Canon LTM Canon S-II: mioj or not?

[Jacques M.]

Hello,

I have just bought a Canon S-II in a very good condition, with its 3,5/50 Serenar.
S/n in the 190xx. But it doesn't have the "mioj" markings on the baseplate. That said, it's not the only one. I had a "Seiki Kogaku" s/n 15xxx which did not have it. And there is another s/n 19xxx on eBay which does not have it either.

I don't think that some of these cameras lost their original baseplate. So, is there a rule? What do you think?

Thanks. Jacques.

 

[Mackinaw]

This is what Dechert wrote about the S-II in his Canon rangefinder book, “This marking (whose standard abbreviation among collectors is MIOJ) began to appear on S-II baseplates before serial 20000, sometimes accompanied by ideograms translating ‘CPO’ within a diamond……”

FYI, the serial number range of the S-II is from 15700 to 23375.

Jim B.

 

[xayraa33]

If it was made after April 25th 1952 it will not have that mioj label.

Since that model was made from 1946 till 1949, it should have that label unless it does not have the original baseplate.

 

[Mackinaw]

If it was made after April 25th 1952 it will not have that mioj label.

Since that model was made from 1946 till 1949, it should have that label unless it does not have the original baseplate.

Canon actually produced small batches of the S-II in 1950 and 1952.

They also stopped using the MIOJ label early in 1951.

Jim B.

 

[Jacques M.]

Thanks!

I do understand the rule, but less the fact that some baseplates would have been changed on S-IIs. Why? Unless there is a psychological explanation: MIOJ (= made in occupied Japan) would have been infamous for some owners? Like the inscription " Luftwaffen Eigentum" sometimes erased on wartime Leicas?

BTW, my "Canon Seiki Kogaku" S-II had the s/n 15492, with the Serenar 8322 (Seiki Kogaku too). So, probably a preseries one, by Jim. When I think I sold it....:bang::bang:

Amitiés. Jacques.

 

[enasniearth]

The early ones are not marked
They were made before the made in occupied Japan marking was required
Most early ones were purchased by us servicemen stationed in Japan .

Peter writes in his canon rangefinder lenses book
"The first mioj marked base plates appeared on early canon sII cameras released after September 9 1947 "
if you don't have kitchingmans canon book its well worth the purchase price , information you will not find anywhere else .

Decharts book canon rangefinder cameras gives production dates of oct 1946 to June 1949 ( small numbers made after 1949)
So the canon sII was made the first 11 months with no mioj marking

Internet sites stating that cameras without mioj base plates have switched plates are in error

 

[xayraa33]

The early ones are not marked
They were made before the made in occupied Japan marking was required
Most early ones were purchased by us servicemen stationed in Japan .

Peter writes in his canon rangefinder lenses book
"The first mioj marked base plates appeared on early canon sII cameras released after September 9 1947 "
if you don't have kitchingmans canon book its well worth the purchase price , information you will not find anywhere else .

Decharts book canon rangefinder cameras gives production dates of oct 1946 to June 1949 ( small numbers made after 1949)
So the canon sII was made the first 11 months with no mioj marking

Internet sites stating that cameras without mioj base plates have switched plates are in error

It crossed my mind that this SII could have been a very early made one.

Maybe the OP can verify this by his camera's serial number placement in the range of serial numbers allotted to that model, as found in the Peter Dechert book.

 

[enasniearth]

Cameras were not completed in serial number order , most in early days were hand assembled by one person .
Since sII production lasted about 30 months and 11 months of production are not marked made in occupied Japan as many as one in three would possibly not be mioj marked , although in the early production not as many cameras were assembled so the figure would be lower .
All the seiki kogaku marked cameras I have had were not marked mioj .

 

[splitimageview]

I have an S-II on the way to me without MIOJ on the baseplate. It’s s/n 17xxx and is marked Canon Camera Co Ltd on the top plate.

Bundled lens is Nikkor 50/3.5.

 

[peterm1]

Was MIOJ only used for those intended for export or to be sold at PX shops? I do not know but am interested. After all what self respecting Japanese would want to buy a camera so labelled.

 

[goamules]

It was a directive by General MacAuthor, SCAPIN 1535. It was for items produced for export. There are different versions as why. Some say because it would encourage Americans who were just at war with Japan that it was OK to buy items because they were under control. Others say it was to punish Japan and hinder export. But Gen MacAuthor and the Marshall Plan both had goals to quickly rebuild the Japanese economy and help them.

 

[peterm1]

It was a directive by General MacAuthor, SCAPIN 1535. It was for items produced for export. There are different versions as why. Some say because it would encourage Americans who were just at war with Japan that it was OK to buy items because they were under control. Others say it was to punish Japan and hinder export. But Gen MacAuthor and the Marshall Plan both had goals to quickly rebuild the Japanese economy and help them.

Pretty much as I expected. Makes sense.