New York April 15th ICP Symposium
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Calzone
Gear Whore #1
I would like to thank John L. and Chris S for this great opportunity. Also many thanks to the attendees who have signed up.
I was looking at my Epson 7800 that I call the "Jersey Barrier" this morning while getting dressed. I took note how already it is a monster because it has been modified in a garish manner and "Calvinized." Both the left and right covers are missing because I replace the OEM carts with 350 ml refillable versions that are likely more than twice the size of the OEM carts I removed.
Inside the carts is a pink liquid called Piezoflush that is used to store and maintain printers. Basically it is a solvent for ink and the carts are only 2/3rds full due to the initial fill sequence and a series of power cleans to flush out any residual OEM color ink. The Jersey Barrier has been safely stored unused since last August when I purchased it for $100.00.
I cleaned the capping station and the wiper. Before I got this 7800 it had only made 1802 prints over its 9 year life, so basically I bought a seldom used printer that was used just enough not to have any issues. To me this was divine intervention and is beyond being lucky. Also know that the 7800/7880 and 9800/9880 are likely the most robust printers Epson ever made. Know that I already printed out the service manual at work (for free) and the cost of the down load was also free.
Parts are still available so if I stockpile some parts I can likely keep this printer going the rest of my life.
BTW I'm really sorry that I didn't pick up the free 9880 at the Brooklyn Navy Yard that someone posted on Craig's List. Christian had forwarded me a link. Anyways this Piezoflush can be used to rescue printers that have clogged heads. Also many do not do any maintenance on their printers. Clogged print heads are pretty easy to avoid. Have you ever cleaned your capping station or wiper blade of dried ink accumulations?
Also it seems that if you can get one of these newer Epsons for free (due to a clogged channel) that have more than 8 or 9 channels there is a way to get a custom profile to configure another wise dead color printer into a Piezography printer by recycling via a custom profile. Epson 4900, 7900 and 9900 printers can be recycled due to them having 11 channels. With Piezography I only need 8 channels to print glossy.
Cal
I was looking at my Epson 7800 that I call the "Jersey Barrier" this morning while getting dressed. I took note how already it is a monster because it has been modified in a garish manner and "Calvinized." Both the left and right covers are missing because I replace the OEM carts with 350 ml refillable versions that are likely more than twice the size of the OEM carts I removed.
Inside the carts is a pink liquid called Piezoflush that is used to store and maintain printers. Basically it is a solvent for ink and the carts are only 2/3rds full due to the initial fill sequence and a series of power cleans to flush out any residual OEM color ink. The Jersey Barrier has been safely stored unused since last August when I purchased it for $100.00.
I cleaned the capping station and the wiper. Before I got this 7800 it had only made 1802 prints over its 9 year life, so basically I bought a seldom used printer that was used just enough not to have any issues. To me this was divine intervention and is beyond being lucky. Also know that the 7800/7880 and 9800/9880 are likely the most robust printers Epson ever made. Know that I already printed out the service manual at work (for free) and the cost of the down load was also free.
Parts are still available so if I stockpile some parts I can likely keep this printer going the rest of my life.
BTW I'm really sorry that I didn't pick up the free 9880 at the Brooklyn Navy Yard that someone posted on Craig's List. Christian had forwarded me a link. Anyways this Piezoflush can be used to rescue printers that have clogged heads. Also many do not do any maintenance on their printers. Clogged print heads are pretty easy to avoid. Have you ever cleaned your capping station or wiper blade of dried ink accumulations?
Also it seems that if you can get one of these newer Epsons for free (due to a clogged channel) that have more than 8 or 9 channels there is a way to get a custom profile to configure another wise dead color printer into a Piezography printer by recycling via a custom profile. Epson 4900, 7900 and 9900 printers can be recycled due to them having 11 channels. With Piezography I only need 8 channels to print glossy.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
Add Andre to the list.
Do we have 20 yet? If so there will be a standby waiting list.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
UPDATE: Thirteen is my lucky number: it is a number about change and that is why superstition makes people not like the number 13. BTW my interrupted life, with so many starts and stops, knows and is fully acquainted with "rapture." Again and again I have changed...
Thirteen is the count by Chris S of people who either paid or made a serious commitment to attending. Here is the list:
John G.
