Any M8 users prefer the RD1?

[rbelyell]

i recently picked up an RD1 1st gen and have been using it with the 21 elmarit and the 50 and 75 summarits. i just love this camera and these lenses, and i'm greatly enjoying the digi rf expetience. i personally find the camera performs well at iso 1600--i really have no complaints at all there, and find i'm able to shoot at the same aperture/SS combos that other cams i have need to go to 3200 or greater.

my self inflicted wound is the allure of the leica M. for my own shooting reasons that i neednt go into, i will not consider any but the M8. but i'm wondering, given that i am enamored with the 1:1 vf, the results generally and at iso 1600, what exactly am i gaining by getting an M8? are the 4 extra mps and lack of AA filter worth the smaller vf and iso 1280 limit?

so i,m really interested in the opinions of those who've shot both: why did you decide to keep whichever one you did?

thanks!
tony

 

[B-9]

No experience with the M8, other than wanting one for years now.

I chose the RD-1 over the M8 because of the 1:1 finder, along with the menu system.
The RD-1 is so easy to use, if your a film shooter, you just fall right into making great photos with the Epson.

The money I saved by buying the Epson, let me afford a 28mm Elmarit (v3) which I absolutely love!

I also agree, files made at ISO 1600 are for the most part just fine.
I've found that long exposures with the Epson at max sensitivity only exacerbates the problem of noise. But then again, who buys a RF for tripod work?

I'm glad I chose the Epson first, now ide prolly buy a backup RD before I threw down for a M8! The Epson just begs you to shoot it, and never gets in your way.

I just wish they would release a updated battery, mine just plain suck.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

I owned and used an RD1 extensively before I got an M8. I didn't get rid of the RD1 until I got an M9 though. The sensor produces excellent images in the higher ISOs that I could not quite match with the M8. I'm sure with enough post-processing I could get results I liked but I like shooting more than I like sitting at a computer. To make a film analogy, the RD1 was like shooting with black and white film and the M8 was like shooting with slide film. The former allowing a lot more latitude in exposure while with the Leica, I had to nail the exposure in the zone I wanted.

The RD1 is also a fun camera too. Batteries are cheap and plentiful. Good thing because the camera goes through them quickly. I never had a problem with a battery in that camera. I did have problems with Leica and 3rd party batteries swelling up inside the camera and having to tap them out in inventive ways. With the screen folded in on itself, it looks just like a film camera and no one is the wiser. Sounds like a film camera too with that slightly metallic click.

Both are excellent tools. If I were shooting mostly at night, I'd choose the RD1. If I were shooting landscape, I'd go with the Leica.

Watch out for the strap lugs wearing through on the RD1. It happened to me and I luckily caught the camera before it hit a floor.

Phil Forrest

 

[Out to Lunch]

I have one of the first the Epson R-D1, and also own the R-D1s and R-D1xg and use all of them. It's a terrific camera with a distinct signature, especially when used with Voigtlander lenses.

 

[B-9]

Any reason the VC lenses add to the experience?

I've found the RD-1 to do exceptionally well with any of my lenses.
From my old Elmars to my new Elmarit.

Yet to plug a VC lens on mine, but I'm hoping to grab a 12mm After the Holidays.

 

[rbelyell]

thanks so far, these are very valuable inputs!

any difference between the 1st gen and the RD1X?

btw, the 1:1 vf really is just killer. i really dont want to give that up, but might if the result disparity is overtly noticeable.

 

[B-9]

Im pretty sure the latest RD-1Xg has a fixed LCD, no more swivel action.

I have the RD-1s, which I believe is just a firmware update and a new box, aside from the obvious addition of the 's' on the front.

 

[Lss]

given that i am enamored with the 1:1 vf, the results generally and at iso 1600, what exactly am i gaining by getting an M8? are the 4 extra mps and lack of AA filter worth the smaller vf and iso 1280 limit?

Featurewise, it's just the viewfinder for me. No ISO advantage really. But it's such a fun camera to use, too. The M8 is more of a tool.

 

[Gid]

I have an R-D1 currently. I have had an M8 and M8.2. The M8 VF/RF is more robust and easier to see when in focus. The base length of the M8 is longer and I understand that this makes focusing with fast lenses easier, but I've never had a problem with the R-D1. The M8, lens for lens, will produce sharper output, but in real world situations it doesn't make much difference, that is, the R-D1 is sharp enough in any case. The R-D1 and S are limited to 2MB cards; the RD1X is not limited. The R-D1 buffer is very limited (3 shots), so if you like to shoot fast and a lot, you'll struggle. The R-D1 is definitely better at iso 1600 than the M8 and has a most pleasant "old school" rendering of colour. It also produces superb B&W via Epson Photo Raw. I like both cameras, but prefer the ergonomics and immediate access to key functions of the R-D1 as well as the wind on and reversible screen - I never shoot with it open. I replaced my M8.2 with a Fuji X100 (and a lot of change) and regularly go out with the Fuji and Epson, finding them complementary.

