Are Kievs actually cameras?

KoNickon said:
Exactly! And have the benefit of dealing with an even older camera....
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You can get a Genuine Contax overhauled... here Zeiss Ikon Contax Camera Repair, but it will cost around $400, and have a waiting list 3 years long... BUT... it will come back like new or better...
Henry will not repair FSU Kievs!

So, buy a Genuine Contax II or IIa, CHEAP, and send him an email to get on the waiting list.
 
I like the Bessa suggestion most. As I mentioned, I abandoned my quite short Contax/Kiev exploration and stuck with Leica and Leica-like gear (for rangefinder). I do own Bessa gear (LTM/M) and find it wonderful to use. I just wish the RF baselength was longer... Anyway, the Contax and Kiev *look* great in the camera display case in my front room.
 
I owned fully functioned 4am from e-bay.
Only have to fix multiple-light leaks.
This and focusing turned me off quickly from Kiev's system.
My family FED-2 is leaks free, shutter replaced only once and it works as it should.
 
As was stated earlier, some of them work well as cameras and some of them work well as paperweights, doorstops or bookends. You could probably lash a few together and use that rig as a decent smallcraft anchor.

I would have no hesitation buying a Kiev II from the 1950s. The QC was better then and the cameras had better materials. There is also a much greater chance that any CLA will actually "stick" and the camera will work reliably for quite some time.

The 4, 4A and 4AM I would personally pass on but many folks have had good experiences with them. If I were going to get a cheap rangefinder from the 70s or 80s it would have to be something from Japan or maybe Germany.

Phil Forrest
 
I bought a late-'70s 4a (not the best period) from a reputable New York dealer, mainly because I'd always been curious about what a Contax was like to use compared to an LTM Leica. (Contaxes were out of my price range, needless to say.) The Kiev was fine mechanically, but the first roll showed it had a light leak, which seems to be a special feature on many Kievs. The dealer fixed the leak under his guarantee, and the camera has been working well ever since.
The wide-base rangefinder makes focusing accurate and, unlike many, I like using the focus wheel with the 50mm lens.
 
My experience has been the opposite, I bought a 1936 Contax II in excellent condition, I thought and it looked, but it soon failed with both tapes gone. Took a long while and some money to get it going again and I was told that the inside was badly worn out. Luckily a set of new but old Kiev parts were found and the thing was rebuilt. And I've this Kiev 2 (the one with the foot) and am pleased with it, although typing that is tempting fate.

Regards, David
 
I have a 2a and 4a and both perform flawlessly.. Most Russiam sellers know you won't return because of the high cost of doing so so they will describe them as working when in fact they are dead.. That's why I quit buying from them..
 
I've never owned a Russian made camera but I came across this statement in an eBay auction for Smena 8m which seems to be a common theme with Russian cameras:

"Did I mention that these Russian cameras always break your heart in the end?"
 
This discussion is interesting. I have always secertly wanted a Fed 2, an early one without selftimer and the small advance knob. They look so clean and tidy and the one I had in my hand was very quiet. Also they have no slow speeds to gum up and a long RF base. Now the question, are they just as bad as the Kiev? Will I have to try 5 or 6 to find a working copy that won't explode?
 
The FED 2 is as reliable as a brick, largely because it is only slightly more complicated. Combine that with a good long-base combined viewfinder/rangefinder, decent build quality and attractive styling, and you have a very nice camera for a pittance.

Cheers,
Dez
 
Long ago I was tempted to try Russian camera equipment- I tried a couple of Jupiter 50mm lenses- one was total junk- focus was so gummed up that you would un-screw the lens trying to focus it. The other Jupiter was decent- it was a late black version- it had some issues with up-close focus. The camera I tried was the interesting Droog- google it- I wanted to love it but it smelled of WD-40 - or whatever the Russian equal is called:rolleyes: It jammed up after a few hours of use...I got my money back.

All of these were shipped from Russia- I told myself NO MORE although I always wanted to try the Leningrad and the 85mm Jupiters.

I think you can get lucky, but you have to lower your expectations;)
 
OK, not a RF, but I have an ARAX, Hasselblad knockoff, coming from Kiev. And i pimped it out so it wasn't cheap. And I hope I don't have to fight with it too much. :D

Bessa's are a dream. Great little cameras with a shutter that's like, "I don't care. I'm not a Leica."
 
Hi,

OK it's a little bit of luck that's needed but we are not walking into a flash store and buying new equipment from a guy/girl in a dark blue suit, etc. etc. and getting a 3 year guarantee.

Realise that you are buying a second-hand, very elderly camera from someone you've never seen before and do a bit of thinking and you should be OK.

My rule is to buy good looking ones (no dents, scratches etc) and pay as little as possible and then get it checked and sorted out by one of the experts. Total cost will still be low and you'll have a decent camera that you know will work and you'll know who to go to if it isn't sorted out properly. It's as simple as that...

As for the FED 2, and a Jupiter-8 or Industar 26 etc, once checked and perhaps* sorted out, you can't go wrong. As CRF's go there's little to beat them within double or treble the price. Or 4 or 5 times the price if we are thinking about repairs!