Jeff
Helen
Jor
George
Klaus
Mike
Andre
Chris S.
John L and friend
Roger
Joe
Only 7 slots left. Hurry up and reserve your spots before you get closed out. After 20 is hit there will be a waiting list.
Also know that I'm trying for a surprise guest.
I'll be rigging up my Epson 7800 this weekend so 24x36 inch prints will be coming. I already have the paper and ink.
Also know I'm pretty confident that Leica will likely make a monochrom version of the SL. Hmmm... Even bigger files with more data than even a M-246... Hmmm... Why not? Basically a game changer for B&W printers like me.
Cal
Thirteen is the count by Chris S of people who either paid or made a serious commitment to attending. Here is the list:
John G.
Jeff
Helen
Jor
George
Klaus
Mike
Andre
Chris S.
John L and friend
Roger
Joe
Only 7 slots left. Hurry up and reserve your spots before you get closed out. After 20 is hit there will be a waiting list.
Also know that I'm trying for a surprise guest.
I'll be rigging up my Epson 7800 this weekend so 24x36 inch prints will be coming. I already have the paper and ink.
Also know I'm pretty confident that Leica will likely make a monochrom version of the SL. Hmmm... Even bigger files with more data than even a M-246... Hmmm... Why not? Basically a game changer for B&W printers like me.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
UDATE: My hands are stained red from Piezoflush, and I look like I am either a butcher or a mass murderer. Basically I overflowed my maintenance tank doing "Power Cleans." The 7800 has been stored with Piezoflush, and now the carts are half empty after the initial fill and all the cleaning. I printed 5 perfect nozzle checks in a row to make mucho sure I have a like new printer that is fresh.
Although the printer only cost me $100.00, the set of carts set me back about $300.00, and the gallon of Piezoflush is now half gone which also cost about $300.00. Had a bit of an emergency with the overflow from the printer. It was like the 7800 was hemorrhaging. Then the setback was I had no spare maintenance cart, and with today being Saturday B&H is closed. I also ran out of rubber gloves.
I ended up dissembling the maintenance cart and washing out the absorbent material. Because it was soaked with Piezoflush I was able to get the media really clean. Piezoflush dissolved the dried ink. What a mess in my kitchen sink. Glad that Maggie didn't see what I was doing. LOL.
So now I'm downloaded paper profiles that I have to zip-install into my "Print-Tool." If everything goes right I'll load the carts I filled last night. 700 ml bottles of ink cost about $200.00 each. Multiply $200.00 times 7 shades of black, and in two more shades of black because I blend inks in shades 3&4, and then add in three bottles of Gloss Overcoat and I have $2400.00 worth of ink and I used about half of it to fill the carts. I expect loosing about a third of the ink just doing the initial fill and perhaps a few more cleaning cycles.
Last night I grew cross-eyed loading the carts. What is really scary is that I no longer use a syringe to load my carts: I use a funnel and pour from a bottle. What made things tedious is that I have the supply of ink leftover from my 3880, so I had to be thoughtful not to screw anything up. Pretty easy to do when you are tired. I wanted the air bubbles to settle overnight as not to introduce problems because at this level mistakes are very costly. I had so many empty plastic bottles that it seemed like I was cleaning up after a beer party. Anyways I condensed some of my warehouse space on the wall.
Anyways I learned of yet more things to try in making a better print. It seems I data mined out that I can lay down more ink by using curves/profiles that are for larger printers that were designed for K-3 ink sets, but I might have to also increase the amount of Gloss Overcoat required to eliminate Bronzing and Gloss Differential. I would expect a more 3-D effect with more ink on the paper. Hmmm.
Anyways, if everything goes well I might be printing later tonight or tomorrow.
Cal
Although the printer only cost me $100.00, the set of carts set me back about $300.00, and the gallon of Piezoflush is now half gone which also cost about $300.00. Had a bit of an emergency with the overflow from the printer. It was like the 7800 was hemorrhaging. Then the setback was I had no spare maintenance cart, and with today being Saturday B&H is closed. I also ran out of rubber gloves.
I ended up dissembling the maintenance cart and washing out the absorbent material. Because it was soaked with Piezoflush I was able to get the media really clean. Piezoflush dissolved the dried ink. What a mess in my kitchen sink. Glad that Maggie didn't see what I was doing. LOL.