 

[Godfrey]

I tried an R-D1 and just could not get on with it. It felt clunky and awkward to me. It's what locked in my decision to go for the gusto and buy the M9.

G

 

[Manuel Patino]

My friend who sold me the RD-1 had a Leica M8 but did not like it as well as the RD-1. He now has the M 240. He loves it!

Anyway, my point is about the CV lenses. I have 3 of them that I use with the RD-1 and they seem to work fine. However, with the Leica M240, my friend says he has not had any luck with CV lenses and buys Leitz until he can afford Leica glass... He says the CV lenses don't focus well. Either they front focus or back focus with the Leica body.

 

[ramosa]

I have used an RD1 and owned an M8. No comparison: M8 wins. In fact, I bonded much more closely with my M8 than my subsequent M9, liking the b&w rendering more.

 

[Keith]

I owned an M8 for several years and while it was a very good camera it lacked personality in comparison to an RD1. I love the quirkiness of the Epson ... the weird analog dials and fold out screen and manual recocking of the shutter make it unique.

If I could figure out a way to put a foveon sensor into the old Epson lurking in the cupboard .........

 

[B-9]

I think Ide buy a Foveon RD! +1 to that 🙂

 

[rbelyell]

so keith, why not take the rd1 outta the cupboard? does it no longer fit your needs or more a matter of the mp difference with current cams? btw thats a great idea with the foveon.

 

[Keith]

so keith, why not take the rd1 outta the cupboard? does it no longer fit your needs or more a matter of the mp difference with current cams? btw thats a great idea with the foveon.

The RD-1 now resides in the vapour trail of my GAS. 😀

Great camera but the crop factor was a pain and I always suspected that eventually I'd go full frame ... hence the huge splurge on an M240. 😱

I should probably sell the Epson but it's such a unique camera I'm reluctant to do so!

 

[_sgb_]

I started off with the R-D1XG as my first rangefinder since 2011 and just recently got the M240.

The R-D1 feels so much better in the hand, it is thinner and lighter c.f. M240. I find nailing focus with 50mm lens is quite difficult but one does get very spoilt with the 1:1 OVF and able to shoot both eyes open is great. Bit weird to do that on the m240.

The RF patch is much more contrasty on the m240 than the R-D1. After using the M240 for awhile and then go back to the R-D1 you wonder where the heck the focussing patch has gone!

R-D1 makes you feel more involved with the photography process whilst M240, I find, makes you pursuit the camera technical excellence.

 

[rbelyell]

yeah, i agree, ive never felt 'more involved' in my scene than with this camera.

 

[Eric Boe]

Once I went M(8), I never went back

Once I went M(8), I never went back

The R-D1 was an interesting machine, and I give high praise for Epson and CV for collaborating on the camera. I had one of the earliest, serial in the 1800's range, and it produced decent files for a camera of its era. One problem I had towards the end of my ownership was that the vertical alignment of the rangefinder drifted out of alignment. At that time, Epson wanted $600 to realign this, something that has since been overcome by multiple service repair shops referenced on this forum. Still, lack of support was an issue.

When the M8 came out, and I finally received a body that was sorted out (broken shutter new out of the box), the difference in feel and quality of images was immediately apparent. The shutters are in different leagues, with the M8 making a healthy vertical-focal-plane "click" (noisier than the horizontal plane shutter on the film M's, while the Epson made more of a "crick" sound. The Epson manual shutter cocking is unique to the series.

The Sony 6MP CCD in the R-D1 produces decent images to 1600 if the resolution and ISO limits are acceptable to you. The Kodak 10MP CCD in the M8 is also capable to 1250 (factory step sizes, close enough to 1600 for comparison), and you gain the benefit of being able to play with B&W IR if you choose.

Viewfinder magnification is a subjective, personal preference only you can answer for yourself. I am a left-eyed shooter, so 1:1 with both eyes open doesn't apply to me. It is noteworthy that all Leica rangefinders have used less than 1:1 optical viewfinders quite successfully.

Something you may wish to try before committing your funds: rent an M8 and, if possible, an R-D1. See which you like better. Alternatively, you may wish to see if there is any type of camera club locally where a member could let you play.

Enjoy.

Eric

 

[Darthfeeble]

Bought an M8, sold it. Bought an RD-1, sold it, got remorse bought another, sold that one, got remorse bought yet another and won't be selling it. Wouldn't buy another M8. Nuff sed?