louisb
Well-known
I tried posting this a few days ago so apologies if it got through to the forum and this is a repeat (can't seem to find my original post anywhere).
I like Leica glass but I could not contemplate buying a film camera. So, after a lot of research I settled on a s/h R-D1.
I need some advice from users of various Leica lenses as to the benefits and useability of the lens(es) I am contemplating.
My thoughts are Elmarit 28 f2.8, Summicron 50 f2 and a CV 15/f4 Heliar. On the other hand I was also thinking of the Tir-elmar 28-35-50. My thinking on the latter being, I put it on the camera and never take it off.
Either way I think I would buy the CV 15/f4. My concern about the tri-elmar is whether I would regret not having a shallower dof than f/4.
I'm sure the regulars here are sick to death of "please help me" requests but if you have a few minutes to give me your experiences of Leica glass on the R-D1 - and indeed your recommendations I would be genuinely interested to receive them.
TIA
LouisB
I like Leica glass but I could not contemplate buying a film camera. So, after a lot of research I settled on a s/h R-D1.
I need some advice from users of various Leica lenses as to the benefits and useability of the lens(es) I am contemplating.
My thoughts are Elmarit 28 f2.8, Summicron 50 f2 and a CV 15/f4 Heliar. On the other hand I was also thinking of the Tir-elmar 28-35-50. My thinking on the latter being, I put it on the camera and never take it off.
Either way I think I would buy the CV 15/f4. My concern about the tri-elmar is whether I would regret not having a shallower dof than f/4.
I'm sure the regulars here are sick to death of "please help me" requests but if you have a few minutes to give me your experiences of Leica glass on the R-D1 - and indeed your recommendations I would be genuinely interested to receive them.
TIA
LouisB
R
RML
Guest
What are your plans? Are you shooting the streets?
The CV15/4.5 has tremendous vignetting, which the Epson PhotoRAW software can deal with pretty well, though it does add an extra step in your work flow. That said, I'm not too keen on the 15 (and the 1.6x crop factor) replacing my CV25/4 (on film). The 25 is one of my favourite lenses on my Bessa R but I don't like the 15 on my R-D1. I'm sticking with a 40/2 and a 50/2 on the R-D1. Somehow the wide angles don't work so well for me on the R-D1.
The CV15/4.5 has tremendous vignetting, which the Epson PhotoRAW software can deal with pretty well, though it does add an extra step in your work flow. That said, I'm not too keen on the 15 (and the 1.6x crop factor) replacing my CV25/4 (on film). The 25 is one of my favourite lenses on my Bessa R but I don't like the 15 on my R-D1. I'm sticking with a 40/2 and a 50/2 on the R-D1. Somehow the wide angles don't work so well for me on the R-D1.
pfogle
Well-known
Well, this is such a personal issue that it's hard to know quite how to answer - so much depends on what you like to photograph.
I went for the 12 rather than the 15 after reading Sean Reids review on Luminous Landscape. I bought a 28/1.9 CV when I got the camera 2 years ago, and it's the only lens I've hung onto right through.
That said, I think you've hit on a good combo 15-28-50 covers the range, and I have had various 35's, got rid of them and haven't missed them. It's not a focal length I particularly like - though I'd make an exception if I could afford the 35 lux ASPH.
A lens I find very useful myself is the 21 - I've got an older Elmarit and it's seen quite a bit of use, mainly for IR black and white.
Hope that helps
Phil
I went for the 12 rather than the 15 after reading Sean Reids review on Luminous Landscape. I bought a 28/1.9 CV when I got the camera 2 years ago, and it's the only lens I've hung onto right through.
That said, I think you've hit on a good combo 15-28-50 covers the range, and I have had various 35's, got rid of them and haven't missed them. It's not a focal length I particularly like - though I'd make an exception if I could afford the 35 lux ASPH.
A lens I find very useful myself is the 21 - I've got an older Elmarit and it's seen quite a bit of use, mainly for IR black and white.
Hope that helps
Phil
bayerische
Established
I have the 35 Lux asph, which works very well on the R-D1.
I aslo bought an older Summilux 50mm, turned into a 75mm lens, it's perfect for portraits!
I'm aslo baffeled with what wide angle to get, since the 35mm ain't exactly wide anymore.