So now I'm downloaded paper profiles that I have to zip-install into my "Print-Tool." If everything goes right I'll load the carts I filled last night. 700 ml bottles of ink cost about $200.00 each. Multiply $200.00 times 7 shades of black, and in two more shades of black because I blend inks in shades 3&4, and then add in three bottles of Gloss Overcoat and I have $2400.00 worth of ink and I used about half of it to fill the carts. I expect loosing about a third of the ink just doing the initial fill and perhaps a few more cleaning cycles.
Last night I grew cross-eyed loading the carts. What is really scary is that I no longer use a syringe to load my carts: I use a funnel and pour from a bottle. What made things tedious is that I have the supply of ink leftover from my 3880, so I had to be thoughtful not to screw anything up. Pretty easy to do when you are tired. I wanted the air bubbles to settle overnight as not to introduce problems because at this level mistakes are very costly. I had so many empty plastic bottles that it seemed like I was cleaning up after a beer party. Anyways I condensed some of my warehouse space on the wall.
Anyways I learned of yet more things to try in making a better print. It seems I data mined out that I can lay down more ink by using curves/profiles that are for larger printers that were designed for K-3 ink sets, but I might have to also increase the amount of Gloss Overcoat required to eliminate Bronzing and Gloss Differential. I would expect a more 3-D effect with more ink on the paper. Hmmm.
Anyways, if everything goes well I might be printing later tonight or tomorrow.
Cal
Range-rover
Veteran
Cal I know how you feel, when I was restoring the H/P B9180 printer I got
the cleaning sponge they used was a thin piece of foam which I change out
to a more thicker piece of foam which was a mess like in your case all over
the place, but I'm sure the effort was worth it with the great prints we can
get.
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
UPDATE: Saturday night I printed two 12x18's with 17 inch wide roll paper. Unlike my 3880 the 7800 has a smoked plexiglass window so you can actually see the print head laying down ink. I printed "Sal" AKA "Landscape-Face" and the Domino Sugar Refinery as test references.
It seems the rendering is slightly different between the 3880 and 7800. Perhaps partly this is due to curve profiles, but the 7800 is noticibly more detailed and sharper. Hmmm.
Then on Sunday came the scary test of printing as big as I can on a 24 inch roll and printing 20x30 to have 2 inch wide borders. It seems that one limitation is the first half inch of the leading edge of the paper can't be printed on, so you can't have bleeding edges. Also you really need about 3/4's inch border, so I can only print 22 1/2x34 1/2.
Another problem is drying space for these large prints. So far I laid down 7 shades of black on two Domino prints (20x30 and 22 1/2x34 1/2) and another 20x30 of the microcar under the Highline that has that dramatic splitone.
The two large Domino prints scale up very well. It seems the difference in perceived contrast is more profound because the highlights seem more pronounced because my eye catches them more readily because they are easy to see due to their size. In reality the contrast is the same though. It is really interesting the effect that scale has on perceived contrast, and how the size of the highlights is what draws in the eye. It does seem like the bigger print has this sense of immediacy to be more in your face, and I'm not talking a sud-L difference.
I await the gloss overcoat before I draw full judgement, but I think in comparing the two Domino prints I'm right on the line where one is simply a large print and the other is a monster print that is kinda aggressive.
The printer handles the paper just fine, but the artist finds handling such large prints awkward and clumbsy. I'll be laying down the Gloss Overcoat later today.
On the Micro-car shot with this profound splitone highlight there is a grain to the image that got printed. Understand that I was shooting my 28 Cron at F-5.6 around dusk at 1/60th second. The image is sharp because I crouched down and made one of my body tripods where I brace my elbow on my right knee with my left knee on the ground. The focus is close so even though I'm stopped down the zone of focus receeds rapidly to resemble medium format's more shallow DOF. Well the grain renders a lot like a fine grained film like Acros. An interesting shot. The IQ is gritty but pretty in a film like manner.
I think the Micro-car will make a better print with a Canson paper because it will be a true glossy instead of the satin finish of Jon Cone Tyle 5. Also the Canson I think makes a better glow with this image.
My next experiment is to see how my street shots translate into 20x30's...
