FrankS
Registered User
An Oly 35SP would not be a bad way to start.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Welcome to the forum, McFlurry!
One more vote for a used Bessa body and lens here. It will do what you need, is well within your budget, and unlike the Leica/Minolta CL and CLE from decades ago, is a current and fully repairable product.
I would just add that the Cameraquest website (main RFF sponsor, and Voigtländer USA distributor) can be overwhelming. There is a ton of information there but IMO it is very poorly organized and maintained. You'd do well to check at the bottom of each individual page when it was last updated. Don't be surprised if that was 10+ years ago.
One more vote for a used Bessa body and lens here. It will do what you need, is well within your budget, and unlike the Leica/Minolta CL and CLE from decades ago, is a current and fully repairable product.
I would just add that the Cameraquest website (main RFF sponsor, and Voigtländer USA distributor) can be overwhelming. There is a ton of information there but IMO it is very poorly organized and maintained. You'd do well to check at the bottom of each individual page when it was last updated. Don't be surprised if that was 10+ years ago.
Compaq
Established
I decided on the Olympus 35 SP when I bought my first rangefinder. It's a lovely camera. It does everything a rangefinder needs to do. You only have a 42mm lens, but shooting street this is close to perfect. It's also a nice focal length of landscapes, although I do prefer wider lenses.
It's a great way to get into rangefinders. The SP operates with exposure values, and I walk around thinking "today it's a 15", or "in here it's not more than a 6" LOL..
It's a great way to get into rangefinders. The SP operates with exposure values, and I walk around thinking "today it's a 15", or "in here it's not more than a 6" LOL..
McFlurry
Member
Wow, I did not by any means expect 20+ replies when I first made this, I expected a few gentlemen's opinions haha.
I'm typing this from my phone right now, but I'll hopefully be able to read and reply to every single one of you. Until then, keep the posts / debates coming ;D
Thanks again everyone!
I'm typing this from my phone right now, but I'll hopefully be able to read and reply to every single one of you. Until then, keep the posts / debates coming ;D
Thanks again everyone!
Griffin
Grampa's cameras user
+1 for the Cameraquest site. I've really enjoyed reading most of what's on there.
I love my R2, but there's still something to be said about looking through the lens of an old SLR.
I love my R2, but there's still something to be said about looking through the lens of an old SLR.
alexnotalex
Well-known
Outdoors, landscapes around town.... so focal length 50 and lower? 35? 28? 21?? wider??
Go for the framelines that suit your style, a Bessa R4 or an M2 if you feel the call of an exquisite machine...
Either one will easily hold their value for a year or two till you decide.
and you might still be shooting with the same M2 in 50 years time... this could be the last RF camera you every buy.
good luck! and welcome to the forum.
Alex
Go for the framelines that suit your style, a Bessa R4 or an M2 if you feel the call of an exquisite machine...
Either one will easily hold their value for a year or two till you decide.
and you might still be shooting with the same M2 in 50 years time... this could be the last RF camera you every buy.
good luck! and welcome to the forum.
Alex
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
Cameras aren't hamburgers, Roger.
I started myself with a Canonet QL17 III, and loved it. Only once I knew I liked RF cameras did I go with the Leica, and could appreciate fully what these cameras do. Hence, I echo those recommending a fixed-lens rangefinder; not only are they good (often touted as "the poor-man's Leica"), but also reliable and very economical in comparison with the German technology.
There are several choices. To me, the best of these cameras is the Canonet, but then, there's also the Konica S2 or the Yashica Electro. The trick with these cameras is to find one in working condition. Most of the eBay sales are by people who know nothing about cameras, so you might end up with a dud very easily. Check the classifieds here and if you see one of the cameras above (and above my post), you can safely assume that it's in decent condition. Try it, get hooked, sell your soul to the devil and get yourself a Leica. By then you really will appreciate it.
I started myself with a Canonet QL17 III, and loved it. Only once I knew I liked RF cameras did I go with the Leica, and could appreciate fully what these cameras do. Hence, I echo those recommending a fixed-lens rangefinder; not only are they good (often touted as "the poor-man's Leica"), but also reliable and very economical in comparison with the German technology.
