Any love for the Leica M-A (Typ 127)?

[chuckroast]

That's what i heard too CR. But you've got the designations reversed.... MP = meter. / MA = no meter.

I stand corrected. Now fixed.

 

[coogee]

There is anecdotal evidence that the MP is a skinned over M-A sans electronics. Somewhere (I cannot recall where exactly) someone reported getting a new MP and being able to feel a dimple/void underneath the leatherette where the M-A battery cover would have been. That made me a lot less interested in it.

Also, if you must have a meter onboard a Leica film body, I think you would be hard pressed to do better than the approximately spot meter found in the M5.

I can't see or feel a dimple/void on the front of my M-A but it'd make sense that it uses a repurposed MP body minus the electronics. It doesn't make any difference to me, the camera is as described/works as intended and feels like it'd dent the planet if I dropped it, being a solid hunk of brassy bits.
I've never used an M5 but that's good to know.
We are spoilt for choice with 70+ years of the same mount. FWIW, I don't think I would buy an M-A now, mine cost an eyewatering-to-me at the time $2700 USD second-hand when I bought it, that ship has long since sailed.

 

[Miles.]

I bought one new in 2021.

One difference between the MP and M-A that is almost never mentioned:

The 75mm framelines in the M-A are much less intrusive (in size and shape) than what you find in the MP, or any other "modern" M.

As someone who is primarily a 50mm shooter, but occasionally loves using a 73mm Hektor, this difference is critical.

 

[Out to Lunch]

There is anecdotal evidence that the MP is a skinned over M-A sans electronics. Somewhere (I cannot recall where exactly) someone reported getting a new MP and being able to feel a dimple/void underneath the leatherette where the M-A battery cover would have been.

Yep, you got the M-A and MP mixed-up: The MP has the meter; the M-A does not. The anecdotal evidence: a verified M-A buyer who reviewed his purchase on the BH website.

 

[Richard G]

I bought one new in 2021.

One difference between the MP and M-A that is almost never mentioned:

The 75mm framelines in the M-A are much less intrusive (in size and shape) than what you find in the MP, or any other "modern" M.

As someone who is primarily a 50mm shooter, but occasionally loves using a 73mm Hektor, this difference is critical.

I absolutely hate the 50mm frame lines in my M9 and Monochrom, incomplete along the lower edge. No meter would clean that up. I don’t notice the same problem with the M6 though. Or especially the M5.

 

[38Deardorff]

I absolutely hate the 50mm frame lines in my M9 and Monochrom, incomplete along the lower edge. No meter would clean that up. I don’t notice the same problem with the M6 though. Or especially the M5.

Although i'm primarily a wide angle shooter, the 75mm frame lines on the MP were the ultimate reason I sold it and went back to the M4......although the M2 will always be my view of perfection.....

 

[David Murphy]

For the $6300 new price you can buy 3 classic (M2,M3,M4..... or more M5).....serviced and in good condition.
As mentioned.... the MP new with a lightmeter, in black paint or chrome is only $100 more.

The reason some photographers like the M-A is the lack of a meter! I for one, don't want electronics in my cameras. I also don't care for more modern Leica M models - the M-A is the only exception since it's true to its roots. Cost is a secondary issue as far as I'm concered - quality is more important.

 

[38Deardorff]

I own one, I bought it second hand 10 years ago. I like it as a modern alternative to an M2 with more reliable viewfinder/rangefinder being so much newer and not made using balsam. I don't doubt there are many M2s out there with perfectly fine viewfinders and rangefinders, just my personal preference.

It has always worked as advertised, I prefer not having a meter, personal choice - my other cameras don't either. It is the same as an MP without the battery for all intents and purposes. There are subtle differences in the framelines and it is a different colour but I don't think those things merit specifically needing an M-A.

I imagine there is less online chatter about the M-A as there are just less of them and they just work without issue, there's not that much to discuss. I love mine but I prefer my IIIc FWIW! I'd enjoy your MP and not worry about the M-A. I have no idea what the hyphen and the 'Typ 127' signify, it's just an MP minus the electronics but with a hyphen and a subtitle!

Given the fact that so many Leicas from before the M2 until the modern ones are still in use without issue..puts into question your phrase "more reliable viewfinder rangefinder".....

 

[coogee]

Yes, absolutely, they make them all to last! I did add a caveat immediately afterwards to reflect that.
It is a point of difference between M-A and a 1960s M2 though, no balsam in an M-A as far as I'm aware and I know the service history of my camera which is very unlikely for an M2. None of which matters in the slightest if everything is working as expected, all beautiful cameras and a win/win. I'd happily attach an M2 to my 35mm lens if one should fall my way and give up the extra 10 seconds to load it every time!

 

[FrozenInTime]

There are two features the M2 has, that the modern M-A lacks :
self timer and depth of field marks inside the viewfinder.
I also think the old chrome look better and stays cleaner than todays satin chrome.

Would I trade my black M-A back for a M2 ( with rapid load kit) ? No - I hated that external film counter.

 

[38Deardorff]

There are two features the M2 has, that the modern M-A lacks :
self timer and depth of field marks inside the viewfinder.
I also think the old chrome look better and stays cleaner than todays satin chrome.

Would I trade my black M-A back for a M2 ( with rapid load kit) ? No - I hated that external film counter.