Know that the 7800 is kinda loud.
Cal
It seems the rendering is slightly different between the 3880 and 7800. Perhaps partly this is due to curve profiles, but the 7800 is noticibly more detailed and sharper. Hmmm.
Then on Sunday came the scary test of printing as big as I can on a 24 inch roll and printing 20x30 to have 2 inch wide borders. It seems that one limitation is the first half inch of the leading edge of the paper can't be printed on, so you can't have bleeding edges. Also you really need about 3/4's inch border, so I can only print 22 1/2x34 1/2.
Another problem is drying space for these large prints. So far I laid down 7 shades of black on two Domino prints (20x30 and 22 1/2x34 1/2) and another 20x30 of the microcar under the Highline that has that dramatic splitone.
The two large Domino prints scale up very well. It seems the difference in perceived contrast is more profound because the highlights seem more pronounced because my eye catches them more readily because they are easy to see due to their size. In reality the contrast is the same though. It is really interesting the effect that scale has on perceived contrast, and how the size of the highlights is what draws in the eye. It does seem like the bigger print has this sense of immediacy to be more in your face, and I'm not talking a sud-L difference.
I await the gloss overcoat before I draw full judgement, but I think in comparing the two Domino prints I'm right on the line where one is simply a large print and the other is a monster print that is kinda aggressive.
The printer handles the paper just fine, but the artist finds handling such large prints awkward and clumbsy. I'll be laying down the Gloss Overcoat later today.
On the Micro-car shot with this profound splitone highlight there is a grain to the image that got printed. Understand that I was shooting my 28 Cron at F-5.6 around dusk at 1/60th second. The image is sharp because I crouched down and made one of my body tripods where I brace my elbow on my right knee with my left knee on the ground. The focus is close so even though I'm stopped down the zone of focus receeds rapidly to resemble medium format's more shallow DOF. Well the grain renders a lot like a fine grained film like Acros. An interesting shot. The IQ is gritty but pretty in a film like manner.
I think the Micro-car will make a better print with a Canson paper because it will be a true glossy instead of the satin finish of Jon Cone Tyle 5. Also the Canson I think makes a better glow with this image.
My next experiment is to see how my street shots translate into 20x30's...
Know that the 7800 is kinda loud.
Cal
Range-rover
Veteran
Thanks for the update Cal, I'm sure the prints will be stunning! Oh Hum working
tonight so I have to get things done early today.
tonight so I have to get things done early today.
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
I think I have mined two more guests off the Piezography Forums: JD and Robert. I sent them my e-mail and await a response to add them onto the list.
Cal
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
So I screwed up the monster print somehow. A computer glitch somehow only partially covered the print with Gloss Overcoat, and a wonderful print is now $12.50 of wasted paper. I think it is a great example of what you see with just 7 shades of black and will use it as one of those samples of Bronzing and Gloss Differential. Also you can compare the blacks and details that get revealed by the Gloss Overcoat when compared to a finished print.
To recover from the loss I made another 20x30. This one of the woman with the Pit Bull that has a scarface shot bokeh style with the 35/1.8 Nikkor in LTM. What a great retro lens that works amazingly well on the Monochrom. Tonight I have to perform the Gloss Overcoat on that print.
My observations so far is that the transition to larger prints is rather jarring. It seems as detail gets revealed as a function of scale that perceived contrast seems to be less. From my analog days of printing it is almost when you hit that knee in the negative where enlargement would like a denser negative because contrast is getting washed out like on say a 20x24 inch print from a 135 negative. Anyways there is a change in perception from my 13x19 work prints where the 20x30's and larger prints no longer look like small format at all.
It does seem like any semblance of small format gets left behind when you print big and one of those artifacts is a very strong high contrast look. Anyways it is a jump in IQ to me because of detail and a clearer presentation of tonality. It is there in the small print but one has to nose the print to see it. Now it is apparent at normal viewing distances in a larger print.
The Micro-car with dusky splitone is a print that translated extreamly well. I am very-very pleased, and there are some film like qualities in this print. The Domino print I think could benefit from additional teasing out even more detail for the print size. At this level it does seem like one has to go through the expense of making full sized proofs to get to the next level. I'm not sure that a print on Canson would be better, just different for the Micro-car.
