Bellows rubber sealant paint issue.

[Guest]

I have what I believe is a light issue, bouncing in the bellows of my late Fathers Zeiss Super Ikonta 531/2.
I had a bellows light leak and used a rubber compound to repair the pin holes. Did a film check and fixed it, film check done on a dull day.
Well on sunny exposures, I have discovered what I believe to be the light, reflecting off the film back towards the rubber sealant (that I admit has dried rather shiny) it hits the sealant then bounces back onto the film and is leaving a shadow of a corner from the bellows on the negative.
So what I am looking for is a dull flat black paint that will stick to this shiny rubber.
Any boffins out there with a helpful solution, it will have to flex with the rubber

The once flat black paint that covers the metal frame for the film, is also a possible problem as it is now starting to shine as well. Now a dull paint for that does not need to be flexible. I suppose I could mask everything off and use an automobile spray can to paint that part.

So there it is, any help or suggestions will be greatly appreciated. I want to keep this beautiful camera in use, she really is in excellent condition and I serviced her seven years ago, the lens and shutter are delightful. Father purchased the camera in Stuttgart Germany 1953. I have the receipt, every negative it has taken and the very first image was of my late Mother with the owner outside his camera store, taken by Father !!!

 

[Ambro51]

I’ve used rustoleum flat black spray paint for just about everything inside a camera. Dries fairly slow. For pinholes I’m not a big fan of liquid electrical tape because of its bulk. You can hold something over a candle and collect lampblack. Mix in a little of the flat black paint and create a thin paste. It makes a very good pinhole filler.

 

[mconnealy]

For small pinholes in bellows I have had good luck with Tulip brand ebony fabric paint from craft stores.

 

[peterm1]

I’ve used rustoleum flat black spray paint for just about everything inside a camera. Dries fairly slow. For pinholes I’m not a big fan of liquid electrical tape because of its bulk. You can hold something over a candle and collect lampblack. Mix in a little of the flat black paint and create a thin paste. It makes a very good pinhole filler.

A couple of ideas and thoughts come to mind. Some experimentation may be needed.

I recently bought some liquid electrical tape in a tube. This was new to me as previously it has been bought in a small tin can. I felt the tube would last longer and not dry out in the container. I was surprised when I opened it that it was quite thin compared to what I thought it would be based on my prior experience. I can see no reason why it should not be diluted further with a hydrocarbon solvent so it brushes on even more smoothly if that is necessary. You may still find it a little shiny however, but see my final comment below.

Liquid electrical tape is also available in a spray can. This would be well worth trying though masking of the areas not to be covered would of course be needed.

Another trick I have used in the past for Leica shutter curtains that had cracked but did not have significant holes was to use fabric paint. This paint is flexible of course given its use and is available from craft stores as people use it for screening / painting designs on T shirts and the like. Art stores might also be a source. I think I used a solvent based one - not sure about how well the acrylic stuff would cope but it is cheap to buy and test. Oh and another possible source if you know a friendly printer is through that person - printers have access to flexible inks of various density as speciality printers silk screen fabrics.

Another flexible paint with a rubbery feel is marbling paint (a craft where where paints of different colors are floated onto a surface of water and then a design is drawn in the mixed paints followed by paper or textiles being floated on the water to pick up the colors and design). One I found that works is Pebeo brand. I have used this for shutter curtain repairs and it certainly worked for the several years I kept the camera. See below.....

Finally I often use the black (or other color) fine grained oxide powder available from hardware stores for coloring cement and concrete, for tinting paint or lacquer. If you can find a suitably flexible "carrier" like one of the above paints or inks, or if you need to need to make a finish produced by one of the above methods "flatter" and more opaque you can buy a small jar of this stuff very cheaply. Mix thoroughly with the carrier and paint on.

Caveat: I have not done what you are attempting (I have only repaired shutters etc where I can say the above strategies have pretty much worked) but I think you will find that with experimentation something of the above sort may serve.

 

[Dan Daniel]

A shadow of the bellows? I wonder about this. Maybe the rubber is too thick for this purpose? Can you post an image of the negative, including the area outside of the image?

Sometimes applying repairs to a bellows can make it fold in a different way. The tolerances in can be tight enough that the bellows can intrude just a bit?

Light leaks and bounces and such are darn tricky sometimes. Again, posting a sample is very helpful, almost a requirement.

 

[Murray Kelly]

Catching lamp black sounds tedious so you could try black laser printer toner. Makes a very black paint.

 

[Guest]

Fixed it. Got some black fabric paint and tested it before use but it was still reflective. So I had an idea from a weld job I did last year.
Our old log fire grate had eaten through with the high heat last year. I found some designs using 3/4 by 1 1/2 steel to build a double layered grate. When I Finnish it I painted with Rustoleum High Heat spray paint. Now that stuff is a mat black as you can get and it has held up like it’s still new on the steel.
So I sprayed some on paper towel and cardboard, once dry when bending, it remained adhered to both surfaces. Well I painted the reflective rubber in the bellows. Then painted the frame rails and the results are incredible. There can be no doubt that no light whatsoever will reflect around inside from now on. Obviously I will check when reloading a film but it is probably better now than when it was new.
So thank you for your help in this matter.
Cheers,
James.

 

[IIIg]

A couple of ideas and thoughts come to mind. Some experimentation may be needed.

I recently bought some liquid electrical tape in a tube. This was new to me as previously it has been bought in a small tin can. I felt the tube would last longer and not dry out in the container. I was surprised when I opened it that it was quite thin compared to what I thought it would be based on my prior experience. I can see no reason why it should not be diluted further with a hydrocarbon solvent so it brushes on even more smoothly if that is necessary. You may still find it a little shiny however, but see my final comment below.

Liquid electrical tape is also available in a spray can. This would be well worth trying though masking of the areas not to be covered would of course be needed.

Another trick I have used in the past for Leica shutter curtains that had cracked but did not have significant holes was to use fabric paint. This paint is flexible of course given its use and is available from craft stores as people use it for screening / painting designs on T shirts and the like. Art stores might also be a source. I think I used a solvent based one - not sure about how well the acrylic stuff would cope but it is cheap to buy and test. Oh and another possible source if you know a friendly printer is through that person - printers have access to flexible inks of various density as speciality printers silk screen fabrics.

Another flexible paint with a rubbery feel is marbling paint (a craft where where paints of different colors are floated onto a surface of water and then a design is drawn in the mixed paints followed by paper or textiles being floated on the water to pick up the colors and design). One I found that works is Pebeo brand. I have used this for shutter curtain repairs and it certainly worked for the several years I kept the camera. See below.....

Finally I often use the black (or other color) fine grained oxide powder available from hardware stores for coloring cement and concrete, for tinting paint or lacquer. If you can find a suitably flexible "carrier" like one of the above paints or inks, or if you need to need to make a finish produced by one of the above methods "flatter" and more opaque you can buy a small jar of this stuff very cheaply. Mix thoroughly with the carrier and paint on.

Caveat: I have not done what you are attempting (I have only repaired shutters etc where I can say the above strategies have pretty much worked) but I think you will find that with experimentation something of the above sort may serve.

A ditto on the usefulness of "liquid electrical tape" (widely available in the US, at least) for bellows repair.

I've used it to repair bellows corner leaks on several LF view cameras, notably on a pair of Ansco 5x7's and a Linhof 4x5. I applied the goo with a small artist's paintbrush, and for the pinholes troubling me, the problems was solved.

You really want to let the stuff dry before collapsing the bellows; 48 hours isn't too long and maybe a dot of talcum powder to keep the stiff from adhering to itself.

BTW, the Ansco's are a real treat to use.