Alabama Town's Photography Permit Draws Fire

Al Patterson said:
That is quite true Joe. I tend to post mostly when I'm on the road and in the hotel, so even a rehashing of this thread beats what's on TV most of the time.

And I'm already reading 3 or 4 books a week.

I need to shoot more I guess. I should see if I can schedule an early morning shot in Queens some time...
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in queens, nyc?
 
Disaster_Area said:
...Just out of curiosity would the American Constitution protect me as a visitor.. ie if I took a trip to NYC and a cop asked me to hand over my memory card for whatever reason.. would I be protected against illegal search and seizure?
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Technically yes. Reality says it would entirely depend on what you look like. And I'd suspect you'd have less toruble in NYC than in most places in the US. NYC is one place where common sense still seems to have a good hold (or it has always seemed that way to me- I moved out 18 years ago but visit regularly).
 
i grew up in richmond hill, queens, very different now, can't say i'd know the place much.

there was a street in forest hills, i think, called austin street, had a lot of cool shops there.
 
kevin m said:
Bwah hah! This is 'murca you're talking about. Many states, particularly in the south, have comically titled "right to work" laws, which basically mean the worker has NO rights whatsoever. Tough to exercise your constitutional freedoms when your "right" to make a living can be yanked out from under you on any pretext at all.

And unions? "Union" ranks just below "commie" and "homo" as the most hateful epithet you can hurl at another person. It's been a wildly successful campaign to get workers to demonize the one mechanism that gives them any power at all in the workplace.
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In Virginia, the "right to work" means that you cannot be required to join a union in order to do a job. No laws against joining a union if you want to.
 
dexdog said:
In Virginia, the "right to work" means that you cannot be required to join a union in order to do a job. No laws against joining a union if you want to.
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I actually think you're correct. The term I think we're looking for here is "at will." NC is an "at will" state, meaning that an employee may leave with or without giving notice to his employer - or any reason for doing so. Likewise, an employer may terminate an employee with or without notice, with cause or without cause, and without explaining themselves.

Most US states are "at will" employment states.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At-will

Unions seek to put collective bargaining agreements in place between worker and employer, which ends the 'at will' nature of the employment.

However, unlike most EU nations, in the USA, one cannot simply 'join the union.' First, your job classification must be covered by an existing union (unless you wish to start your own or petition an existing union to cover your SIC code). Second, one must serve public notice of an organization attempt. Third, there must be a vote among employees of the same job code. If it succeeds, they join the union - all of them - or are terminated. If it fails, then the attempt is defeated, the organizing employee is let go, and that's that.

Some US states have 'right to work' laws that require an open shop - meaning that people can choose whether or not to belong to the union and be represented by union collective bargaining. Not that common. Most unions in the USA are also labor unions. Some efforts have been made to unionize IT workers, but most efforts have failed to date.

That's what little I know about it - could be faulty, so correct me if I'm wrong.
 
A few years ago I was sleeping on a train to Portland when I was awakened at 3 am by 2 suits that identified themselves as DEA. Said they were looking for drugs and weapons. Told 'em fine, I didn't have anything like that. Asked if they could search my backpack. What was I going to do, say no? They also asked for my ticket and I.D and asked a lot of questions. The I.D. surprised them, as I have a long Italian name and I am sure they thought I was Mexican. I put up w/ it for a while, then when one of them asked for my help w/ a pocket of the backpack they couldn't seem to open I lost my temper and said ,"No, you want in there, you figure it out"! They quickly backed off, zipped it all up, were all nicey nicey and left.

Later I was sitting there (I was the only one "profiled" in my car) and getting madder and madder. The conductor came by and I collared him and he said, "It happens all the time". I said it didn't feel right. It felt un American. He said, "I totally agree with you. This isn't America anymore".

He was and is right, and this ain't America anymore, so do not expect anything to drastically change any time soon. When a country moves toward a totalitarian state it does not move the other way unless forced to do so by drastic measures, and I just do not see people w/ the sort of intestinal fortitude to do anything about it .
 
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myoptic3 said:
A few years ago I was sleeping on a train to Portland when I was awakened at 3 am by 2 suits that identified themselves as DEA. Said they were looking for drugs and weapons. Told 'em fine, I didn't have anything like that. Asked if they could search my backpack. What was I going to do, say no? They also asked for my ticket and I.D and asked a lot of questions. The I.D. surprised them, as I have a long Italian name and I am sure they thought I was Mexican. I put up w/ it for a while, then when one of them asked for my help w/ a pocket of the backpack they couldn't seem to open I lost my temper and said ,"No, you want in there, you figure it out"! They quickly backed off, zipped it all up, were all nicey nicey and left.

Later I was sitting there (I was the only one "profiled" in my car) and getting madder and madder. The conductor came by and I collared him and he said, "It happens all the time". I said it didn't feel right. It felt un American. He said, "I totally agree with you. This isn't America anymore".

He was and is right, and this ain't America anymore, so do not expect anything to drastically change any time soon. When a country moves toward a totalitarian state it does not move the other way unless forced to do so by drastic measures, and I just do not see people w/ the sort of intestinal fortitude to do anything about it .
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I'm sorry it happened to you. I assume an Amtrak train?

I have been taking Amtrak a lot lately instead of flying - or I drive. I used to fly for a living - I quit in 2004. I just could not take the illegal searches and bully boy tactics used in the airports under the guise of 'protecting me'.

I only read in the last month of so that the Department of Homeland Security is going to start putting undercover operatives, uniformed *armed* agents on trains with drug and bomb-sniffing dogs, and so on. This after many years of Congress being afraid of a general revolt if the TSA started interfering with NE corridor commuter-rail travel. Guess they don't care anymore...

However, I must also say this - and it hurts to admit it - but you and I don't have the same rights inside a government-owned train as we do in 'public'. It sucks, because when I make long trips, I really *like* the train.
 
In Virginia, the "right to work" means that you cannot be required to join a union in order to do a job. No laws against joining a union if you want to.
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Which, in southern parlance, means that unions have been very effectively, legally expelled from the workplace. That you see this as some sort of "choice" just illustrates how effectively big business interests have skewed the discussion.

We are all free to be wage slaves. Rejoice! ;)
 
So far only swarthy people are hassled it seems, it will include more skin colour groups as time goes by.
 
I'm hoping more and more posts like this get photographers motivated enough to do something about it. Come on people, who'll join the Patriotic Street Photographers group? If I were retired and had the time to invest, I'd run it. Issue membership cards, T-shirts, and caps. Of course criminal background checks would have to submitted by potential members to lend some credibility to the group. Then some phone calls, letters and emails to various news media and agencies to stir up a buzz about it. We could do this.
 
xayraa33 said:
So far only swarthy people are hassled it seems, it will include more skin colour groups as time goes by.
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I'm a 6'2" white guy, and back before my I shaved of most of my beard, I was profiled something like 5 out of 8 airline segments. Since the change, hardly ever. So much for "random" searches...
 
Pitxu said:
"Fotographers Against Fascism"

I'll join.
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Your title is more accurate, but I think the positive patriotic spin would be more sellable and acceptable. We want to be part of the solution, not another adversary for the government to fight. You know, catching more flies with honey than with vinegar... :)
 
What we really need is a person with letters, or a celebrity to spear head this, or at least to endorse it publically. Some famous photographer would work. Anyone know anyone?
 
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