One surprise is that I can clearly see in detail a ring of lightning rods on a chim-men-knee that is about a quarter mile away on the Domino Sugar Refinery. I would want to whiten the whites that I saw on the "Monster" print to exhibit more contrast, but I would not want to modify the mids or make the blacks blacker. I'm not seeing digital artifacts.
Cal
To recover from the loss I made another 20x30. This one of the woman with the Pit Bull that has a scarface shot bokeh style with the 35/1.8 Nikkor in LTM. What a great retro lens that works amazingly well on the Monochrom. Tonight I have to perform the Gloss Overcoat on that print.
My observations so far is that the transition to larger prints is rather jarring. It seems as detail gets revealed as a function of scale that perceived contrast seems to be less. From my analog days of printing it is almost when you hit that knee in the negative where enlargement would like a denser negative because contrast is getting washed out like on say a 20x24 inch print from a 135 negative. Anyways there is a change in perception from my 13x19 work prints where the 20x30's and larger prints no longer look like small format at all.
It does seem like any semblance of small format gets left behind when you print big and one of those artifacts is a very strong high contrast look. Anyways it is a jump in IQ to me because of detail and a clearer presentation of tonality. It is there in the small print but one has to nose the print to see it. Now it is apparent at normal viewing distances in a larger print.
The Micro-car with dusky splitone is a print that translated extreamly well. I am very-very pleased, and there are some film like qualities in this print. The Domino print I think could benefit from additional teasing out even more detail for the print size. At this level it does seem like one has to go through the expense of making full sized proofs to get to the next level. I'm not sure that a print on Canson would be better, just different for the Micro-car.
One surprise is that I can clearly see in detail a ring of lightning rods on a chim-men-knee that is about a quarter mile away on the Domino Sugar Refinery. I would want to whiten the whites that I saw on the "Monster" print to exhibit more contrast, but I would not want to modify the mids or make the blacks blacker. I'm not seeing digital artifacts.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
No contact from JD or Robert yet, but I ran into Brian today.
I'll be buying some Canson Platine Fibre Rag and Canson Baryta Photographic in 24 inch rolls over the next few days. I took off work Wednesday and Thursday so I likely can concentrate on printing. At $167.00 a roll understand that you only get 16.6 24x36 inch prints on a fifty foot roll. The Jon Cone Type 5 is $200.00 a roll.
Not that I'm complaining but printing gets muy costly. I feel that I'm really hitting my stride and that my vision of photography has been enabled by printing, and printing definitely has made my photography real. Along the way I have become a better photographer.
My only wish now is if Leica creates a monochrome version of the SL, which I think they will do. My thinking is that the SL is 24 MP times 16 bit for 384 MB RAW files; my Monochrom is 18 MP times 16 bit for 288 MB RAW files. Understand that the M-246 is 24 MP, but only 14 bit for 336 MB files. The SL is a bigger jump in IQ due to just the file size.
A Monochrome SL would be a great body for the 50 Lux "E60" that I own. The rendering is very much like a 75 Lux or 80 Lux, but with the 50mm FOV.
My Monochrom would be used for wides as intended and the SL for mostly 50 and perhaps my Noct-Nikkor.
Cal
I'll be buying some Canson Platine Fibre Rag and Canson Baryta Photographic in 24 inch rolls over the next few days. I took off work Wednesday and Thursday so I likely can concentrate on printing. At $167.00 a roll understand that you only get 16.6 24x36 inch prints on a fifty foot roll. The Jon Cone Type 5 is $200.00 a roll.
Not that I'm complaining but printing gets muy costly. I feel that I'm really hitting my stride and that my vision of photography has been enabled by printing, and printing definitely has made my photography real. Along the way I have become a better photographer.
My only wish now is if Leica creates a monochrome version of the SL, which I think they will do. My thinking is that the SL is 24 MP times 16 bit for 384 MB RAW files; my Monochrom is 18 MP times 16 bit for 288 MB RAW files. Understand that the M-246 is 24 MP, but only 14 bit for 336 MB files. The SL is a bigger jump in IQ due to just the file size.
A Monochrome SL would be a great body for the 50 Lux "E60" that I own. The rendering is very much like a 75 Lux or 80 Lux, but with the 50mm FOV.