The 15mm CV is interesting, it's rather cheap s/h too. The extra viewfinder don't impress me much, I'll probably struggle with the R-D1 normal-too-narrow-for-the-lens viewfinder
.
What disturbs me with the 15mm is the lack of rangefinder coupling. But in reviews the testers aren't swetting it too much....
I aslo bought an older Summilux 50mm, turned into a 75mm lens, it's perfect for portraits!
I'm aslo baffeled with what wide angle to get, since the 35mm ain't exactly wide anymore.
The 15mm CV is interesting, it's rather cheap s/h too. The extra viewfinder don't impress me much, I'll probably struggle with the R-D1 normal-too-narrow-for-the-lens viewfinder
.What disturbs me with the 15mm is the lack of rangefinder coupling. But in reviews the testers aren't swetting it too much....
mwooten
light user
As Phil says, this is a personal thing -- how you see the world and all that.
I too read Sean Reid's reviews on both the RD1 and various lenses before I bought anything. The first lens I bought was a CV 35/2.5 Pancake II. It worked great on my RD1. Next I bought a few Soviet 50mm's, and had sort of mixed results. I ended up liking my I-61 best (of the Soviets).
I then bought a CV 50mm Nokton. Love it -- plan to keep it -- great for portraits and other things. Next I bought a second hand Minolta 40mm M-Rokkor. Oh my my! Really sweet lens -- crispy not crunchy. It worked (pardon my english) "a whole lot more better" for me than the 35 did, so I sold the 35. (If I had a film M body I would have kept the 35 p2)
I found that I needed something wider for interior shots, so I bought a 28mm Ultron. I really like this lens too. It's a keeper.
I've thought about going wider, but can't come up with any real justification. And besides, I gave up lens buying for Lent.
If I were to recommend just one lens it would be the 40mm M-Rokkor. I know Phil has had trouble with his not focusing quite right, but I've had no problems. It's a small, light, excellent lens. Pick two would be the 28 Ultron.
Take care,
Michael
I too read Sean Reid's reviews on both the RD1 and various lenses before I bought anything. The first lens I bought was a CV 35/2.5 Pancake II. It worked great on my RD1. Next I bought a few Soviet 50mm's, and had sort of mixed results. I ended up liking my I-61 best (of the Soviets).
I then bought a CV 50mm Nokton. Love it -- plan to keep it -- great for portraits and other things. Next I bought a second hand Minolta 40mm M-Rokkor. Oh my my! Really sweet lens -- crispy not crunchy. It worked (pardon my english) "a whole lot more better" for me than the 35 did, so I sold the 35. (If I had a film M body I would have kept the 35 p2)
I found that I needed something wider for interior shots, so I bought a 28mm Ultron. I really like this lens too. It's a keeper.
I've thought about going wider, but can't come up with any real justification. And besides, I gave up lens buying for Lent.
If I were to recommend just one lens it would be the 40mm M-Rokkor. I know Phil has had trouble with his not focusing quite right, but I've had no problems. It's a small, light, excellent lens. Pick two would be the 28 Ultron.
Take care,
Michael
pfogle
Well-known
Michael, interesting story! I started out with the 28 Ultron and the 40mm Nokton, which I have now replaced with the Rokkor - it's a whole lot nicer to my eye - as sharp without being harsh - a bit like the collapsible summicron I got recently.mwooten said:
I'm desperately trying to give up buying lenses! Now that the Rokkor and Canon seem to be sweet, I should be able to suppress this particular addiction for a while
Another great thing about the 40s is that they actually fit the 35 frame lines a lot better than the 35s did. So framing gets a lot easier. For some reason, the bit of slack you get with the framing on the 50s doesn't bother me nearly as much as the 35s. With the 28 it's pretty much guesswork anyway, as I wear glasses and can't really see the framelines that well.
So, in a nutshell, I agree with you that a good minimum kit would be 28 and 40 with next fave options for me being the 50 and the 21.
louisb
Well-known
Out of interest, what about longer lenses
Out of interest, what about longer lenses
Just an addendum but what are the rules about, say, 90mm lenses on the R-D1. I know there are no framelines but (a) can you guesstimate, (b) is it worth using an external viewfinder. Does anyone get good results with longer lenses?
