generally charge at least £60. I'm just hoping they don't want all the money 'upfront' as I'm on the trail of another camera that I want which looks to be in good condition.
 
I've owned a couple of these cameras. They have excellent lenses, but can be a bear to work on. To my knowledge, there are no user serviceable screws on the camera that reset focus. Look at everything carefully to make sure something hasn't been bent on the front bed due to closing the camera improperly.

Here's some info from others that had similar problems. It's hard to say w/o looking at the camera, but assuming that Agfa used the same green gunk lubricant that their other cameras used, you may have some of it hardened on the threads that is keeping the lens helicoil from going the full distance of travel when you rotate the focusing ring.

I know, the idea of a focusing helicoil on a unit focusing camera sounds strange, but that is one of the things that make these cameras less than straight forward to work on.

The last link is to a PDF of the manual, and you might want to send Dick a few bucks if it helps you.. He has saved my rear end more than once w/ them. Note: Just closing the back door when loaded w/ film and advancing it can be a tricky operation, so the manual helps a lot on this.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/classics/forum/messages/2/23092.html?1328462515

https://www.photo.net/discuss/threads/agfa-super-solinette-focus-ring-how-to-lube.113911/

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/agfa/agfa_super_solinette/agfa_super_solinette.htm
 
Hello Steve M.

I read on the interwebnet that there is a screw at the front of the camera just below right of the lens (below the 'C' of 'Compur' and diagonally bottom right of the 'R' of the serial number on the front of the lens in the first pic I posted), which is for the horizontal ailgnment, but the writer thought you had to take the top off to adjust the vertical alignment.

I adjusted the screw mentioned above and it seemed to work, but after focusing on other distances it needed readjustment. The focus scale of the lens can properly align with Infinity in either case.

I'm aware of the green gunk issue, but mine seems to be just a bit stiff, (I need both thumbs to turn the ring rather than one finger).

I've got the manual from butkus and I found it useful in loading a film to see if the camera worked. I've read lots of the manuals there and they've saved me from getting a few cameras that I would've otherwise bought, and saved me from wanting some unsuitable cameras. Once I'm all sorted with various bits for various cameras I'll be chucking a couple of quid or so his way.
 
The screw you adjusted is only for the rangefinder, not to adjust the focus of the lens itself (hence horizontal adjustment - of the RF spot). No point adjusting this until you know that the film image is in focus. It's worth checking this as I suspect it will still be accurate, despite what the RF tells you. You need to stick something semi-transparent at the film plane, so that the projected image is clear to see, I sometimes use the focus screen from an SLR (basically ground glass). If this is all okay, and the shutter isn't sticking (too much) then you are left with taking the top off the clean the pivots of the RF mechanism. Where are you located BTW?
 
Hello johnnyrod, I'm a few miles east of Manchester, (I suppose I'd better write "Manchester, England" really).

I haven't got any semi transparent anything to stick at the film plane.

I understand that the screw is just for the rangefinder and not to focus the lens.

I've not done an accurate, technical test (by firing the shutter and counting "1 elephant" etc.:D) though I am fairly sure the slow speeds are a little slow.

I should be taking it to the shop this thursday. Hopefully, the speeds, slightly stiff focus ring and the rangefinder won't cost too much. With luck they won't want all the money upfront.
 
Well, I took it to the shop and I was suprised to see the assistant tension the shutter and fire it by sticking his finger into the space to the bottom left of the lens as you look at the camera.

Anyway they've sent to a technician, it shold be 2-3 weeks before I get it back so there's plenty of time to get a 30mm lens hood and filters.
 
I made a simple "ground glass" for checking focus, from a piece of plastic cut from a CD case, lightly rubbed on one side with an abrasive cleaner. I sellotape this, rubbed side to the lens, in the film plane.
 
Hmmm. That hadn't occurred to me john. I suppose I haven't got the engine, injun, inginnnty, I ain't that clever.
 
seany65 said:
Well, I took it to the shop and I was suprised to see the assistant tension the shutter and fire it by sticking his finger into the space to the bottom left of the lens as you look at the camera.

Anyway they've sent to a technician, it should be 2-3 weeks before I get it back so there's plenty of time to get a 30mm lens hood and filters.
Click to expand...
The shutter button on the top is just a linkage to the real shutter release lever on the shutter body - the biscuit-sized piece of metal holding the lenses. This is an old school camera made a bit more like a 120 folder than the 35mm ones you're more used to. The double exposure prevention is built into the main body, basically blocks the shutter release linkage until the film is wound on. The shutter itself is unaware of any of this, as you can see.

Fingers crossed it just needs a bit of twiddling. If they come back and tel you the shutter speeds are all slow, don't be surprised; even after a good clean, most of my cameras of that age run about half speed, that can be as good as it gets.
 
Thanks for the info johnnyrod. I've no real way of measuring the shutter speeds other than comparing it to my ricoh 500gx, but as there'ss a film in it I don't want to waste a few frames by what would acutally be taking some pics of myself.

Anyway, the faster ones looked fairly reasonable to me. I presume they'll tell me if all the speeds are still a bit slow. 'Exactly' half speed wouldn't be too bad as at least I'd be able to compensate.
 
If they're within 20-25% then they're counted as good enough, which is half a stop! TBH as negative film is best over-exposed rather than under, I normally ignore the difference when metering, unless I'm struggling for a good combo of settings. Checking exposure by film testing can be tricky as you really need an 18% grey card, and then the scanning and maybe also printing software used in the labs will try to correct the exposure anyway! I tried to re-create a shot by taking three pictures into the sun, 2 stops apart each, and they all came out looking very similar. Bit extreme that one but you get the point.
 
Thanks for the reply johnnyrod. I don't think I'd have the patience to check exposure by film testing, even if I had the facilities, or could find a lab that wold be able to print the differences in the pics.
 
I've got 'her' back from the shop and 'she' seems to be working alright. I wish the focusing ring was a bit looser though, the serrated edge feels like over use could scrape the skin off my fingers.

Something I'm puzzled about though, is the fact that the manual says the diameter of the lens mount is 30mm.

I've got a 30mm skylight filter and 30mm metal lens hood but both are too big. When I tried to screw them on they just 'floated about' on the front of the metal bit of the lens. So I measured the width of the lens and it seems to be about 27mm-28mm.

Does anyone know if this size changed over the years? The manual I have access to shows a slightly earlier version than my camera.
 
Does anyone know of the pitch of the thread in the front of the lens? I bought a 28mm skylight filter and even though it's narrow enough to fit, it doesn't really screw in.

Were the filters and hoods etc. actually of the 'slip-on' type?


Any help would be much appreciated.
 
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