There are several choices. To me, the best of these cameras is the Canonet, but then, there's also the Konica S2 or the Yashica Electro. The trick with these cameras is to find one in working condition. Most of the eBay sales are by people who know nothing about cameras, so you might end up with a dud very easily. Check the classifieds here and if you see one of the cameras above (and above my post), you can safely assume that it's in decent condition. Try it, get hooked, sell your soul to the devil and get yourself a Leica. By then you really will appreciate it.
hteasley
Pupil
Yeah, I was going to say the same thing.
The point is well taken that you want a camera with a nice rangefinder, not a super-tiny one, but there are plenty of good LTM lenses, and with an LTM camera, or a fixed-lens rangefinder, you can get into rangefinders for a lot less money. I'm quite sure some folks are just not going to get on with rf photography, and it would be better to find that out for $50-$300 than it would be at $600-$800.
McFlurry
Member
So much to choose from. A lot of great responses that has given me a lot more to think about than I first thought
Do I go cheap to start or make an investment on a camera I may keep for the rest of my shooting days. Quite a decision to make, one that I'll have to think about. One good trait about myself is that I always make sure I know that my purchase is worth it (I spent about 3 weeks researching laptops before I invested in the one I have now). Been that way since a young one (although to some of you, I still am a young one haha)
It seems the most common agreements are to try out a Canon Canonet QL 17 GIII (Or cheap equivalent), Bessa R2A/R3A/etc, or go out and invest in a Leica M right off the bat by finding a good deal. More and more reading for me
Also, having little direct experience with Film, other than shooting it before but never having to choose myself, I'll have to take a read into that. If anyone has any info, tips, or links available, they would be greatly appreciated.
I've heard of "digitizing" film, and might have a go at it soon enough. I would borrow my Fathers Canon Macro Lens, setup either a properly lit background, or a computer monitor fully white (Most likely at this point in time) and a proper setup for the film, and take shots of those, Photoshopping them after if required. My only worry is that I am unsure of the drawbacks of this, other than the labor required.
Your replies and suggestions have made this a much more fun learning experience for me. Please keep them coming, I'll be reading this every day, as well as having about 100 tabs open, reading everything I possibly can. I'll be keeping my eye on the classifieds every now and then too.
Thanks again everyone
Do I go cheap to start or make an investment on a camera I may keep for the rest of my shooting days. Quite a decision to make, one that I'll have to think about. One good trait about myself is that I always make sure I know that my purchase is worth it (I spent about 3 weeks researching laptops before I invested in the one I have now). Been that way since a young one (although to some of you, I still am a young one haha)
It seems the most common agreements are to try out a Canon Canonet QL 17 GIII (Or cheap equivalent), Bessa R2A/R3A/etc, or go out and invest in a Leica M right off the bat by finding a good deal. More and more reading for me
Also, having little direct experience with Film, other than shooting it before but never having to choose myself, I'll have to take a read into that. If anyone has any info, tips, or links available, they would be greatly appreciated.
I've heard of "digitizing" film, and might have a go at it soon enough. I would borrow my Fathers Canon Macro Lens, setup either a properly lit background, or a computer monitor fully white (Most likely at this point in time) and a proper setup for the film, and take shots of those, Photoshopping them after if required. My only worry is that I am unsure of the drawbacks of this, other than the labor required.
Your replies and suggestions have made this a much more fun learning experience for me. Please keep them coming, I'll be reading this every day, as well as having about 100 tabs open, reading everything I possibly can. I'll be keeping my eye on the classifieds every now and then too.
Thanks again everyone
Paul T.
Veteran
Those are all good opinions. But, to mangle Roger's analogy further, don't feel you have to go all the way to an expensive M first, it's like going to a michelin starred restaurant your first time out. You might enjoy yourself every bit as much at a local family restaurant.
The Bessas and my personal fave, the CL, are a great introduction, with good viewfinders and good lenses. The CL can still be a bargain if you can find one for $700 with a lens (both the ROkkor and the Summicron are essentially similar) because that gets you into high quality Leica lenses - the Summicron C 40mm is as good as Leica lenses that go for $1200 plus. I bought a CL as my first rangefinder and still use it, I enjoy using it just as mych as I did my black paint M4 and 35mm Summicron (even though it doesn't impress bystanders as much).