LouisB
Out of interest, what about longer lenses
Just an addendum but what are the rules about, say, 90mm lenses on the R-D1. I know there are no framelines but (a) can you guesstimate, (b) is it worth using an external viewfinder. Does anyone get good results with longer lenses?
LouisB
frankweir
Member
h louis....I bought an old Tewe Zoom viewfinder because remember you have to acct for the 1.53 sensor size...with the Tewe I can set the 90 at about 130 which is close to what you actually get...it works well...sometimes i need bounce flash tho so then yer looking at a bracket since you need the hot shoe for the tewe! I have the 35-200 Tewe since if i dare use a 135, you are close to a 200...really an external viewfinder is not the big bugga boo that people seem to say it is...
frank weir
frankweir@yahoo.com
frank weir
frankweir@yahoo.com
docolmo
Member
I have the Voigtlander 35mm f2,5, 28mm f4, 21mm f4 Color Skopar. I also have Leica 28mm f2.8 ASPH, 35mm f2 ASPH, 50mm f1.4. I am happy only with 35mm lenses upwards, as CV 28mm has serious vignetting. Leica 28 somehow is sonewhat better, and even the CV 21mm is better than than the CV 28mm.
Try to stick to 35mm upwards. 50mm gives very nice portrait images at f1.4.
Try to stick to 35mm upwards. 50mm gives very nice portrait images at f1.4.
RF-Addict
Well-known
The vignetting on the wides with the Epson Raw Converter is really not an issue - the Raw Converter compensates for it, as soon as you tell it what focal length you have used for a particular shot. I use the CV15, CV21, CV35 f/1.7 and the CV50 Nokton on my RD-1.
Joe Mondello
Resu Deretsiger
I bought an interesting collection (small) of lenses for my R-D1. I already had a 1963 DR Summicron 50/2 and found reasonable used CV lenses at B&H (my local store) which also drove my decision making.
I only bought the CV 40mm 1/4 Nokton new. I picked up clean used copies of the CV 15/4.5 Super Heliar and the CV 28/1.9 Ultron.
These 4 lenses (along with a used 21mm CV finder for the 15) work well with the frame lines on the R-D1 and each has its own character and usefulness. I often will use all 4 on a shoot.
I only bought the CV 40mm 1/4 Nokton new. I picked up clean used copies of the CV 15/4.5 Super Heliar and the CV 28/1.9 Ultron.
These 4 lenses (along with a used 21mm CV finder for the 15) work well with the frame lines on the R-D1 and each has its own character and usefulness. I often will use all 4 on a shoot.
Innerimager
Established
the new 28 elmarit asph is terrific, and is my favorite single lens on the RD-1. It's a punchy, conrasty lens, and the RD-1 definitely renders it extremely well with very saturated colors. Here is the very first image I took with the RD-1 with this lens, it shows some of this quality..Congrats, and best.....Peter
louisb
Well-known
Joe, I'd love to see some of your pictures as examples of what I can expect when I finally get my lens(es).
...and Peter... wow great tones. I only wish I could afford to spring for a 28 asph but I am bidding on a last version before the asph 28 3.8 Elmarit.
Thanks for your responses
LouisB
...and Peter... wow great tones. I only wish I could afford to spring for a 28 asph but I am bidding on a last version before the asph 28 3.8 Elmarit.
Thanks for your responses
LouisB
AhShun
Member
"crispy not crunchy", what a lovely judgement!
I echo with mwooten for the Rokkor, which match the RD1 frameline better than 35 in most situations.
28Ultron perform decently but I keep the Canon 28/2.8, a low contrast funny lens.
Even I started with a current 50cron, I use the 50/2 Nikkor for portriate and Red-scale for the rest.
RD1 is such a good plateform to taste the good old days...
There is nothing wrong with my cron, BTW, just prefectly perform. It will record whateven you see. However, it seems that photography is not only about record the scene.
I echo with mwooten for the Rokkor, which match the RD1 frameline better than 35 in most situations.
28Ultron perform decently but I keep the Canon 28/2.8, a low contrast funny lens.
Even I started with a current 50cron, I use the 50/2 Nikkor for portriate and Red-scale for the rest.
