Unfortunately, yes.
kshapero
South Florida Man
Just cause one line of CV's is discontinued. That's a bit of a jump IMHO.
NazgulKing
Established
You did get the memo that the Zeiss Ikon is discontinued as well?
kshapero
South Florida Man
Yes so that still leaves about 500,000,000 great used rangefinders (I may be off a million or two). So I am still psyched (as he pinches himself).
NazgulKing
Established
So what? Many of them have to be scavenged for parts. Mechanical parts suffer wear and tear all the time. Optical coatings and cement do not last forever. And never mind that: eventually many of the repair shop guys will retire. Give it 10years or so, and the great pool of cameras will wither down.
I don't think used equipment counts towards a renaissance. Not sure why you're upset with what we said.
ottluuk
the indecisive eternity
Repairs to complex 35mm and medium format cameras are only viable/practical as long as there is either a stock of replacement parts or donor cameras to be found. Sure, technically it is possible to machine all sorts of parts, make new circuit boards - but at what cost?
Even if you look at the current cost of major repairs (involving replacement parts, not just CLA) on a classic Leica M series body, today, you'll see that it is often close to the price of a working M body on the used market. And that's with the M line still in production and almost 60 years worth of M-s out there.
I think it's probably fair to compare the -A series cameras to the Minolta CLE. The latter are now over 30 years old and many of them keep going just fine. OTOH, getting them repaired is a serious problem. Now, fast forward to somewhere around 2040. Is 35mm film still generally available? Who knows. But you can probably find a working Bessa RxA camera if you know where to look.
The most future proof camera is a wooden view camera. They can be repaired (or built from scratch) with relatively simple tools and when film supply dwindles you can shoot paper negatives, self-coated glass plates etc. There seems to be a wet plate revival thing these days.
thegman
Veteran
Although since the release of the Zeiss Ikon and the A series Bessas, we've also seen the release of two other brand new range finders, the GF670 and GF670w. So in terms of total models on the market, things have not changed much.
The thing is, people can argue whether the discontinuation of a line of cameras represents the 'end of the renaissance', if there ever was a a renaissance. Either side of the argument is just speculation and it's probably more accurate for us all to admit that we simply don't know what will happen next.
The thing is, people can argue whether the discontinuation of a line of cameras represents the 'end of the renaissance', if there ever was a a renaissance. Either side of the argument is just speculation and it's probably more accurate for us all to admit that we simply don't know what will happen next.
The D3 and F6 are completely unrelated. The D3 was released on 30th November 2007, whereas the F6 was released over three years earlier on 22nd October 2004. The F6 uses the same Multi-CAM 2000 autofocus module as the D2X, but I expected that's the extent of shared components.
http://imaging.nikon.com/history/scenes/09/index.htm
dagoberto
Newbie
Maybe i am daydreaming but what if cosina is cutting bessa a production to focus on developing a digital FF bessa? I am pretty sure that the marked is ready for an "affordable" digital rangefinder as an alternative to APS-C mirrorless and M`s ... ? Technology wise the time is also right?
daveleo
what?
thegman
Veteran
I think it's against the WWW rules to say "I don't know" in a forum post.
That, and "I'm sorry, I was wrong".
kshapero
South Florida Man
Oh not upset at all, just providing a counterpoint, that rangefinders are alive and well. Last year when my M3 came back from Solms with a CLA, the repairman wrote, "Good for another 50 years". Now I won't hold him to it, but I think they will be around for a good while.
teleparallel
Established
Oh dear.
I need to get an M version before it's gone too.
I don't think well get a digital bessa so soon. And if FF it would be pricey.
The "affordable" FF are above 1500 us, mass produced and all. So I think it would be above to 3000 easily.
I don't mind if we would get a aps-c sized sensor, if together, we get lenses dedicated for aps-c for 25mm and below, with the 21 and 25 having f2.5-3.2 speed(aps-c color skopars), and frame lines for them.
For me the 21mm, 35mm and 50mm kit is perfect for film. A 15, 21 and 35, aps-c kit with framelines in camera, would be awesome too(and i would already have the 35). Fuji is close to it, but have bad manual focusing, compared to rangefinders. Also it's all by wire. I like scales and such.
Also, why not a new Epson rangefinder? They still in production right? Something to substitute the R2A for staters would be awesome. Maybe 35, 21/75, 50 frame lines?
I need to get an M version before it's gone too.
I don't think well get a digital bessa so soon. And if FF it would be pricey.
The "affordable" FF are above 1500 us, mass produced and all. So I think it would be above to 3000 easily.
I don't mind if we would get a aps-c sized sensor, if together, we get lenses dedicated for aps-c for 25mm and below, with the 21 and 25 having f2.5-3.2 speed(aps-c color skopars), and frame lines for them.
For me the 21mm, 35mm and 50mm kit is perfect for film. A 15, 21 and 35, aps-c kit with framelines in camera, would be awesome too(and i would already have the 35). Fuji is close to it, but have bad manual focusing, compared to rangefinders. Also it's all by wire. I like scales and such.
Also, why not a new Epson rangefinder? They still in production right? Something to substitute the R2A for staters would be awesome. Maybe 35, 21/75, 50 frame lines?
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I don't really see that a new rangefinder is going to happen and I agree that they are now in fairly sharp decline. It's a little like expecting BMW to bring out a car with carburettors for the people who don't like fuel injection.
I believe that Leica are currently trying to wean their customer base off the concept of the optical rangefinder with the 240 ... it still has one but the next incarnation may not!
I believe that Leica are currently trying to wean their customer base off the concept of the optical rangefinder with the 240 ... it still has one but the next incarnation may not!
jarski
Veteran
Keith has bit gloomy vision about future of rangefinder. I don't see Leica hurrying anywhere from market where they have monopoly, and loyal following for both lenses and bodies. New factory opening next year in Wetzlar makes long wait lists for their equipment shorter. + Who knows how current optical rangefinder can be improved in future so it stays viable alternative to evf.
I was thinking more about film rangefinders. Leica is safe with their digital bodies now.
froyd
Veteran
Sad to hear this. The R2A was my first rangefinder, bought new from the bartender, and I would still own it if it had not been stolen. Still, if I were to buy a Bessa again, it would be an R2M.
The Bessas filled a large (relatively!) void in the RF market, but there are enough used bodies around now to satisfy demand for an inexpensive, well-made, really fun RF.
The Bessas filled a large (relatively!) void in the RF market, but there are enough used bodies around now to satisfy demand for an inexpensive, well-made, really fun RF.
aizan
Veteran
the rangefinder renaissance isn't ending, it's going mainstream!
thegman
Veteran
A few years ago, the idea of a new medium format rangefinder would seem far fetched, but in fact, we got two, a folding 80mm model, and a wide angle model.
I wouldn't expect much from Leica, but I wouldn't be surprised if Cosina brought out some interesting new products.