The black paint M2 i had was a gem. The external frame counter is something i naturally got used to.....& carries over.... the one on my lllg doesn't bother me at all.

 

[Godfrey]

At the price I paid for my Leica M4-2, I could buy eight of them at the cost of a single new M-A.

But ... who cares? The M-A is a new camera, my M4-2 is nearly fifty years old. Big deal. New things cost more than old things, they always do. The two cameras are all but identical in use. Why do people spend the extra money? Because they can, because they want a new camera, not an old one. For whatever reason.

So before you go arguing that those people should buy the old cameras because they are much cheaper and work the same, remember: if no one buys the new cameras, there are no old cameras at lower prices to buy.

G

 

[chuckroast]

The black paint M2 i had was a gem. The external frame counter is something i naturally got used to.....& carries over.... the one on my lllg doesn't bother me at all.

On my IIff the counter doesn't hang outside the line of the body and is thus harder to bump. With my M2, I have to remember that the counter stands slightly proud of the body and thus is easier to move accidentally. It's a small thing. All in all, I still think it's the best of the M bodies, with the M4 and M5 in hot pursuit, but neither has that glorious M2 viewfinder.

 

[38Deardorff]

At the price I paid for my Leica M4-2, I could buy eight of them at the cost of a single new M-A.

But ... who cares? The M-A is a new camera, my M4-2 is nearly fifty years old. Big deal. New things cost more than old things, they always do. The two cameras are all but identical in use. Why do people spend the extra money? Because they can, because they want a new camera, not an old one. For whatever reason.

So before you go arguing that those people should buy the old cameras because they are much cheaper and work the same, remember: if no one buys the new cameras, there are no old cameras at lower prices to buy.

G

True, if you want a new in box, or money is not a concern..... it is a choice. At the same time, Leica needs new aficionados who have decades of photography ahead of them. They're such truly well engineered tools that buying used is a good way through that door. After all, $10,500 for a body & lens isn't exactly chump change.

 

[Godfrey]

True, if you want a new in box, or money is not a concern..... it is a choice. At the same time, Leica needs new aficionados who have decades of photography ahead of them. They're such truly well engineered tools that buying used is a good way through that door. After all, $10,500 for a body & lens isn't exactly chump change.

Leica gets almost no benefit at all from new aficionados buying old, used gear. Profit to the company comes almost exclusively from the sales of new gear, modulo the tiny amount of income from refurbished item sales.

G

 

[38Deardorff]

Leica gets almost no benefit at all from new aficionados buying old, used gear. Profit to the company comes almost exclusively from the sales of new gear, modulo the tiny amount of income from refurbished item sales.

G

of course G, that's obvious..... but often getting into the game with the brand....leads to those new sales...

 

[Freakscene]

Given the fact that so many Leicas from before the M2 until the modern ones are still in use without issue..puts into question your phrase "more reliable viewfinder rangefinder".....

An increasing proportion of M2s have problems with rangefinder beamsplitter desilvering, cement (Canada balsam) failure, optical surface etching and other problems including light leaks, dirt and wear from being over 60 years old. If you live in the UK or USA you have access to technicians who can CLA, repair or restore these old cameras. In other places, not so much and maybe not at all. I wouldn’t trade an M2 that worked well for a new or little used M-A, simply because of the rangefinder flare in the newer rangefinder without the condenser lens, but if I was buying now there is a lot of comfort in a warranty and manufacturer repair capacity. But I certainly also would not be at all surprised if the next time I picked up my M2 it did not work.

 

[38Deardorff]

An increasing proportion of M2s have problems with rangefinder beamsplitter desilvering, cement (Canada balsam) failure, optical surface etching and other problems including light leaks, dirt and wear from being over 60 years old. If you live in the UK or USA you have access to technicians who can CLA, repair or restore these old cameras. In other places, not so much and maybe not at all. I wouldn’t trade an M2 that worked well for a new or little used M-A, simply because of the rangefinder flare in the newer rangefinder without the condenser lens, but if I was buying now there is a lot of comfort in a warranty and manufacturer repair capacity. But I certainly also would not be at all surprised if the next time I picked up my M2 it did not work.

F, we've kind of gotten sidetracked from the original question "why so little love for the MA?"
As far as "a lot of comfort in a warranty and manufacturer repair capacity.".... the problems with the M8, M9 and the fact that repairs have to go to Germany gives me personally little comfort. I'd rather rely on Don Goldberg and having spare bodies. There's very little any more of the kind of service historically offered by companies like Nikon & Canon.

 

[Freakscene]

F, we've kind of gotten sidetracked from the original question "why so little love for the MA?"
As far as "a lot of comfort in a warranty and manufacturer repair capacity.".... the problems with the M8, M9 and the fact that repairs have to go to Germany gives me personally little comfort. I'd rather rely on Don Goldberg and having spare bodies. There's very little any more of the kind of service historically offered by companies like Nikon & Canon.

So little ‘love’ because most people who bought one either just got on with it and used it, or put it on the shelf and said “I have a Leica” instead of fawning over it on the internet.

The internet is a strange place sometimes.

 

[38Deardorff]

So little ‘love’ because most people who bought one either just got on with it and used it, or put it on the shelf and said “I have a Leica” instead of fawning over it on the internet.

The internet is a strange place sometimes.

Well we are on one of those places here....