Audiophiles - Power Conditioners?

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photogdave

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Hey RFF audiophiles, I have a question.
Do you use power conditioners? Why or why not, and if so, what brand?
I live in a 40+ year-old building and the power does seem to fluctuate a little bit judging from the flicker ing light, but no black outs yet.
I'm running a fairly new Denon 7.1 receiver, B&W 300 series speakers, phono preamp for the turntable, and a Panasonic 1080i HD CRT television. Here are some of the products I'm looking at:
http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=J10BLK
http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=J10BLK
Any opinions/comments are most welcome. :cool:
cheers!
Dave
 
photogdave said:
Hey RFF audiophiles, I have a question.
Do you use power conditioners? Why or why not, and if so, what brand?
Click to expand...

The power going to our house is quite spotty, and I've used a PS Audio Power Plant for many years with good results. PS Audio. It basically takes the power going into your home and "regenerates" a nice clean AC waveform, which I think gives more consistent results than trying to "filter" the noise from your lines, but is definitely a more expensive solution. Looking at their site, the prices on these things have really gone up since I bought mine many years ago, but maybe you can pick up a used one somewhere. Traditional line conditioners are definitely cheaper - maybe no harm in trying that first.
 
I think SG still has the OT threads only showing up under the forum heading or when you click "new posts" - keeps the trolls at bay.

I don't use a power conditioner on my system. The mid-priced consumer models (Monster, e.g.) are glorified Zap-Nots, IMO. There are power systems out there designed to deliver a pure, regulated sine wave (see Pauls post - PS Audio is one of several) but they are more money than I need to spend.

I rely on the reactance of the transformers in the power supplies of the various components to deliver properly regulated power to the electronics. I do have surge protectors on the mains, but I have spend my money shielding my cabling against RFI - this provided immediate and noticible sonic benefit.
 
Thanks for the replies guys. I'm struggling a bit with the price of the higher end ones too. I think I'm more interested in the surge protection aspect than the potential improvement in sound quality. I guess I'm wondering if my components are susceptible to any real damage from power fluctuation. Am I worrying too much?
 
photogdave said:
Thanks for the replies guys. I'm struggling a bit with the price of the higher end ones too. I think I'm more interested in the surge protection aspect than the potential improvement in sound quality. I guess I'm wondering if my components are susceptible to any real damage from power fluctuation. Am I worrying too much?
Click to expand...

Routine fluctuations are probably not dangerous, but a large power spike (like during a storm) can fry your electronics, although I'm not sure that this is a common occurrence. Getting surge protection is not too expensive , but you will likely pay more for better protection. The really inexpensive ones running $5-10 probably offer very little protection. The cheapest protection is just to unplug your equipment when its not being used, but that's sort of a pain :)
 
Hi,
I use a Panamax power conditioner for my office sound system and a Monster in my home AV system, both relatively cheap and effective for surge protection and filtering, but the Linn components (Majik, LK100, Genki. LP12) in my home stereo system don't take to power conditioning very well at all. The effect is quite catastropohic and the sound becomes thin and lifeless (kinda like MP3...). However, those Linn components with interchangeable power cords sound great when you swap out the standard cords for WireWorld Aurora cords.
 
Hmmm that's worrying. I though the filtering was supposed to improve sound quality. I wonder how my relatively low end B&H speakers and Denon receiver would handle this?
 
...it make sence to clean the AC, but the "high end" products are a joke for the price...
..inside you need only 4 parts you can buy for 15 $....:p

regards,

Jan......"Telewatt"...you can google....for the best German Tube amp ever made..:D
 
Hi photogdave,
I've been a customer at a local stereo shop (a real brick and mortar place, but not a Big Box chain store) for years and I've been able to borrow various components (except for big expensive stuff which they gladly demo for me in dedicated sound rooms) , new or used, to try out at home. I usually get very good advice on many pieces of equipment that I've considered purchasing, but usually the guys I deal with tell me to try things out and listen for myself. Pays in many ways to establish a relationship with a shop like that. Even though my stereo system in only "entry level" I often get welcomed with a cup of tea and invited to listen to their latest megabuck system that they're trying out in the store.

I notice you're in Vancouver - I'm in Victoria. I used to check out The Sound Room and Sound Plus when I was in town, but I haven't been to those places in awhile. You might phone around to see what shops carry a good range (from budget audiophile to high end) of components that also allows trade-ins and has a decent selection of used items. But beware, audiophile GAS is very contagious...
 
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Yes, you can build a power conditioner with a high-current inductor in series with a transorb bridge for about $20 in parts* (without a box, cords and plug). This setup generates a lot of heat, though, and is not suitable for some high-end gear - stuff with a bank of huge power caps will just starve when the bass kicks in and asks for all the available DC.

And that's the point here - power conditioners are unnecessary in most situations because the power circuit in all gear is designed to take AC and turn it into clean, regulated DC - even "dirty" AC. Dirty waveforms are irrelevant, and AC line noise does not get through - except in the case of ground loops. That's a whole 'nother problem, and if you have ground loop noise most power conditioners won't help.

I'ts my experience that there is no difference in sound through average gear with and without a moderately-priced power conditioner - period.

The conditioner looks cool though, and will maintain 120V 60Hz through moderate voltage spikes and short-duration brown-outs, but don't expect one to save your stuff from a lightning strike.

* Yes - you can make a power conditioner with cheap parts, but really effective inductors run about $40-$50 a pop at surplus, and you need at least two for the circuit.
 
foto_fool said:
Yes, you can build a power conditioner with a high-current inductor in series with a transorb bridge for about $20 in parts* (without a box, cords and plug). This setup generates a lot of heat, though, and is not suitable for some high-end gear - stuff with a bank of huge power caps will just starve when the bass kicks in and asks for all the available DC.

And that's the point here - power conditioners are unnecessary in most situations because the power circuit in all gear is designed to take AC and turn it into clean, regulated DC - even "dirty" AC. Dirty waveforms are irrelevant, and AC line noise does not get through - except in the case of ground loops. That's a whole 'nother problem, and if you have ground loop noise most power conditioners won't help.

I'ts my experience that there is no difference in sound through average gear with and without a moderately-priced power conditioner - period.

The conditioner looks cool though, and will maintain 120V 60Hz through moderate voltage spikes and short-duration brown-outs, but don't expect one to save your stuff from a lightning strike.

* Yes - you can make a power conditioner with cheap parts, but really effective inductors run about $40-$50 a pop at surplus, and you need at least two for the circuit.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info! I'm not handy enough to build anything myself but the APC units I linked in my first post aren't terribly expensive - $300-400 roughly. Is that paying too much for what amounts to a cool looking surge protector? The more expensive one has battery backup.
 
Hi Dave,
I'm not much of a DIY'er either... My suggestion is to ask HiFi Centre if you can borrow an APC unit, a Panamax, a Monster Cable or whatever makes they happen to carry in a price range you think you can afford (don't overlook the budget end). Just plug in your components one at a time into each unit, then sit back, watch your favourite movie and listen to really familiar pieces of music. Plug in different combinations of components, do your testing at different times of the day (when people are running dishwashers, washing machines, etc.) or night when it's quieter, take your time. Watch and listen for which conditioner actually improves your AV system. You might be surprised at how little you have to spend.
Have fun,

Chris.
 
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