Canon LTM Canon 7s or Canon P ?

Canon M39 M39 screw mount bodies/lenses
fredus

fredus

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Hi there,

I'm looking at buying one of them ... Which one would you recommend ? I only use 50 and 90mm lenses. Looks like the P has a 1:1 finder but with a shorter rangefinder base ... I'm wondering which one is the easiest to focus. I don't care about metering (so no advantage for the 7 here ...).

Thanks for your help !

Fred
 
mmm looks like the P has a 41mm BL and the 7 47.2mm ... What are the number you're giving here ? Thanks !

Fred
 
both are nice cameras, the 7 would be a bit cheaper to buy ,if both models were of equal condition. the 7 is not as " fetishized" as other Canon RFs with focal plane shutters yet.... just a matter of time though.
 
fl = frame lines.

if you want to shoot with a 90 you will need to decide if the 85 or the 100 will best for you.

joe
 
The Canon 7 has frame lines for 35, 50, 85, 100, and 135. The 85/100 framelines appear together. It has auto-parallax correction and a 0.8x finder. The Canon P has a 1x finder, and all framelines are visible at one time.

The Canon VI-L and VI-T have three magnifications, 0.6x for 35mm, 1x for 50/100, and 1.5x for 135mm lenses. Auto-Parallax correction, also.
 
P is more compact. If a 7's meter does work you'll still want a more sensitive digital meter for dark indoors situations. Film's generally a lot faster than it was in 7 era, making indoors shooting much more tempting. 7 could be a bargain, given recent P prices.

There was a P at KEH yesterday for $495. IMO an "Exc" P will still be fairly priced at $600.
 
my pristine p was only 350 u.s. and that's my limit now.

600 bucks! even 450 is way too much...for me, at least.

i want a vi-l now, so let the prices drop...please!

joe
 
Personally I think the P is overrated. Unlike with the 7, the 35mm framelines are unusable if you wear glasses and it doesn't have the wide range of other framelines that the 7 has. Also, I think the 7 finder is brighter and contrastier. If you want a funky camera, go for an L rather than a P -- if you want a great user camera go for a 7. The P falls between them.
 
I love my 7s, but it rivals my girlfriend's F3 with motor drive in weight, and it isn't that much smaller either. I've never held another 35mm RF, so I can't compare to among the class. But I will say that the RF stealth, at least regarding camera size, doesn't apply when I'm out with the 50/1.2 on it. Then it's just as huge as an SLR. But yeah, it's a great camera, one out of 16,000 and I inherited it, how could I not love it?
 
Folks around here can tell you that I'm a big fan of the P. It's definitely smaller than the 7, although respectably heavy. I've heard good things, though, about the 7 series VF patch and framelines - that is, that they're very contrasty and bright. As my P's finder seems to be showing its age, I wonder about my options.

Surely, a CLA would tell me for sure whether I was underestimating the quality of the P's VF. Dechert spoke highly of it, but was quick to point out (in the 1980's no less) that the P's RF patches would probably be aging quickly as of his writing. He made some good points about the V and VI cameras, in that several sub-models have a "cooler" and therefore more contrasty RF patch than the P. I wonder which is more like the 7?

If you're interested, I'm also running into trouble, theoretically, with the fact that collapsible lenses don't quite collapse on the various ranges of the back-loading Canon RFs, a family to which the P and the 7 belong. I think another active thread explains how the 7 might escape some of these problems in some cases, but it's still a design issue for the type.


--joe.
 
P is a better tool than meterless Leicas, but the 7 viewfinder's better. The only problem with the 7 is the antiquated or dead meter it hauls around.

I don't think P's hinged back is a huge edge over the smaller bottom feeders, if you have a oair of bottom feeders so you can keep them loaded with two films (currently NPZ and Neopan, both 800).

I don't think the lever advance is a big deal either, not if the bottom feeder works smoothly.

And I think bottom feeder split tube view/range are fine, especially considering the compact size of the bodies. Further, I don't think P's 35mm viewfinder is adequate for demanding users...not with glasses in particular.

The P's rewind lever IS a big advantage over bottom feeder knob.

I'm currently dedicating one P to 35mm and external 35mm finder with Neopan, the other to 50mm and NPZ. I use an F1 for 100mm, and don't often want that length. My IIIC is currently gathering dust, but may become my CV25 camera.
 
I use my Canon P more than any other camera I own, which includes a Leica M and a Canon VI-L and a Bessa T and others. The P is a highly reliable camera. The viewfinder can be messed up on some of the P's due to age, but if you find a clean P, it's a great camera. I like the camera overall.
 
I can't say what you'll end up doing. For myself, I intend to eventually get either a 7 or a VIL and I still lean more towards the 7. I like it's looks and I like selenium meters so if I found one with a good meter I'd be quite happy to use it. Plus, I'll admit, the ability to use the monster lens intreages me, even though I'm not big on super fast lenses.

In the end with my very happy experiance with the IV of late, I think I'll stick with Canons for awhile. <heresy> I certainly like them better than the Leicas I've used </heresy>

William
 
the 35mm framelines are unusable if you wear glasses
that's right

if you want a great user camera go for a 7. The P falls between them.
mmmhhh! I think thet P wa the best if you want a compact easy to use camera, better than canon 7 (bigger and heavier) if you don't need a lightmeter



lawrence said:
Personally I think the P is overrated. Unlike with the 7, the 35mm framelines are unusable if you wear glasses and it doesn't have the wide range of other framelines that the 7 has. Also, I think the 7 finder is brighter and contrastier. If you want a funky camera, go for an L rather than a P -- if you want a great user camera go for a 7. The P falls between them.
Click to expand...
 
and I wear glasses too.
my equipmet is bessa R, canon 7, canon P, canon VI-L
I prefer canon P



QUOTE=back alley]well, i wear glasses and use 35mm for much of my shooting so it can't be completely unuseable.[/QUOTE]
 
I use both a Canon P and 7s, and prefer the P for its simplicity, smaller size and more ergonomic controls, although I think that the 7s has the advantage in the viewfinder department, i.e., the switchable framelines. I currently have a 7s in my briefcase for some lunch-time shooting, but the big reason that I am using this camera is that I just got it back from DAG, and want to try it out.

FWIW, my order of preference for the Canon RFs is P, L1, VI-L and 7s

dexdog (I am several with my gear)
 
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