My Monochrom would be used for wides as intended and the SL for mostly 50 and perhaps my Noct-Nikkor.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
So I determined that I'm a bit crazy. The past two days I've been off and printing and already I have a dozen new prints from my 7800. I also did some maintenance (refilled carts) on my 3880 and used it to print some 13x19's. Wow it is really-really cool having two printers.
So I figure I need some way to store these big prints, and I kinda remember that 24x36 archival storage boxes are not made that large, so I go to AI Friedman and spend $328.00 on a print shipping container that is designed for 30x40 inch prints that alone weighs about 35 pounds. Loaded up with prints this shipping container will be a "mankiller." Anyways just taking this empty shipping container on the subway denotes "crazy artist." In addition I bought a 24x20 archival museum box that cost $93.00 of the $328.00. So now I am fully recognized as a "crazy artist" and one of the managers gives me the celeb-Bert-Tee treatment, and I get an unsolicited 10% discount. Anyways now I get VIP treatment at Air Friedman as well as B&H and Adorama.
So I learned that the scale of the print size has a profound effect on the contrast and my 13x19 proofs are not a strong reference any longer. I over did one print by increasing the blacks too much where I loose detail. I tried not to abuse the contrast slider because this tends to decrease mids, but I kinda figured out that there is this three way interaction betweem the blacks, whites and contrast slider that enables me to recover the tonal range displayed in my 13x19 proofs.
Really interesting of how the controls interact. The black control in LR5 actually also controls the whitepoint, and I have 20x30's that show how dramatic just a +1 increase on black has on detail and also the whites. It seems the black causes a shift of the histogram to the left, but also counterintuitively brightens the whites. To compensate for the print size increase contrast gets a +10 to +13 bump which is kinda a big leap that I even deem as aggressive. Add onto that +1 on black and +3 to +5 on the white. It seems that print size at this level expands tonal range to be a lot wider/ mucho-muy wide. Kinda loco.
So far I printed 10 24x36's, and know there are only 16 prints on a roll that costs $200.00. I'll be buying some Canson paper that only costs $167.00 a roll to save about $2.00 a print.
I've determined that the 7800 has higher resolution than the 3880. This can be easily seen on 13x19's when compared.
I finally nailed the Domino print, and for a challenge I printed the old interior Rizzolie Bookstore that is no longer (relocated in Chelsea as part of the NYC suburbanization) that was shot at 1/30 second with my retro 35/1.8 Nikkor in LTM F5.6 650 ISO.
I also will say the Micro-car under the Highline was also shot at 1/60th wide open (F2.0) with my 28 Cron with 650 ISO. These two kinda low shutter speed shots held up very well to the 20x30 image size, but know that there is a film like fine grain that is displayed that looks pretty. I really love the look of 650 ISO on the MM. 320 ISO is mucho clean, but 650 ISO hints of film, especially with retro glass. Hmmm...
In hindsight I should of loaded up more with 24 inch rolls rather than 17 inch rolls. I figured out that I can print two 13.3x20 inch images at the same time on a 24x36 and have exhibition borders that minimally will be at least 2 inches and also allow for added space for a signature/date on landscape shots. Mark Cuban would say, "Go big or don't go." I expect this weekend I will easily kill my first 24 inch roll. Know that tomorrow I will have the 7800 online for one week.
I guess all the printing I performed over the past year and a quarter is paying off because It is not difficult to exceed any expectaions I previously had. The prints are amazing... Really crushes all my earlier work. Anyways a year and a half of just making work prints really paid off.
Cal
So I figure I need some way to store these big prints, and I kinda remember that 24x36 archival storage boxes are not made that large, so I go to AI Friedman and spend $328.00 on a print shipping container that is designed for 30x40 inch prints that alone weighs about 35 pounds. Loaded up with prints this shipping container will be a "mankiller." Anyways just taking this empty shipping container on the subway denotes "crazy artist." In addition I bought a 24x20 archival museum box that cost $93.00 of the $328.00. So now I am fully recognized as a "crazy artist" and one of the managers gives me the celeb-Bert-Tee treatment, and I get an unsolicited 10% discount. Anyways now I get VIP treatment at Air Friedman as well as B&H and Adorama.
