Canon P - funny shutter noise and lens alignment

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rev

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I'm mostly a digital shooter. My main kit is a Sony A7 with a bunch of MF film era lenses.

One of those film lenses is a Canon 50mm f/1.4 LTM. I've used it a fair bit on my A7, but wanted an LTM body to try it out on. After being tempted by a Leica IIIf and pretty much every FSU RF, I ended up going with the Canon P.

I just got it today. There are a few possible issues that stand out:

1. At 1/30s and slower, there's a loose, echo-ey sound after the shutter closes. It almost sounds like an echo of the sound of clockwork mechanism. Is this normal, or does it indicate a possible issue?
2. My Canon 50/1.4 when mounted isn't aligned as you'd expect it to be, with the center of the DOF scale and the dot above the aperture pointing straight up. Instead, they're at about 11 o'clock. Not a huge deal, a slight usability issue. I was wondering if this indicated anything being off about the camera or lens.
3. The RF cam is slow to spring back. I assume that could be resolved with a CLA, but I don't want to send it in if it's not worth the investment.

Can anyone recommend where to get a CLA for a P?

I'm putting a roll through it now. I have to admit, there's something really special about that 1:1 finder!

Many thanks in advance-
Aaron
 
1. Yes, as far as I can tell that's normal (all my Canon P's have done it). I think it's a swinging release that modulates the slow shutter speeds.

2. Also normal. I've had them vary from 2 to 10.

3. Might be a sticky cam, that's the only thing that doesn't sound more or less normal to me.
 
Awesome, many thanks for the quick reply! The cam moves, but slowly. Going from MFD to infinity is fine, but if I go from infinity to MFD I have to wait a few seconds as the cam catches up. I assume it's just got some gunk in the lubricant or congealed lubricant on the mechanism. Still, not unusable, but worth cleaning.

Is there any way to adjust the alignment, either on the body or the lens, so that the focus mark/aperture dot is at 12?
 
1. The bouncing noise is normal. It's the sound of the slow speeds escapement gears returning to their starting position.

Adjusting lens / body alignment - it's possible to change, but not worth the amount of effort. You'd have to orient the flange the way you want it and redrill the bolt pattern, or make a new flange and match drill that. Or something like that.


A sluggish rangefinder is worth cleaning, and if you're kinda handy you could do it yourself. You would need to make a tool to remove the wind lever.
 
mooge said:
1. The bouncing noise is normal. It's the sound of the slow speeds escapement gears returning to their starting position.

Adjusting lens / body alignment - it's possible to change, but not worth the amount of effort. You'd have to orient the flange the way you want it and redrill the bolt pattern, or make a new flange and match drill that. Or something like that.


A sluggish rangefinder is worth cleaning, and if you're kinda handy you could do it yourself. You would need to make a tool to remove the wind lever.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. I'll live with the lens alignment. I was hoping there might be a screw you could loosen, move the lens barrel around to the right place, and then tighten the screw. :)

I'd be willing to try cleaning it myself. Not sure how equipped I am to fab my own tool, but I'll look around for a tutorial. :) Thanks!!
 
You can make a spanner out of some cheap pliers like I did to take the wind lever off. I used a dremel tool to grind the tips to a point. Be careful though because it's very easy to slip and scratch stuff.

You shouldn't need any of the ring spanners on the left.

 
off center alignment of markings at a position as seen below is normal for Canon LTM lenses.
I don't exactly why, but it has to do with visibility of the scale. On the net I read that an optional viewfinder or meter would obstruct visibility of markings if they were center.


Canon P with f1.8/35mm by andreas, on Flickr
 
A drop or two of lighter fluid on the cam arm should loosen it up. Shoot a roll before committing to a CLA. If your exposures are good, the camera doesn't need it!

Have fun.
 
mooge said:
You can make a spanner out of some cheap pliers like I did to take the wind lever off. I used a dremel tool to grind the tips to a point. Be careful though because it's very easy to slip and scratch stuff.

You shouldn't need any of the ring spanners on the left.
Click to expand...

Ahh! That might be doable. I can certainly grind away with a Dremel. I wonder how tight it is - I wonder if cheap digital caliper would be strong enough to turn the rewind knob.
 
kuuan said:
off center alignment of markings at a position as seen below is normal for Canon LTM lenses.
I don't exactly why, but it has to do with visibility of the scale. On the net I read that an optional viewfinder or meter would obstruct visibility of markings if they were center.
Click to expand...

The orientation looks the same as mine. I've also seen posts where people claim that the lens is oriented that way so that you can see the aperture in the VF. That could be true - for my 50/1.4 LTM at least, the selected aperture is in the bottom right corner of the 50mm frame. I wear contacts for near-sightedness, which makes it hard to focus on anything that close so I can't actually see the aperture.
 
Peter Jennings said:
A drop or two of lighter fluid on the cam arm should loosen it up. Shoot a roll before committing to a CLA. If your exposures are good, the camera doesn't need it!

Have fun.
Click to expand...

The shutter speeds sound good as far as I can tell (lot of wiggle room there). I was hoping that some use would loosen it up, but I've done a fair amount of focusing and it hasn't changed. I'll try the lighter fluid trick.

It certainly is a fun camera! I'm really loving the 1:1 finder and keeping both eyes open. Shame the finder isn't a bit bigger to make using the 35mm frames a bit easier. I've only got the 50mm, but I'd like to get a 35mm lens (Canon 35/2.8, Jupiter-12, or Voigtlander 35mm f/2.5) soon and get even more use out of this camera. :D
 
rev said:
Ahh! That might be doable. I can certainly grind away with a Dremel. I wonder how tight it is - I wonder if cheap digital caliper would be strong enough to turn the rewind knob.
Click to expand...

You're gonna need something rigid, so cheapo digital calipers probably won't cut it (and besides, the points aren't the right shape). Neither will dividers (like a compass with two points). I mean, you could try but you're more likely to scratch the screw.

Pouring lighter fluid into the camera without it being disassembled means that you run the risk of having whatever gunk is jamming something being washed down and potentially jamming something else. Just keep that in mind.


I bought my brother a J-12 for his Canon 7 and I'm surprised at how good it feels. It's one of the black ones, from the 80s. Haven't seen any photos from it yet though.
 
Shoot a roll and if it comes out good, you are fine. As I remember some of the Canons with metal curtains make that "swooshing" sound - normal. The other worry is tapering at the higher speeds - common on these same metal-shuttered Canon models. That you can check for it without film, but it will also be evident on shots taken at 1/500 and 1/1000. I'd recommend you shoot some scenes at 1/1000 against a smooth background like a blue sky to test for that. Shutter tapering is indicated by a smooth, dark swath of vignetting confined to one side of the frame. It is easily remedied with a CLA if present.
 
BTW I'd not attempt your own CLA on any camera unless you've been thoroughly trained by a professional or have been to a camera repair school.
 
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