Another check w/ the group on M3 prices

[markbrennan]

Hey everyone -

Hope I'm not sounding like a broken record, although I am indeed obsessed w/ the M3!

I mentioned checking out an M3 today in another thread.

I looked over an M3 at one of the reputable NYC Leica dealers. It's a user body, but has had a CLA by Sherry Krauter. Single stroke, serial # more than 1 million, but less than 1.1 million.

Indeed, the action was beautiful, all speeds seemed good, shutter looked good, shutter release and advance lever very smooth. Best of all was the beautiful, bright, unblemished finder!

Body showed wear; vulcanite chipped in at least 2 places and top plate marked up.

Price: $985.

Seems a bit high, no? If you consider the body is probably closer to a "Bargain" rating at KEH (approx. $600-700?), and a CLA is $200-300, then it's marked up. The dealer wants his vig (his spread), no doubt.

Worst yet, the vertical alignment of the rangefinder was off! The dealer, who is quite pleasant, was concerned and said he'd follow-up w/ Sherry, though we both doubted it had left Sherry w/ the problem. He said that he would probably end up fixing it himself and to check back with him.

Do M3 rangefinder alignments go out that easily?

I would almost rather spend $900+ at KEH and get an "Excellent" body from them, which I'm sure would be cosmetically superior.

Question is, would I be guaranteed getting an M3 with an equally bright finder?

The finder is really one of my most critical criterion.

How much can a CLA improve a finder?

Also, should one always assume that a used M3 body from a seller like KEH would need a CLA?

KEH has a great reputation, but I like to handle and see the cam i'm getting before dropping nearly 1K. That's the one advantage I see with buying from this dealer.

What are your thoughts?

Many thanks.

Best,
-Mark

 

[ferider]

in at least 2 places and top plate marked up.

Price: $985.

Seems a bit high, no? .....

It's on the higher end but still a decent price, in particular if the seller gives
you some sort of warantee/return rights, and obviously lets you inspect
the camera before you buy it. Assuming the body has no dings or major defects.

Worst yet, the vertical alignment of the rangefinder was off!

The vertical alignment on the M3 is a very easy DIY fix. It doesn't go
out of whack easily, but might during shipping or because of frequent
lens changes.

How much can a CLA improve a finder?

Very much. Sherry's CLA will not only clean the finder, but guarantee
an accurate RF at short distances, accurate shutter speeds, smooth
mechanics, etc.

Also, should one always assume that a used M3 body from a seller like KEH would need a CLA?

Yes, depending on your requirements, i.e., if you want a reliable user, etc.
But a nice KEH rating will tell you nothing about accurate operation
of the camera, in my experience.

Best,

Roland.

 

[Bill Blackwell]

Yes, $985 is on the high side for a user M3, but a fresh CLA and a reputable store warranty are worth the difference. Although I have never bought from them, KEH has a very good reputation - you can buy and return with no-hassle if not satisfied.

It's like this... you have in one hand a known quantity, but on the other you can play footsy with KEH until you get one you like.

As to the vertical alignment, no, it should not get whacked out that easily. I would suspect it had a good jolt after leaving Ms. Krauter.

I would say if the RF is clean and the shop owner throws in a 90-day warranty (and gets the vertical alignment adjusted for you), then buy it.

 

[Stu W]

Mark, most ratings on collectibles are based on cosmetics and not on function. However, if the cosmetics are good you can be pretty certain the camera wasn't abused. However, unless you are provided with a receipt for a recent cla I think you must assume one is in order. Unless you get really lucky I think you're going to spend over a grand for a nice M3 with a cla. A user with a cla over 800. Just my opinion. Stu

 

[ferider]

BTW, you should be able to see that Sherry CLA'ed the camera.
She leaves a "K" in the 12 o'clock seal.

Best,

Roland.

 

[markbrennan]

Thanks everyone for all the replies - very helpful.

I will probably keep looking. I saw a DS at another NYC Leica dealer today that was as mechanically perfect as the SS, PLUS it showed no dings or holes in the vulcanite. It was $1099, so $100 more than the SS.

Again, beautiful finder, all speeds seemed good, etc. Only difference other than considerably better cosmetics was that it was a DS, which I found weird at first, never having tried one. I imagine one gets used to them quite quickly, though. But I suspect the fact that it was a DS was why it was only $100 more than the SS, which showed cosmetic wear.

At any rate, always a tough call. But thanks for all the great feedback - most appreciated!
-Mark

 

[Stu W]

Mark, both my M3's are doublestrokes. You get used to it. You actually get to enjoy it. Stu

 

[splitimageview]

I actually wind my SS M3 with two strokes...not sure exactly why...maybe it was my DS M3 I owned about 25 years ago that ingrained me.

 

[markbrennan]

Stu, DigitalIntrigue -

Thanks for the replis on the DS. Yes, though weird at first, I see how it could actually help, as the throws are shorter. Even now I find that w/ the long throw of the MP advance I often don't get it advanced all the way and it comes back for a short 2nd stroke, which is then often aborted. Odd, when thinking about it, how long that single stroke really is. So maybe it'll be a nice change!

Always appreciate hearing everyone's experience/opinions, etc.

Best,
-Mark