So I learned that the scale of the print size has a profound effect on the contrast and my 13x19 proofs are not a strong reference any longer. I over did one print by increasing the blacks too much where I loose detail. I tried not to abuse the contrast slider because this tends to decrease mids, but I kinda figured out that there is this three way interaction betweem the blacks, whites and contrast slider that enables me to recover the tonal range displayed in my 13x19 proofs.
Really interesting of how the controls interact. The black control in LR5 actually also controls the whitepoint, and I have 20x30's that show how dramatic just a +1 increase on black has on detail and also the whites. It seems the black causes a shift of the histogram to the left, but also counterintuitively brightens the whites. To compensate for the print size increase contrast gets a +10 to +13 bump which is kinda a big leap that I even deem as aggressive. Add onto that +1 on black and +3 to +5 on the white. It seems that print size at this level expands tonal range to be a lot wider/ mucho-muy wide. Kinda loco.
So far I printed 10 24x36's, and know there are only 16 prints on a roll that costs $200.00. I'll be buying some Canson paper that only costs $167.00 a roll to save about $2.00 a print.
I've determined that the 7800 has higher resolution than the 3880. This can be easily seen on 13x19's when compared.
I finally nailed the Domino print, and for a challenge I printed the old interior Rizzolie Bookstore that is no longer (relocated in Chelsea as part of the NYC suburbanization) that was shot at 1/30 second with my retro 35/1.8 Nikkor in LTM F5.6 650 ISO.
I also will say the Micro-car under the Highline was also shot at 1/60th wide open (F2.0) with my 28 Cron with 650 ISO. These two kinda low shutter speed shots held up very well to the 20x30 image size, but know that there is a film like fine grain that is displayed that looks pretty. I really love the look of 650 ISO on the MM. 320 ISO is mucho clean, but 650 ISO hints of film, especially with retro glass. Hmmm...
In hindsight I should of loaded up more with 24 inch rolls rather than 17 inch rolls. I figured out that I can print two 13.3x20 inch images at the same time on a 24x36 and have exhibition borders that minimally will be at least 2 inches and also allow for added space for a signature/date on landscape shots. Mark Cuban would say, "Go big or don't go." I expect this weekend I will easily kill my first 24 inch roll. Know that tomorrow I will have the 7800 online for one week.
I guess all the printing I performed over the past year and a quarter is paying off because It is not difficult to exceed any expectaions I previously had. The prints are amazing... Really crushes all my earlier work. Anyways a year and a half of just making work prints really paid off.
Cal
icebear
Veteran
LOL, I guess that doesn't really surprise most of us 😉.
I'd say some call that crazy but you can also call it dedication.
I'm really looking forward to your presentation at ICP and actually seeing those prints.
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
Klaus,
I think you will be very surprised. The earlier prints you have seen I've always called "work prints." It seems that when you print on a true large format printer the IQ gets a lot higher. There is a bit of a jump in resolution even in the small prints 13x19. LOL.
Then in 20x30 or 22 1/2 X 34 1/2 ("Monster prints") there is even more detail and only recently discovered even more broader range of tonality. Basically I'm uncompressing the tonal range by expanding both the blacks and highlights.
The level of fine detail is very "German" if you know what I mean. In the Domino Sugar Refinery landscape I took notice that I can see a ring of lightning rods surrounding a brick chimney that is about a quarter mile away. Also know that it was shot with a 28 Cron which makes it even more remarkable being a wide angle lens. I went and looked on a tiny 8 1/2x11 print, and I could see traces of the lightning rods that I never knew were there, but in the large prints it is just one of those fine details that make a large print seem like large format.
Also know I have similarly sized prints from Digital Silver Imaging that cost $450.00 a piece. 24x36 images printed on 30x40 paper for a true "Monster Class" silver wet print on fiber. The prints speak for themselves. Really crazy is how a hose-bag like me can afford the best.
More about this shot: I've been documenting the demolition of this waterfront landmark for many years. I once live nearby when the refinery was actually running which is like living right next to a bomb factory because sugar refineries are known to explode and kill people.