As everyone else mentioned, have a good look round the Cameraquest site first, it's a great resource.
good luck!
The Bessas and my personal fave, the CL, are a great introduction, with good viewfinders and good lenses. The CL can still be a bargain if you can find one for $700 with a lens (both the ROkkor and the Summicron are essentially similar) because that gets you into high quality Leica lenses - the Summicron C 40mm is as good as Leica lenses that go for $1200 plus. I bought a CL as my first rangefinder and still use it, I enjoy using it just as mych as I did my black paint M4 and 35mm Summicron (even though it doesn't impress bystanders as much).
As everyone else mentioned, have a good look round the Cameraquest site first, it's a great resource.
good luck!
Teuthida
Well-known
Bessa R. Nice interchangable lens LTM camera with a great rangefinder and in your pricerange.
dct
perpetual amateur
All good advice here, which I support too. Just to let you know my starting point into RF photography: I was already photographing since decades with SLR and P&S cameras, both film and digital. My interest for RF cameras started with this forum and the cameraquest.com pages. Impressive information overload! Would I like the RF focussing experience?
I wasn't sure and that's why I started with a bargain fixed lens RF camera.
A year leater I own already two LTM/M bodies and several lenses. I am in!
I wasn't sure and that's why I started with a bargain fixed lens RF camera.
A year leater I own already two LTM/M bodies and several lenses. I am in!
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Well, that's not exactly what I said. What I said was that one camera can be a hamburger, and another can be prime steak. Or if you prefer a slightly different analogy, one can be battery chicken and another can be pheasant.
Before I got a Leica, my brother had a Konica III. Beautiful camera, superb lens, excellent viewfinder -- and as far as I was concerned, awkward, lumpy and blah. Then my fiancée got a Leica II... I still have the IIIa I bought when she wanted it back (though we never married, so I don't have the girlfriend any more). As soon as I could afford one (basically, as soon as I left university), I bought an M. I've never been without one since.
Since about 1970 I've had at least half a dozen other fixed lens RFs, including the best: Yashica Lynx 14, several Retinas, Konica (a different one). I've also had some indifferent onces: Samoca, for example. The only ones I care for are Retinas. I sold the Yashica decades ago; gave away my Konica in 2011; but still have a Retina IIa.
I'm not saying that your approach is wrong. It clearly worked for you. But it would never come within a mile of working for me. Only the OP can judge whether he's more like you or more like me.
Cheers,
R.
p.giannakis
Pan Giannakis
Have you ever used a rangefinder before? There is nothing worst after having spend $$$ to realise that actually SLR's work better for you.
Why don't you buy a FSU camera such as Fed or Zorki? My Fed-3b was bought in 1967 by my friend's father and it is still working today perfectly without ever been for a CLA. You can shoot 15-20 films and then you can decide whether rangefinder cameras are the ones you like taking pictures with and invest in a Bessa/Leica...
Why don't you buy a FSU camera such as Fed or Zorki? My Fed-3b was bought in 1967 by my friend's father and it is still working today perfectly without ever been for a CLA. You can shoot 15-20 films and then you can decide whether rangefinder cameras are the ones you like taking pictures with and invest in a Bessa/Leica...
boomguy57
Well-known
Start slowly is what I'd say. I started with a Canonet 28 and a QL17, which are both nice. I later added a Yashica Electro 35 and an Olympus 35 RC. I think all of them together cost me no more than $150.
As much as I liked those cameras, I eventually did move on (some might say up) from them. Today I have only the 35 RC left, and it is likely going to be finding a new home. I find my favorite RF cameras are now the M3 and the M6TTL 0.85, and others just don't get any use.
Another idea you could look into for RF photography is a Mamiya 6, which I have not had the pleasure of trying but am considering (and have done, for a long time).
Cheers, and welcome to RF photography!
As much as I liked those cameras, I eventually did move on (some might say up) from them. Today I have only the 35 RC left, and it is likely going to be finding a new home. I find my favorite RF cameras are now the M3 and the M6TTL 0.85, and others just don't get any use.
