Changes to paypal policy!!!

[user237428934]

They were into accounts not attached to the CC account. They will go into accounts at banks different from and not associated with the CC + PP account. They want a profile and any holdings info they can access. They sell this info and will attempt to attach funds from unrelated accounts if permitted. Maybe things are different in the EU?

In Germany no one (except law enforcement with special permission) can go to my bank and ask, which accounts I have or how the balance of my accounts is.

We have an institution though that collects information about credit based contracts but that is a completely different story.

 

[Aristophanes]

I occasionally buy on eBay but not with paypal. I won't give them my account numbers so they won't do business with me.

It's simply the equivalent of submitting a void check, as one must do with utilities.

Of course, PayPal is not regulated like a utility or financial institution, but my understanding is it is treated by the banking exchanges as one.

 

[Roger Hicks]

State and Federal laws prohibite this.. They can only inquire about the account attached and no others..

My reply to you will be for this first point as our experiences differ.

The other is 2nd hand from a friend.

I didn't ask about any PayPal issues at my bank. A bank official approached me when in the bank and told me about the PayPal requests for bank information as per my accounts. She asked if i wanted PayPal to have access to this info as she thought it was odd. I told her that they were only to have access to my CC account info, this was the original information given to them when I opened the PP account in early 2004.

PayPal has gone through several lawsuits and I guess policy changes. Maybe policies have changed.

My friend of many years had the checking account frozen for several months. Funds weren't available to him. This was an account set up for PP. He was a buyer only and not a seller. The items purchased were generally knitting items for his wife and an occasional inexpensive camera for hobby use. He is a very tech savvy guy working in the industry. He said that he kept about $300 in the account.

I can't tell you any more than that. Our experiences differ vastly. And, I would add that just because a policy isn't legal, it doesn't mean much to some who think they can get away with the policy, not being punished or punished lightly if caught. Again, my opinion.

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1017-858264.html

No, that's simple truth, not opinion. Whether or not paypal is guilty of this approach is of course another matter.

Cheers,

R.

 

[dct]

Account access

Account access

In Germany no one (except law enforcement with special permission) can go to my bank and ask, which accounts I have or how the balance of my accounts is.

We have an institution though that collects information about credit based contracts but that is a completely different story.

Same rule for Switzerland; I suppose for the whole EU and associated nations. Same for the account information: If I want someone send me an amount to my account I tell the sender my finance institution, my account # (best done in IBAN format) and that's all. Without any fear, because this information can only be used for money transfer and doesn't imply any other rights on this account.

I cannot believe the only knowledge of an account # could be a problem for the owner in countries outside EU?

 

[jtm6]

Someone I know had a successful online business. She switched to collecting payments exclusively through Paypal. Paypal eventually froze her account for 6 months while they investigated "questionable activity". She couldn't access her account. She couldn't create a new account. She went out of business. They eventually released her money. She suspects either a competitor was involved and/or a paypal bot got bored one day. She never did anything wrong, paypal never explained why, she had no recourse.

The laws concerning paypal differ between the US and EU:

Peter Thiel, the founder of PayPal, has stated that PayPal is not a bank because it does not engage in fractional-reserve banking.[53] Rather, PayPal's funds that have not been disbursed are kept in commercial interest-bearing checking accounts.[54]

In the United States, PayPal is licensed as a money transmitter on a state-by-state basis.[55] PayPal is not classified as a bank in the United States, though the company is subject to some of the rules and regulations governing the financial industry including Regulation E consumer protections and the USA PATRIOT Act.[56]

In 2007, PayPal Europe was granted a Luxembourg banking license, which, under European Union law, allows it to conduct banking business throughout the EU.[57] It is therefore regulated as a bank by Luxembourg's banking supervisory authority, the Commission de Surveillance du Secteur Financier (CSSF).[58][59][60]

In Australia, PayPal is licensed as an Authorised Deposit-taking Institution (ADI) and is thus subject to Australian banking laws and regulations.[61]

 

[colyn]

PayPal has gone through several lawsuits and I guess policy changes. Maybe policies have changed.

I remember in the early days paypal was likened to a bull in a china cabnet but as a result of several lawsuits they got tamed to an extent.

I seldom keep much money in my paypal account or the bank account tied to it.. When I buy I transfer enough into the account so paypal can do an instant transfer..

My friend of many years had the checking account frozen for several months. Funds weren't available to him. This was an account set up for PP. He was a buyer only and not a seller. The items purchased were generally knitting items for his wife and an occasional inexpensive camera for hobby use. He is a very tech savvy guy working in the industry. He said that he kept about $300 in the account.