Anyways I have this perch on the Williamsburg Bridge where I climb this railing and lean out to clear the case-sone so it is noth in my shot. Know that I'm a scared of heights because when I was a kid I fell from a tree and landed on my head, so leaning out where if I fell I would land about 200 feet below onto South 3rd Street below and would become a big orange sponge. I got a great arial view from this vantage point, but someone must of reported me because now that great vantage point is now sealed off with a chain link fence.
Now you can't kill yourself even if you wanted to. LOL. Anyways I miss the old New York that wasn't safe for the wealthy and hipsters.
Cal
KM-25
Well-known
Man....that is a lot of verbose tech talk, lol!
Not a path I am ever going to be interested in going down in terms of fine art printing ( 100% analog for mio ) but sounds like a good opportunity for those in attendance to glean some beta in that vein. Hope the printed images from strictly a seen & shot / impact of mastery aspect are good too though.
Good luck either way, ICP is an awesome asset in the photo world.
Not a path I am ever going to be interested in going down in terms of fine art printing ( 100% analog for mio ) but sounds like a good opportunity for those in attendance to glean some beta in that vein. Hope the printed images from strictly a seen & shot / impact of mastery aspect are good too though.
Good luck either way, ICP is an awesome asset in the photo world.
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
KM,
The path gets slippery from here. It seems that all these Diafine negatives I have with extended range and detail are a source of material to mine.
It seems I can print more information with Piezography digitally than wet printing. I never thought I would consider going figital.
Cal
KM-25
Well-known
It's not an unusual path these days by any stretch, I am just all analog or nothing at this point for fine art at least.
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
KM,
Funny thing is I was a B&W film guy exclusively too. I still shoot mucho film: nothing like it.
Cal
Calzone
Gear Whore #1
So I learned that some images are not detailed enough to print 20x30. It seems the big prints don't lie and printing big is really-really hard to do well in a fine art manner.
With "Sal" a portrait of a 68 year old man who lived on 106th Street in East Harlem for over 40 years a 20x30 was not the best presentation of the image. The image looked more like a cartoon where detail got washed out, and the smaller print that could be handheld established intimacy and warmth that got dileuted in the larger print. Oh-well. BTW I also call this print "Landscape-Face" because Sal formerly was a boxer back in the day when "Fight Clubs" were popular in NYC. His face is of a man who has had a hard life.
I also experimented with format. 13.31x20 on 18.31x24 paper seems like a Gold-E-lox size that exploits a custom size allowed through the use of rolled paper I can have my printer cut to size.
I will also be printing 13x19.5 on 17x24.5 to consume all the 17 inch rolls I bulked up on. Basically not much difference in print size and I'm able to maintain broad 2 inch borders that allow the print space to breath.
For you square shooters (George, Andre) I made 17 inch square to print 13 inch squares, and 24x24 to print bigger with wonderful big borders.
At this point it makes sense to convert my 3880 into a color printer. My intent is to go with Jon Cone Pigment inks which is basically a clone of Epson K3 inkset but cost effective due to refillable carts and buying ink in bulk. A bonus is that I can use my 7800 to Gloss Overcoat color prints to increase detail and saturation.
Cal
With "Sal" a portrait of a 68 year old man who lived on 106th Street in East Harlem for over 40 years a 20x30 was not the best presentation of the image. The image looked more like a cartoon where detail got washed out, and the smaller print that could be handheld established intimacy and warmth that got dileuted in the larger print. Oh-well. BTW I also call this print "Landscape-Face" because Sal formerly was a boxer back in the day when "Fight Clubs" were popular in NYC. His face is of a man who has had a hard life.
I also experimented with format. 13.31x20 on 18.31x24 paper seems like a Gold-E-lox size that exploits a custom size allowed through the use of rolled paper I can have my printer cut to size.
I will also be printing 13x19.5 on 17x24.5 to consume all the 17 inch rolls I bulked up on. Basically not much difference in print size and I'm able to maintain broad 2 inch borders that allow the print space to breath.
For you square shooters (George, Andre) I made 17 inch square to print 13 inch squares, and 24x24 to print bigger with wonderful big borders.
At this point it makes sense to convert my 3880 into a color printer. My intent is to go with Jon Cone Pigment inks which is basically a clone of Epson K3 inkset but cost effective due to refillable carts and buying ink in bulk. A bonus is that I can use my 7800 to Gloss Overcoat color prints to increase detail and saturation.
Cal