Another idea you could look into for RF photography is a Mamiya 6, which I have not had the pleasure of trying but am considering (and have done, for a long time).
Cheers, and welcome to RF photography!
McFlurry
Member
I've decided to go with a cheaper entry version to start, then wait for a good deal here on the classifieds if I ever decide to upgrade.
I'll be browsing (and soon posting in the Want to Buy area) for a Canonet of some sorts, or a Yashica, Konica, whichever has the best deal. Of course I'll only be browsing here from now on ;D
Still have lots to read on. Different frame lines, accessories, light metering, types of film. Also, I'll need to look into who on Vancouver Island, or maybe in Vancouver, deals in these old cameras. Maybe I can find something there, or at least a place where I can go if repairs are needed.
Still looking for a reply on my earlier question(s) on re-shooting film with a DSLR, but that will have to come in a separate thread possibly.
This thread is still open for opinions. The more insight I can get, the better. Thank you all again for making this much easier / less confusing for me.
I'll be browsing (and soon posting in the Want to Buy area) for a Canonet of some sorts, or a Yashica, Konica, whichever has the best deal. Of course I'll only be browsing here from now on ;D
Still have lots to read on. Different frame lines, accessories, light metering, types of film. Also, I'll need to look into who on Vancouver Island, or maybe in Vancouver, deals in these old cameras. Maybe I can find something there, or at least a place where I can go if repairs are needed.
Still looking for a reply on my earlier question(s) on re-shooting film with a DSLR, but that will have to come in a separate thread possibly.
This thread is still open for opinions. The more insight I can get, the better. Thank you all again for making this much easier / less confusing for me.
NickTrop
Veteran
Buy a fixed lens in good working condition. Olympus SP, one of the Yashica Electros, one of the Canons... Konica, Minolta Hi-Matics, whatever. Doesn't matter so long as it's in good working condition... and spend the rest of your budget on film and processing. Then go out and shoot, and shoot, and shoot s'more. Upgrade later to a higher-end camera if you feel the need. I can't tell what camera anyone here who posts photos took the shot with... doesn't matter a lick either. I've seen crappy stuff shot with expensive cameras, I've seen genius coming out of an Electro. I've seen crap coming from Electros too, and I've seen stunning stuff from expensive gear. (Hint - it's the photographer, not the camera...)
McFlurry
Member
Absolutely this, hense my reasoning for going for something within the 100+ dollar range. I want to start cheap, but not so cheap as to it turning me away from Rangefinder photography, all because I went to a cheap camera. Most times, you do get what you pay for
If I really like the results from the Canonet, I'll use that for as long as I see fit. If I like the style, but would like something more, I'll definitely look into investing into something I'll hold onto for a long time.
Thanks again to everyone who helped out, and may continue to. I've got a bid on evil-bay for a Canonet QL17 GIII (In mint condition and recently serviced), for $105 CAD
Yes, I'll get critics for bidding there. Unfortunately, I had no other option, and know of a guy in Vancouver (Friend of a friend) that can help me out if I run into any trouble.
Tompas
Wannabe Künstler
I fear any 100+ $ rangefinder will have a poor viewfinder, compared to modern standards. And the viewfinder is an important part in the rangefinder fun.
I'd say, don't go 'below' a Bessa R{2,3,4}{a,m}, a Zeiss Ikon, or a Leica M. The Bessas are very good and the least expensive.
A Leica/Leitz Summicron-C 2/40 is probably the least expensive very good M-mount lens. (I use mine on a R2m with the 35mm frame lines.)
McFlurry
Member
Unfortunately even the Bessas coming in at my maximum budget at the time, which has now been hacked thanks to school, and thats still body only.
Does anyone have any <$250 suggestions on cameras that have a "good enough" rangefinder? I heard lots about the Canonet simply because plenty were made, and are easy to find. The Leica M2 is nice to dream about, but at 800 bucks body only, and without a light meter, its a bit steep at this time, when I have 0 experience with RF cameras as it is.
The auction from evil-bay was closed for some reason, and I'm going to take it as a "sign" to look around a bit more. Still, 100 bucks for a mint and recently CLA'd QL17 would have been nice.
Thanks