An odd legal case-Only in America??

MichaelHarris said:
Well said danwilly! Here's what I think is important, finding out what groups support hate in any fashion and publicize that hate. There are good Christians here, two have come forward to denounce the hate this photographer showed this couple. They should be thanked for denouncing the hate, if more and more Christians stand up and say no more this country can move on to issues that really do affect us.

Do any of you who secretly hate the thought of same-sex marriage think it will hurt this nation? Do you truly believe there is a gay agenda or was that just some fat man spewing hate from a pulpit? This country does need some healing and it's not going come in the form of religion preaching hatred, it's going to come in the form of love of the divirsity this nation has become.

If you hate I have no use for you.
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Back to Christian bashing I see. The only class we seem to be allowed to bash with impunity. Typical. Well past the time to close this thread.

Do you even see YOUR hate? I doubt it...
 
Only you saw hate Al, I only mentioned love. You probably missed the part where I praised the two Christians denouncing hate. That's what is typical for those who hate.
 
Michael, I am not sure I would use the word "hate" - I am not sure the photographer "hated" the gay couple - it just did not coincide with her beliefs and she felt so strongly about it that she refused to accept the job. I am NOT saying that she was right in doing so, but I want to get away from the "hate" aspect.
 
Also, I don't understand why some members here want this discussion to be closed. This is probably the only forum on the web, where people act as adults and stay pretty objective in their discussions. Yes, we all have different views when it comes to religion, but we do get along pretty damn well here.

I find this conversation very, very interesting and I must say that I did change my initial reaction based on the discussion here.
 
RF I can sort of see your point but let me mention how I see it. When blacks were told to sit in the back of the bus was that out of hate? When Hispanics are asked for a green card when buying a car is that done out of hate? When this woman refused to take an assignment because of a couples sexual orientation was that done out of hate?

What should Christianity teach us? If it's love for all people then why did she she decline? Is there a gray area between love and hate that we can live?

What is very telling is how a previous poster saw Christian bashing in a post of mine praising two of the Christians here. That truly speaks volumes.
 
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MichaelHarris said:
Only you saw hate Al, I only mentioned love. You probably missed the part where I praised the two Christians denouncing hate. That's what is typical for those who hate.
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I did see your mention of love, but the following quote of yours

"Do you truly believe there is a gay agenda or was that just some fat man spewing hate from a pulpit?"

seemed to be an explicit slap at a certain individual. If you were truly dealing from a spirit of love, you wouldn't need to show your hatred of whomever this sentence was meant to invoke. In any event, it was at least a mean comment, and not necessary to make your point.

And yes, there is a gay agenda, and a Christian agenda. And while their repective agendas aren't exactly the same, I'm sure both groups have more in common than either are ever willing to admit...
 
It definitely was a slap at a man who did nothing for this country but preach hate and intolerance. A person would have to be blind not to have seen that, would we even need to post the quotes?

What is the "Gay Agenda"? Do they want to "turn" your children? My little brother died of AIDS during Reagan, do you really want to discuss agendas? If there is an agenda it's only to be seen as normal people with the same rights as you and I. Was the Civil Rights movement an agenda?
 
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RF-Addict said:
Also, I don't understand why some members here want this discussion to be closed. This is probably the only forum on the web, where people act as adults and stay pretty objective in their discussions. Yes, we all have different views when it comes to religion, but we do get along pretty damn well here.

I find this conversation very, very interesting and I must say that I did change my initial reaction based on the discussion here.
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An interesting conversation yes and a slippery one if the participants don't act as you describe.

At some point I think this will be moved to the OT forum. As I see it, I have serious doubts that this story is true. I did a couple searches this morning and found no links from a credible news source citing it. I quit looking after 7 pages of links to right and left wing wacko blogs. I would even feel better if there was mention of the story from an unreliable new source with just minimal credibility like CNN or Fox News (how is that for jumping on the fence :cool: ). At this point too, it has nothing to do with photography. Yes there is a photographer involved, but the discussion, though interesting, really isn't OT at all.
 
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rover I came to the same conclusion, I didn't find any credible source except on the above mentioned websites.

It does bring up a question that probably doesn't need answering. If the story is fake who started it and what were their motives? The answer probably lies within the only websites it appeared.
 
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Another way of looking at this: that it's legally-enforced 'white lies'.

We all lie by omission or commission sometimes: very few people will say to proud parents "What a perfectly hideous baby!" or suggest directly to a man that his girlfriend is a gold-digging tart.

Now, most of us would (I think) agree that it is good that people are forced not to discriminate on certain grounds (race, religion, etc). We'd probably agree, too, that it would be nice if this changed the way people thought; which it probably does, in the long term. After all, read Lincoln's views on the equality of blacks and whites.

But in the short term, why worry about what someone actually thinks? If they are full of hate, or merely somewhat prejudiced, isn't it a good thing if they are prohibited in some degree from propagating that hatred or prejudice?

In short, is it not better that they tell a 'white lie' ('No, I'm busy that week-end') than the truth ("I hate gays")? Because, I suggest, if they are forced to do so, they may just find that actually, they don't need that hatred and prejudice.

Cheers,

R.
 
No its not, its political, its spin. You can present the same story in many ways; consider

"New EU rules on lead in the environment will prevent the xpan from being sold in Europe, it is believed to be too costly for the manufacturer to change the design to comply with the regulations"

"Following hot on reports that faceless EU burocrats are to ban curved bananas and English sausage we now discover they are to ban the import of Japanese cameras"

Both true no?
 
Ducky said:
As the OP, I'd say the discussion is now way OT and should be shut down.
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So, if you start a conversation between a group of people at a party, for example and the conversation goes in a direction that you don't like, would you ask them all to shut up, or declare the conversation over? Of course you wouldn't. You'd probably go and find another group of people to talk to.

I think this is a fascinating and insightful discussion and everyone here, despite having strong opinions, seem to be behaving well.

Ernst
 
Sparrow said:
No its not, its political, its spin. You can present the same story in many ways; consider

"New EU rules on lead in the environment will prevent the xpan from being sold in Europe, it is believed to be too costly for the manufacturer to change the design to comply with the regulations"

"Following hot on reports that faceless EU burocrats are to ban curved bananas and English sausage we now discover they are to ban the import of Japanese cameras"

Both true no?
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The Spin is strong in this one.

I see you've been watching Faux Nooze for practice. ;)
 
RF-Addict said:
Also, I don't understand why some members here want this discussion to be closed.
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A common way to deal with anything that people don't agree with, is to "pull the plug" on it. As Louis XIV engraved on his cannons: "last argument of Kings" :bang:
 
Gabriel M.A. said:
A common way to deal with anything that people don't agree with, is to "pull the plug" on it. As Louis XIV engraved on his cannons: "last argument of Kings" :bang:
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I don’t think we had the correct degree of outrage at liberal values, or sufficient backlash to them
:D
 
ernstk said:
So, if you start a conversation between a group of people at a party, for example and the conversation goes in a direction that you don't like, would you ask them all to shut up, or declare the conversation over? Of course you wouldn't. You'd probably go and find another group of people to talk to.

I think this is a fascinating and insightful discussion and everyone here, despite having strong opinions, seem to be behaving well.

Ernst
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Dear Ernst,

Heartily seconded.

Cheers,

R.
 
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