RD1 is such a good plateform to taste the good old days...
There is nothing wrong with my cron, BTW, just prefectly perform. It will record whateven you see. However, it seems that photography is not only about record the scene.
jim_buchanan
Established
I recommend the 28mm focal length, to start. My definition of a "normal" focal length lens is a bit shorter than a 50mm on 35 full frame. Somewhere I got the idea that the focal length should equal the diagonal of the sensor, so 35mm full frame would be 43mm. The diagonal of the R-D1 sensor is 28mm, M8 equals 32mm.
In 28s, I have the pre-ASPH 28 elmarit, and love it. I bought it for less than the ASPH cost, which would probably be my next 28 pick. After that, it would be the ZM 28/2.8. The 28 Summicron is out of my price range.
Then, I have the current 50mm Summicron, which I can be had for a reasonable price. The actual focal length is 52mm, giving 80mm on the R-D1. The current 50 Summicron is reported to be the best 50mm in the world.
Well, that takes care of the 43 to 80mm range on full frame format, which for me covers most of my needs. I have the 90mm Elmarit, which is also a great lens. One day I will get a shorter than 28mm, and will take a look at the 2 new ZM lenses, the 18 and 21.
In 28s, I have the pre-ASPH 28 elmarit, and love it. I bought it for less than the ASPH cost, which would probably be my next 28 pick. After that, it would be the ZM 28/2.8. The 28 Summicron is out of my price range.
Then, I have the current 50mm Summicron, which I can be had for a reasonable price. The actual focal length is 52mm, giving 80mm on the R-D1. The current 50 Summicron is reported to be the best 50mm in the world.
Well, that takes care of the 43 to 80mm range on full frame format, which for me covers most of my needs. I have the 90mm Elmarit, which is also a great lens. One day I will get a shorter than 28mm, and will take a look at the 2 new ZM lenses, the 18 and 21.
boilerdoc2
Well-known
The Tri Elamar is without peer on this camera. You put it on and leave it. Get a 75 and a 21 to supplement and/or a fast 35/50 and you're set. Great camera...
Steve
Steve
louisb
Well-known
Thanks for all the advice I have received. In the end, my budget just could not run to the 28-35-50.... and on consideration, I decided I wanted physically shorter lens as well.
I plumped for s/h 28/f2.8 Elmarit and a 50/f2 cron. I figure I am unlikely to really need the 35mm view in between these. I am also seeing if I can quite stretch to a CV 15/Heliar. I know I will want this lens at some point but on the other hand I'm also tempted to hold off and see if I can afford a 21/Biogon a little later in the year.
Once I get the lenses I can finally get out and do some test shots. I hope the wait is worth it!
LouisB
I plumped for s/h 28/f2.8 Elmarit and a 50/f2 cron. I figure I am unlikely to really need the 35mm view in between these. I am also seeing if I can quite stretch to a CV 15/Heliar. I know I will want this lens at some point but on the other hand I'm also tempted to hold off and see if I can afford a 21/Biogon a little later in the year.
Once I get the lenses I can finally get out and do some test shots. I hope the wait is worth it!
LouisB
louisb
Well-known
One of the first pictures out of the R-D1 with the Leica Elmarit 28/2.8 I purchased off of e-Bay. I posted this at the Leica user group as well (apologies if you have already seen it).
I'm just staggered at the resolution of the lens, the contrast and the tonal range, given the grey overcast. I guess the camera should also get some credit!
I really like being able to set dof hyperfocally using the lens. I think it was stopped down to f/16 or even f/22 (it is a pill that the R-D1 does not seem to record the f-stop in its EXIF data).
In fact, overall, I really like working with this camera, period. It actually feels more natural to work completely manually than with my DSLR.
Well worth the wait.
I'm just staggered at the resolution of the lens, the contrast and the tonal range, given the grey overcast. I guess the camera should also get some credit!
I really like being able to set dof hyperfocally using the lens. I think it was stopped down to f/16 or even f/22 (it is a pill that the R-D1 does not seem to record the f-stop in its EXIF data).
In fact, overall, I really like working with this camera, period. It actually feels more natural to work completely manually than with my DSLR.
Well worth the wait.