csaunders
f8 and be there.
Hi all,
First post here. Sorry if it ends up long-winded! Been reading for a while but never had a reason to write. Until now.
I recently stepped up and purchased a Zeiss Ikon ZM and a 50/2 Planar, which is a big investment for me; being only a hobbyist.
I already own an F100 and a Yashicamat TLR; but I wanted a small discreet camera to take to Europe on a upcoming trip for street photography.
Anyways; I bought the camera second-hand (perfect condition), and out the box it was a joy to behold. Shot, developed and scanned a couple of rolls of Tmax 400 immediately and they were amazing.
That night; I lost the lens cap. It rolled off in a pub and I couldn't find it. It did seem a bit crap to me anyway; didn't grip anywhere near as well as the lens cap on my Nikon; so I was kinda glad to be rid of it; no more stressing about it.
Then, a week later; the diopter fell off the viewfinder. Again, after I realised I had lost I tried to retrace my steps but it was gone.
Then, two days later I glanced down at the camera and the sun was striking the lens at a particular angle which revealed a 6mm white hair in the shutter. I thought "I must take the lens off and clean that off when I get home". I got home and took the lens off only to discover that this massive hair was INSIDE the lens! Near the rear elements (currently organising a swap with Zeiss).
Finally, I have now noticed that the silver paint is flaking off near the tripod mount. It doesn't appear to be progressing but is potentially not a good sign for the future?
Now there's two ways to look at this:
1) I've had all my bad luck to begin and now it's all smooth sailing from here for the next 20 years
2) This camera is the biggest waste of my money ever!
I REALLY want to like this camera and the photos I have taken with it so far are wonderful, but what do you guys reckon of the above?
-Christian
First post here. Sorry if it ends up long-winded! Been reading for a while but never had a reason to write. Until now.
I recently stepped up and purchased a Zeiss Ikon ZM and a 50/2 Planar, which is a big investment for me; being only a hobbyist.
I already own an F100 and a Yashicamat TLR; but I wanted a small discreet camera to take to Europe on a upcoming trip for street photography.
Anyways; I bought the camera second-hand (perfect condition), and out the box it was a joy to behold. Shot, developed and scanned a couple of rolls of Tmax 400 immediately and they were amazing.
That night; I lost the lens cap. It rolled off in a pub and I couldn't find it. It did seem a bit crap to me anyway; didn't grip anywhere near as well as the lens cap on my Nikon; so I was kinda glad to be rid of it; no more stressing about it.
Then, a week later; the diopter fell off the viewfinder. Again, after I realised I had lost I tried to retrace my steps but it was gone.
Then, two days later I glanced down at the camera and the sun was striking the lens at a particular angle which revealed a 6mm white hair in the shutter. I thought "I must take the lens off and clean that off when I get home". I got home and took the lens off only to discover that this massive hair was INSIDE the lens! Near the rear elements (currently organising a swap with Zeiss).
Finally, I have now noticed that the silver paint is flaking off near the tripod mount. It doesn't appear to be progressing but is potentially not a good sign for the future?
Now there's two ways to look at this:
1) I've had all my bad luck to begin and now it's all smooth sailing from here for the next 20 years
2) This camera is the biggest waste of my money ever!
I REALLY want to like this camera and the photos I have taken with it so far are wonderful, but what do you guys reckon of the above?
-Christian
troym
Established
How are the pictures you've taken so far? (Meaning, was the hair there when you got the lens?)
kshapero
South Florida Man
ZI is very fine equipment. Raise hell if needed and keep it forever.
csaunders
f8 and be there.
troym said:
To be perfectly honest; apart from a cursory look at the gear when it arrived, I didn't inspect it thoroughly. Inexperience! I'm not sure if the hair was always there or if it has just cropped up; I've only had the camera three weeks now.
The two rolls I've developed so far show no signs of the hair; but they were all shot at f4 and below. I have since shot some blank white walls and into the sun at f22 to see if the hair will show.