Did he ever get a court summons?

The reason I ask is that only by court order can someones account be locked...unless the account holder has violated bank rules. Even the IRS has to get a court order...

I would add that just because a policy isn't legal, it doesn't mean much to some who think they can get away with the policy, not being punished or punished lightly if caught.

I agree........both eBay and paypal violates their own rules...

 

[sepiareverb]

In my naive European world you use plain normal bank credit transfer. I pay nothing to transfer money within the whole EUR zone.

Bank transfers to EUR and even Canada are a PITA from rural America. It can literally take days to get every number and routing numbers and bank IBAN numbers and etc. and etc. to the right person and then one pays pretty hefty fees. I refuse to do business by bank transfer unless I'm getting such huge deal that I don;t mind spending days waiting on the phone, most of it on hold. The time involved is just not worth it.

 

[colyn]

Maybe I used an incorrect term in saying "Frozen". What he told me that paypal had contacted his bank (maybe electronically) and that he didn't have access to his account. I don't think there were any legal papers filed, but I may be incorrect in this; I'll ask when I see him.

If he were the seller and had lost a dispute but had no money in his paypal account paypal can ask the bank to take it from his account since it is attached to the paypal account but if access to the account was removed it would be the bank doing it until the matter is resolved. But if he were the buyer the bank acted contrary to their own rules..

I don't know that this would matter, but my friend, his bank and ebay + paypal are all in the same county.

Shouldn't matter..

 

[dct]

Which account exactly was frozen?

Which account exactly was frozen?

[...]
Maybe I used an incorrect term in saying "Frozen". What he told me that paypal had contacted his bank (maybe electronically) and that he didn't have access to his account. I don't think there were any legal papers filed, but I may be incorrect in this; I'll ask when I see him.

I don't know that this would matter, but my friend, his bank and ebay + paypal are all in the same county.

No, I don't think you used the wrong term, but I suspect your story is addressing the Paypal account and not the bank account, which was frozen by Paypal. Indeed, this is possible and if you have a lot of money parked at Paypal and you cannot transfer it to you bank account because of a hanging dispute or investigation, you may run into a flush problem.

But this doesn't mean Paypal can touch money already transferred on your bank account, because you as the bank account owner, are able to transfer or withdraw this money at any time, according to the agreed totals per day with your bank.

 

[daveleo]

The more I read here and think about this and talk to my legal friends, it becomes most likely that Paypal can lock up you Paypal account at least for the amount in dispute and maybe for the total amount already deposited in that account. But, without a court order (in the USA) they cannot lock you out of your own bank account. My legal friends got a laugh out of that one.

It's a little shaky as to what powers Paypal has to withdraw money from your bank account. That may (or may not) be some option that you, as a Paypal customer, set up in your profile. I can't see anywhere in my Paypal profile where I granted or denied them this permission.

As I said above, I have these questions into Paypal about my bank account. You can also bet that I will be in my bank in the morning to get their response to this stuff.

 

[daveleo]

It's tomorrow and I am back from chatting with a VP at my bank.

There is no way that Paypal can lock up your bank account. It takes the law to do that (a court order). Even if there is a Paypal dispute over some buy-sell event that you are involved in.

Of course Paypal can lock up your Paypal account but not your bank account.

This applies in the USA, don't know about other places.

What a wild goose chase !

 

[dct]

Correct, Dave. You explained the rules in fewer and better words than I did. Of course this is true for other countries too.

 

[pakeha]

It's tomorrow and I am back from chatting with a VP at my bank.

There is no way that Paypal can lock up your bank account. It takes the law to do that (a court order). Even if there is a Paypal dispute over some buy-sell event that you are involved in.

Of course Paypal can lock up your Paypal account but not your bank account.

This applies in the USA, don't know about other places.

What a wild goose chase !

yay! everyone can relax and let the paranoia go ...surely someone around here could have made this information at the second post..common knowledge after all I would have thought.

 

[Frontman]

My Paypal transactions each year number into the six figures range, but so far I have had no problems to speak of. An occasional buyer has lodged a dispute when their item hasn't shown up (these were due to excessive customs delays), and Paypal had frozen the amount of the purchase until the buyers received their items, but they have never suspended my account.

I find Paypal to be a worthwhile service; they are reasonably fast, and offer more security than simply sending a bank transfer. I suppose a few of us remember the member here who bought a $2500 Summilux from eBay a couple years ago, and sent his payment via bank transfer, and never received his lens nor saw his $2500 again. His transfer was free, too bad it was not protected.