Kim Coxon
Moderator
Now that's what I call lateral thinking. 
Kim
Kim
Magnus said:
Nachkebia
Well-known
jaapv said:I'll remember that the next time I listen to a CD... It is NOT music... Not that I don't agree with you for a large number of CD's
Next time you listen to CD just think about how amazing that would be live performing, so it was with us, an for some stupid reasons we want to kill live performing and switch to cd
well cd makes sence because it is cheaper and everyone can do it, but I would only listen to live music if I could, so I will shoot film because I can... cd no music.. bla bla bla..
Kim Coxon
Moderator
Surely, film is not the same as live music, it is vinyl. Live music is standing on the mountain top breathing the fresh air or standing in the market listening to all the bustle rather than looking at a picture.
Kim
Kim
Nachkebia
Well-known
Kim Coxon said:Surely, film is not the same as live music, it is vinyl. Live music is standing on the mountain top breathing the fresh air or standing in the market listening to all the bustle rather than looking at a picture.
Kim
I don`t agree, in a same way musicians can be sitting in the park and playing on instruments just for themselfs, but they have need to share and expres, so it is same as film...
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
Nachkebia said:Next time you listen to CD just think about how amazing that would be live performing, so it was with us, an for some stupid reasons we want to kill live performing and switch to cd
As a matter of fact I only listen to CD's in the car; at home I prefer vinyl....Anything but unamplified music often sounds better at home than in the concert halls. Those soundsystems in there tend to be c**p.
Nachkebia
Well-known
Concert hall? How about opera house?
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
Not really my scene, opera. The ladies are too rubenesque.
Nachkebia
Well-known
So is your memmory card
Sparrow
Veteran
Nachkebia said:
Watercolour, slide film, egg tempera, and your PC’s monitor are the same additive
Oils, gouache, prints and real-life are all subtractive.
AGeoJO
Established
Toby said:
Chuckle, chuckle...
egpj
50 Summilux is da DEVIL!
Magnus said:
But, black paint lenses are just as heavy as chrome.
Speaking of black paint lenses, I wonder if they come up magenta if a M8 takes a picture of one.
JohanV
another GAS victim
Now there's an idea: I'll cancel my order for a black M8, and get an à la carte magenta one.
willie_901
Veteran
The CD/digital sensor analogy is completely irrelevant. Here's why.
Digitizing sound waves is much, much simpler than digitizing light waves. Audio recording creates a digital image of the sound waveform. LIght imaging records a two-dimensional map of photon intensity. One estimates frequencies, amplitudes and phases for an analog waveform. The other estimates photon intensities in a two-dimesional array.
The M8's digital light sensor counts photons. There are millions of photon buckets, When the shutter opens each bucket reports how many photons are captured. This data has no frequency-information content whatsoever. There is no phase-information content. The only information the M8 sensor can directly record is light intensity.
The Bayer filters placed in front of the sensor tell the firmware something about the light frequency for an array of buckets. Now we have bucket counts for red, green and blue which are interpolated to estimate the light frequencies. The light-frequency estimates are indirect. Digital cameras do not record light frequencies. They record photon intensities of filtered light. The properties of the Bayer filter (and any other light filters in front of the Bayer filter) determine the quality of light-frequency information. The software interpolation algorithms determine how well the red, green and blue intensities are combined to estimate the color for an array of buckets. This process is indirect.
It is trival to digitize music because the frequencies involved are so low. By contrast the frequencies of light are so high, they can not be digitized directly.
The music's wave form is digitized directly. A 100 KHz analog-to digital converter can properly capture the harmonic signature of music. The digital filter technology to suppress digitization artifacts is extremely well developed. The errors in recording the analog waveform arise from dynamic range limitations. There are bit-rounding issues and at some point the analog signal and the digital signal are not equal.
Digital audio and digital imaging are so different, that the former can not be used to justify the latter.
willie
Digitizing sound waves is much, much simpler than digitizing light waves. Audio recording creates a digital image of the sound waveform. LIght imaging records a two-dimensional map of photon intensity. One estimates frequencies, amplitudes and phases for an analog waveform. The other estimates photon intensities in a two-dimesional array.
The M8's digital light sensor counts photons. There are millions of photon buckets, When the shutter opens each bucket reports how many photons are captured. This data has no frequency-information content whatsoever. There is no phase-information content. The only information the M8 sensor can directly record is light intensity.
The Bayer filters placed in front of the sensor tell the firmware something about the light frequency for an array of buckets. Now we have bucket counts for red, green and blue which are interpolated to estimate the light frequencies. The light-frequency estimates are indirect. Digital cameras do not record light frequencies. They record photon intensities of filtered light. The properties of the Bayer filter (and any other light filters in front of the Bayer filter) determine the quality of light-frequency information. The software interpolation algorithms determine how well the red, green and blue intensities are combined to estimate the color for an array of buckets. This process is indirect.
It is trival to digitize music because the frequencies involved are so low. By contrast the frequencies of light are so high, they can not be digitized directly.
The music's wave form is digitized directly. A 100 KHz analog-to digital converter can properly capture the harmonic signature of music. The digital filter technology to suppress digitization artifacts is extremely well developed. The errors in recording the analog waveform arise from dynamic range limitations. There are bit-rounding issues and at some point the analog signal and the digital signal are not equal.
Digital audio and digital imaging are so different, that the former can not be used to justify the latter.
willie
MarkM6
Established
Willie RULES!
M
mad_boy
Guest
Willie is right when looking at the signal.
There is however an other part of the story; the human sensor.
The ear is capable of distinguishing a large range of frequencies, each with their own caprure device (Or better, the distance of the capture device in the inner ear will determine the frequency that it is sensitive to).
It can therefore determine a large set of frequencies (compex wave-form) at a point in time and split this back into it's original sound waves.
The eye can only distinguish 3 frequencies.
That is why it is often stated that light consists of 3 primary colours.
This is wrong, light is a wave and has infinite colours (frequencies).
We however can only have three types of sensors, each sensitive to a range of wavelenghts only. We have learned to call these red etc.
Coming back to Willie's story,
The only thing the sensor tries to do is mimic the human eye.
there are 3 sensors, each for a specific wave length and in these we count the photons.
Just like the human eye.
Similar to the CD, here the actual wave-length is recorded because that is what the human ear would record.
Mad_boy (trying to be clever for once)
There is however an other part of the story; the human sensor.
The ear is capable of distinguishing a large range of frequencies, each with their own caprure device (Or better, the distance of the capture device in the inner ear will determine the frequency that it is sensitive to).
It can therefore determine a large set of frequencies (compex wave-form) at a point in time and split this back into it's original sound waves.
The eye can only distinguish 3 frequencies.
That is why it is often stated that light consists of 3 primary colours.
This is wrong, light is a wave and has infinite colours (frequencies).
We however can only have three types of sensors, each sensitive to a range of wavelenghts only. We have learned to call these red etc.
Coming back to Willie's story,
The only thing the sensor tries to do is mimic the human eye.
there are 3 sensors, each for a specific wave length and in these we count the photons.
Just like the human eye.
Similar to the CD, here the actual wave-length is recorded because that is what the human ear would record.
Mad_boy (trying to be clever for once)
Sparrow
Veteran
Goldfish have four types of colour sensor strangely……………….they would be nothing wrong with the m8 in the opinion of a goldfish!..