It's not so much of a big deal since Zeiss are going to fix it; but it just makes me nervous; which is nothing I've ever felt about my F100...
Should I be worried about taking it away for 12 weeks as my only camera? I know I shouldn't feel like this about a Zeiss...
-Christian
back alley
IMAGES
i have had 2 zi cameras.
the first one arrived with infinity focus off.
it was exchanged for another perfect camera body and i have had no problems since.
the second body arrived in perfect shape, i used it for awhile without incident and then sold it to another member here who i have not heard any complaints from.
i have had 4 zm lenses, all bought new.
the 50/2 planar arrived with the aperture blades out of whack and it was exchanged for another which worked perfectly and then i sold that one, preferring to keep the 50/1.5 as my only zm 50.
i currently shoot with a silver zi and 25/35/50 zm lenses. no problems...
the first one arrived with infinity focus off.
it was exchanged for another perfect camera body and i have had no problems since.
the second body arrived in perfect shape, i used it for awhile without incident and then sold it to another member here who i have not heard any complaints from.
i have had 4 zm lenses, all bought new.
the 50/2 planar arrived with the aperture blades out of whack and it was exchanged for another which worked perfectly and then i sold that one, preferring to keep the 50/1.5 as my only zm 50.
i currently shoot with a silver zi and 25/35/50 zm lenses. no problems...
sepiareverb
genius and moron
I've had nothing go wrong with either of my ZM lenses nor the 25/28 VF. I too dropped the lenscap my first day out with the 25- must be something in the design of those caps- that slightly convex surface perhaps?
In my experience Zeiss has been very good to deal with (as has Leica). I would voice your concerns directly with them and hear what they have to say about the finish problems. I wouldn't be surprised if they make it right.
In my experience Zeiss has been very good to deal with (as has Leica). I would voice your concerns directly with them and hear what they have to say about the finish problems. I wouldn't be surprised if they make it right.
Krosya
Konicaze
Sorry to hear about your poor luck with ZI/ZM. I only have a Planar and it's a fine lens, but more and more stories come up about different issues with Zeiss products. I suppose many people are more patient than I would be in some of these cases. And after reading all these stories I question more and more their quality control - all that " each item is inspected and signed for" - doesn't seem to work too well. It's too bad - they have great ideas/designs and when they work - they work well. I really wanted to try a ZI, yet I'm more and more glad that I went with Leica M6 at that time. Good luck and if I were you - I'd demand a whole new set from Zeiss, which was checked for sure - it's too expensive of an item to have such a poor and sloppy quality. One thing seems to be on your side - from other accounts Zeiss often tries to make their customers happy, so you may have a chance. I was hoping they would just do it right to begin with.
Krosya
Konicaze
Actually, I have a follow-up question to other members here. Since I don't have enough knowledge in this department. How likely is it for a hair to get inside a lens? I have never had that happen with any other lens. Since I got the same lens - Planar ZM, can I expect it as well? Or, if not possible and it happened during assembly at Cosina, what about that QC, where they claim to inspect each item and sign for it? Which is it? But either way it makes me a bit uncomfortable with their product.
csaunders
f8 and be there.
I think I better clarify a few things here:Krosya said:
1) I LOVE using this camera. It has a real feel of quality to it. I have never held or used a Leica before; but I can't understand how people can think that this camera is 'too light' or not sturdy enough. It is as solid as a rock and I certainly wouldn't want to carry anything heavier at this size. Otherwise, what's the point?
2) I don't think it can be Ziess' fault that I lost the lens cap and the diopter; that is just plain bad luck...
3) It takes great pictures; see attached.
As far as the hair in the lens goes; from my limited reading, it is apparently VERY unlikely that it got in there post-manufacturing. The gaps are just too tight. It does make me wonder how it did get in there though, and if it was there from the start or has got dislodged with use. How did it get past QC?