And if you don't believe me, go and look at the elderly Leica's costs and problems in the forums and ask around about repair costs. Here's a clue I was once quoted 150 GBP for shutter blinds (and even worse for the labour involved fitting them) and Oleg does them for USD 8 (and 48) 'nuff said?

Regards, David

* Most people seem to be lucky with them.
 
Mike is hungry said:
I've never owned a Russian made camera but I came across this statement in an eBay auction for Smena 8m which seems to be a common theme with Russian cameras:

"Did I mention that these Russian cameras always break your heart in the end?"
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Ah, but Kievs are NOT Russian cameras. They're Ukrainian. ;-)

Ronnie
 
zuiko85 said:
This discussion is interesting. I have always secertly wanted a Fed 2, an early one without selftimer and the small advance knob. They look so clean and tidy and the one I had in my hand was very quiet. Also they have no slow speeds to gum up and a long RF base. Now the question, are they just as bad as the Kiev? Will I have to try 5 or 6 to find a working copy that won't explode?
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I've had several Feds and they all worked reliably. Even the 5c which has absurdly awful build quality worked fine.

The Kievs on the other hand, they look nice but they don't work.
 
The Feds are such robust, simple machines you don't need a repair manual to get em running again. Just invest in good "micro" tools. Seriously, there's so little to go wrong and the design is so "industrial" that I think my Feds may be the most reliable cameras I own. And I own a lot! of cameras.
The Fed2 has a wonderful long RF base and elegant simplicity. No slow speeds and a top speed of 1/500 is only slightly limiting. I have 1 or 2 of these guys and they do see occasional use (I'm partial to my Leicas and Bessas).
If you don't want to get ripped off by an unscrupulous FSU seller (I know there are good ones too), you can go with the Fedka route. Fedka might charge more than the unknown Ukrainian seller, but you *will* receive a nice working camera. And if it isn't, Yuri (Fedka) will find you one that is. Just looked at his website. Body only: $80.
 
Kievs are cameras as much as the original Contax II was a camera, and the Contax II was a pricey top shelf and very desirable camera in the late 1930s and through the 1940s.

With the Kievs one has to luck into a good specimen first and foremost and then it has to be well maintained, so in this last regard it is no different than a 75 year old Contax II camera when expecting reliability for normal use now.


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ronnies said:
Ah, but Kievs are NOT Russian cameras. They're Ukrainian. ;-)

Ronnie
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a complicated answer...

The Ukraine was separate, but alined with Soviet Russia Rule of Law..So, it was like a Territory with partial Russian ties for it's industrial advantage that Russia benefited from, among other things.. The Ukrainians also needed Russia to help their economic growth.

So, yes it was and was not a Russian state.

During WWII, the Russians acquired the Zeiss Contax factory that was moved to Kiev along with Zeiss Techs.. Late 1940's.
The 1st few years of the Keiv RF where 100% Zeiss parts, just not assembled with the tighter tolerances that the Contax Assembly line did... (5000 units a year for the Keiv, vs 500 units a year for the Contax)
 
Last year I've got a Kiev 4 (with the meter) from the early sixties from a friend from Russia. It worked perfectly, even the meter, but the inside of the viewfinder needed cleaning. So I undertook this adventure with the aid of instructions I found on the web. When I lifted the top plate it became clear that the whole thing was soaked with oil. The oil dripped out. Slowly the shutter curtains became one big oily mess. The oil also dripped out of the frame-counter.
With lots of patience I dried all the parts with paper towels. The thing appears to be alright now. Every day I fire the shutter serveral times. I hope the oil will not desintegrate the ribbons of the shutter. We will see!

Kiev 4, Jupiter 50mm f/2, Tmax400.

Erik.

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DNG said:
a complicated answer...

The Ukraine was separate, but alined with Soviet Russia Rule of Law..So, it was like a Territory with partial Russian ties for it's industrial advantage that Russia benefited from, among other things.. The Ukrainians also needed Russia to help their economic growth.

So, yes it was and was not a Russian state.

During WWII, the Russians acquired the Zeiss Contax factory that was moved to Kiev along with Zeiss Techs.. Late 1940's.
The 1st few years of the Keiv RF where 100% Zeiss parts, just not assembled with the tighter tolerances that the Contax Assembly line did... (5000 units a year for the Keiv, vs 500 units a year for the Contax)
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It is, definitely, a very complicated answer. Since factory was moved by Soviet Army to the territory of Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, which was part of Soviet Union, it makes Kiev either Soviet or Ukrainian camera, but definitely not Russian.

As far, as Kiev and Contax cameras go, I have several Kievs and Contaxes, and I enjoy using them very much. Of course, I have had shutter ribbons replaced in both Contax and Kiev cameras, and I had to replace a whole shutter assembly in another Kiev, but that was due to incompetent repair. Over all, I would have to say, Kiev cameras are about as reliable as Fed, Zorki, Contax, Leica, Pentax, Nikon, Voigtlander, Tanack, and any other 60-100 years old camera. It might need service to work properly.
 
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