bokeh backlash?

[Gabriel M.A.]

I appreciate good OOF performance, but I refuse to call it bokeh.

"oof performance" isn't necessarily bokeh.


I don't think I've ever heard anybody say they appreciate filtered water, but refuse to call it Kool-Aid. Kool-Aid can be made from filtered water, but filtered water isn't made from Kool-Aid.

Although some people who drink a lot of it would say otherwise 😉

 

[Sonnar Brian]

The Bokeh from a Diana is much better than the Bokeh from a Holga.

which must account for the one I sold going for a $100 on Ebay... insane. i remember them at 25cents each.

 

[bmattock]

The Bokeh from a Diana is much better than the Bokeh from a Holga.

which must account for the one I sold going for a $100 on Ebay... insane. i remember them at 25cents each.

I have to say that I don't think Dianas or Holgas produce what I would call 'bokeh' at all. They produce distortion. This distortion can be pleasing to the eye, but it is not controllable; it is what it is.

 

[Roger Hicks]

I have to say that I don't think Dianas or Holgas produce what I would call 'bokeh' at all. They produce distortion. This distortion can be pleasing to the eye, but it is not controllable; it is what it is.

Does the fact that it is not controllable stop it being bokeh? Especially by Geoffrey Crawley's definition (retaining the shape of out-of-focus subjects)?

Tashi delek,

R.

 

[Sonnar Brian]

Bokeh is created from optical distortion. Otherwise, all out-of-focus areas would be perfectly smooth circles: no footballs (astigmatism), no rings (overcorrection for spherical aberration), no center-weighted circles (under-corrected spherical aberration). Those seem to be the most-pronounced factors, others include curvature of field, contrast, etc. Just about any "imperfect correction" or optical trade-off used to form an image on a flat plane. In any given fixed-focal length lens (except Nikkor Defocus Control lenses, and others like it), Bokeh "is what it is". Zooms are different. The focal length setting can change the Bokeh, depending on the design.

 

[Oscar Levant]

Only clowns take bokeh seriously.

 

[bmattock]

Brian and Roger - I stand corrected.

 

[ferider]

Bokeh is created from optical distortion. Otherwise, all out-of-focus areas would be perfectly smooth circles: no footballs (astigmatism), no rings (overcorrection for spherical aberration), no center-weighted circles (under-corrected spherical aberration). Those seem to be the most-pronounced factors, others include curvature of field, contrast, etc. Just about any "imperfect correction" or optical trade-off used to form an image on a flat plane. In any given fixed-focal length lens (except Nikkor Defocus Control lenses, and others like it), Bokeh "is what it is". Zooms are different. The focal length setting can change the Bokeh, depending on the design.

If one just looks at the circles, Bokeh can be modified very easily in some ways, for any lens:

http://www.flickr.com/groups/shaped_bokeh/pool/

🙂

 

[Sonnar Brian]

Good Bokeh.

Bad Bokeh.

And no, it is not easy taking pictures in a moving spaceship ride while firing a LASER gun at the enemy. And getting 300,000 points on the first time...

 

[Sonnar Brian]

If one just looks at the circles, Bokeh can be modified very easily in some ways, for any lens:

http://www.flickr.com/groups/shaped_bokeh/pool/

🙂

I've done that- made aperture disks.

Repositioning the optics in the lenses can also soften the Bokeh, or sharpen it to crystal clarity. Remember the Voice of Control from the Outer Limits?


Hybrid 1958/1974 J-3, wide-open.

1953 J-3, wide-open. Sharper, higher contrast, harsher Bokeh.

Overcorrecting for spherical aberration is the "norm" for high-speed optics. It produces sharper images with more "pop".

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

It is only human to be afraid of that which you do not understand.

It's more human to want to be able to understand it.

 

[colyn]

Are we talking about the KEH salesperson named Bo??? 😀 😀 😀

 

[AJShepherd]

Wouldn't a bokeh backlash be tsukkomi?
(This video clip explains my reference. Skip forward to 6:56 for the (admittedly flimsy) photography-related part)

 

[maddoc]

”Tsukkomi"　「突っ込み」　seems to be the opposite to 「ぼける」 if you refer to Manzai. That I would interpret as "bokeh backlash" ... 😀

 

[lorriman]

Experience and DoF charts, says I... If you don't [know what you're doing], might as well throw your camera away and buy a point-and-shoot, since you clearly don't care to master your craft.

oof backgrounds throw another factor in to the calculation: distance to background. I reckon that is just too many factors to get any reliable idea of what the background will look like for someone who uses more than one focal length.

Altogether the factors are focal-length, focus distance, distance to background, aperture and lastly lens exit-pupil (which is possibly the reason why the new nokton f1.1 may have less bokeh than expected).

If you stick to just one lens then you still have 3 factors to multiply which is already too much for me particularly as I'm no great judge of distance. Quite impossible is subtle adjustment of bokeh: for example to blur a face but not loose the impression of expression.

For a bokeh nut like me an SLR is the only solution. 😱

Even with an SLR the focus screen is an issue, [sigh].

 

[Bill Harrison]

oof

oof

Just another tool/technique for visual expression. Depends on how it's used and how it's perceived. Some love or hate grain. Same thing...

 

[vidgamer]

I have an inexpensive lens which does not produce "creamy, smooth" bokeh, but has noticeable highlights with edges, when stopped down (say, f8). And sometimes I really like that look. There are those who only can appreciate super-smooth bokeh, but I don't think you should be restricted to that.

I dislike "bad bokeh" which is really busy. The background influences the look, but each lens will either be prone to better or worse bokeh.

My P&S digital camera can have shallow DOF and has decent bokeh... provided that the subject is only a few feet away!

 

[Chris101]

Busy bokey is usually a product of having sticks, slats or some other busy background, where the bright edges of the blur interfere with each other. In my humble opinion, bokey can be used to mask the background while repositioning will select an inherently better background, which is a better option. Too often folks will shoot with too large an aperture, where not enough of the subject is in sharp focus, for the sake of improving the bokey. This is backwards thinking.

 

[Sonnar Brian]

In the 70s, Mirror Lens Bokeh was all the rage.

Nikon F Photomic with Reflex-Nikkor 500/8, original version.

Handheld at Sunset shooting Ektachrome 64...