Zeiss are being VERY good, and considering I am in Australia which has no real support/distribution network they are sorting it out.
As far as 'raising hell' goes, as per the suggestions of some posters, I don't feel that I have the right as I did buy this camera second hand, and although it was claimed to be 'only one roll through it' who really knows? Maybe that's how the hair got in there...?
Seems to me that perhaps all brands/prices of cameras a liable to have problems of some sorts; but this is the first time it's happened to me and I feel it has soured my experience a little of this otherwise wonderful camera...
Am I being completely anal?
back alley
IMAGES
if you look through the posts here at rff and other sites, you will find just as many posts about leica and it's lack of quality also, faceplates falling off etc.
my point is most new gear will have some duds among the pack.
my point is most new gear will have some duds among the pack.
elude
Some photographer
I've lost my lens cap too, and wasn't surprised at all, it was ****ty.
gb hill
Veteran
Your not experiencing bad luck. You bought the camera to take to the streets. It's just developing it's own personality thats all. Here is what a good street camera should look like.
BTW fantastic pics. & nice bokah on that last shot.
http://cameraquest.com/LeicaM4G.htm
BTW fantastic pics. & nice bokah on that last shot.http://cameraquest.com/LeicaM4G.htm
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retow
Well-known
Got a new Zeiss Ikon with the 50 Sonnar about 10 days ago and after a few days noticed that the lens mount ring shows already strong marks/gauges of 360 degrees. Besides the Sonnar, only one Leica lens was mounted on the ZI. The mount rings of my M6 and M8 showed no marks or signs of wear, although especially the M8 having been used quite extensively over the last 6 months. Being a curious person, I decided to mount the Sonnar cautiously on the M6, to learn that the culprit is the Sonnar's mount, ie it scratched the M6 lens mount as well.
My first experience with Zeiss products is quite mixed, the ZI handles like a dream and the mechanical and optical quality of the Sonnar seems compelling. However, the ZI mount ring seems to be of inferior material as compared to Leica's. And Zeiss' QC has potential for improvement. Will send the Sonnar to Popflash for replacement and also expect them to replace the ZI's lens mount.
My first experience with Zeiss products is quite mixed, the ZI handles like a dream and the mechanical and optical quality of the Sonnar seems compelling. However, the ZI mount ring seems to be of inferior material as compared to Leica's. And Zeiss' QC has potential for improvement. Will send the Sonnar to Popflash for replacement and also expect them to replace the ZI's lens mount.
back alley
IMAGES
i have no marks on my zi mount, all lenses, including the sonnar go on very smoothly.
CorreCaminos
CorreCaminos
I recently bought a new Zeiss 50mm Planar and had to return it to B&H immediately. The rear element had lots of spots on it (as if someone had sneezed on it) but what was more troubling was the large black spec inside the lens (on the back of the front element).
I love the Zeiss glass on my Hasselblad but for now I'm staying away from the Zeiss M-mount lenses. Hopefully, QC will improve and try again in a year or so.
I love the Zeiss glass on my Hasselblad but for now I'm staying away from the Zeiss M-mount lenses. Hopefully, QC will improve and try again in a year or so.
csaunders
f8 and be there.
gb hill said:Your not experiencing bad luck. You bought the camera to take to the streets. It's just developing it's own personality thats all. Here is what a good street camera should look like.
http://cameraquest.com/LeicaM4G.htm
Thanks for the link; that camera has sure seen some use! And I like your comment about it developing its own personality.
Today I recieved a new diopter from Robert White, so the camera is officially back in action again (althought I have been using it without).
Zeiss have organised for me to exchange my lens with hair for a hairless lens while I'm in Spain in a couple of weeks. No questions asked. They really did provide excellent customer service.
I hope that these are the only problems I have with the camera, and in fact I have such faith that I am taking it away as my only body for 12 weeks... tell me I'm crazy?