Cheap 35mm SLR for sport/action photos, using manual focus lens?

[mugget]

Hi all,

Just looking for ideas & opinions about a cheap film SLR (and lens combo) that will be suitable for motorsport/action type photography.

I am open to any brand, the only camera I have at this stage is an M8 with 50mm Summilux - but I previously had a Canon 1D MkII with 400mm f/4-5.6L which I used for motorsport photos (to give an idea of what I'm used to). I don't need a high framerate, in fact ever single time I try to capture more than one frame at a time it never comes out as good as if I just concentrate and plan on making a single frame. I'm definitely a "one shot" kind of guy.

I am leaning towards the Minolta Maxxum 9 (only because Maxxum 7 seems to be rare as hens teeth), this seems to be a good body and also allows lots of options for older (cheaper) lens as well as most of the newer Sony lenses?

I did think about going manual focus with something like an old Canon body and FD lens. The big plus there is that all the gear is cheap (like really cheap!) and I'd rather not spend too much, it's just that I am starting to miss the motorsport photography a bit and at the same time I want to start using more film. The M8 is not the only camera I actually have... but it's the only "proper" camera. I have a Wide Angle Slim, basically a wide angle plastic "toy camera". But I've been really surprised with some of the photos from it, turns out that film is pretty cool!! 😀

Anyway I would be very interested to hear thoughts from people who have used tele/super-tele manual focus lenses for sports & wildlife etc. I think it might suit the way I approach photography, but I do wonder if I would be asking for lots of future frustrations with manual focus.

Cheers for any comments. 🙂

Also my Dad has an old Minolta XG-2 that I would have liked to use, but it seems to be dead... new battery and there's just no signs of life. I don't suppose if anyone knows about that camera, whether it would be an easy fix or better just to get rid of it on eBay?

 

[Lawrence Sheperd]

May I suggest a Canon T-90? The "Tank" is known for it's build quality and feature set; definitely the most advanced manual focus camera Canon ever developed. And, as you say, the FD series lenses are undervalued at the moment, but give away nothing to other manufacturers' glass. The T-90 feels great in my hands and is hefty enough to provide a stable platform for hand-held shots with a longish tele. Auto exposure modes are generally spot-on and the built-in motor wind really zips along!

About the only downside is that the magnets which are a part of the electronic shutter can cause the shutter to "stick" when not used enough, throwing an error message. The standard "fix" is to give the camera a sharp rap on the bottom plate (most use either their hand or a carpeted or padded surface) which will free up the shutter in most cases. If you use your T-90 regularly you shouldn't have a problem.

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

Well, if the idea of FD lenses appeals then look for a Canon body. The T90 is dear compared to say the T80 (? in the action mode ?) which takes both FD lenses and the special AC (or auto focus ones, which are rare).

Or take your dad's Minolta into a repair shop, you might get a pleasant surprise and Minolta's VF screens are nice to use.

As for P&S's, some of them are just brilliant and make you wonder why you should bother with anything else. And they are dirt cheap at present as no one seems to want them and there's millions of them out there.

Regards, David

 

[Kiwijohn]

The Canon T70 is even cheaper. I've got 2 now for under $6.
or an older EOS can be had for peanuts if you want something more advanced than a T70, but cheaper than a T90.

 

[Addy101]

The Dynax 9 (Maxxum 9) is the best camera I've used and I consider it better then the Canon EOS 1v. The only downside is that not all are SSM capable - that to me is the biggest advantage of the Dynax/Maxxum 7. Neither is really cheap.

Why not simply pick up a Minolta X700 with a 300mm prime? You could use your dad's Minolta lenses. That XG-2 isn't worth much, but take a look over at The Rokkorfiles.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

I've been touting the use of manual focus lenses on DSLRs for a year or so now as I do it for work.
Last fall I was shooting night time high school football games with a 300mm f/4.5 AiS ED IF Nikkor lens (as well as an 85mm and 50mm) with no problem on my D3 (with modified focusing screen for MF lenses.)

Seeing as you're looking to use a film SLR for sports, get a good lens such as the aforementioned 300mm or possibly one of the 400mm offerings with a short focus throw and go to town.

With a pro level SLR like a Nikon F3 or F2; Canon F1/F1n, Pentax LX/MX you can change out the focusing screen for a good chunky grit one like the D screen for the Nikons. The coarse grit offers the ability to focus across the whole frame if you need that ability. This can save a bit of time when a tight end is diving for the goal line and your composition isn't centered but you need to snap focus just a bit. Otherwise, you can use the split-prism and miscroprism spot/ring screens to great effect.

When I eventually dump the DSLR ball and chain, I'll immediately get an F2.

Phil Forrest

 

[p.giannakis]

The XG-2 has a very dark focusing screen and unmetered manual - the X-700 is a far better choice. Have you considered the 9xi? It is cheaper than the dynax 9 and just as good.
Canon-wise an EOS-5 can be an excellent option but if you want to use the FD line of lenses, then why not looking at an A-1 maybe?

 

[rivercityrocker]

You can always use the M8 for sports. Stick a cheap 90mm Elmar on it. Or a 135 if you can get used to estimating the frame. The M8 crop factor will work to your advantage.

I shot MotoGP this weekend and I did some shooting with my M9-P and a 72 year old 90mm Elmar f/4. The results were quite good.

If you definitely want a film DSLR check out the Pentax Spotmatic. Plentiful, inexpensive, great lenses.

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

I can't say if it applies to your father's Minolta but jammed shutters can be caused by the failure of a cheap and easily replaced part, a condenser or capacitor as they are called these days. It might be worth checking.

Otherwise the X-700 or X-300 are worth looking at, as Minolta lenses are usually very much under rated. I've just put one on my keep forever list and have paid out to get it checked over and a minor repair done, if that helps. Plus I bought a Tokina zoom for the X-300...

Regards, David

 

[defconfunk]

Find the lens you want, then get the body for it.

Depending on the sport, 200mm is probably enough (if you are right on the sidelines of a field, that is enough for football, soccer, and the like). Vivitar made a great 70-210mm F3.5 Macro Series 1. They made it for most mounts. I've got it on my Olympus gear and it works well. I find the focusing is easier than the similar Olympus lens (65-200 F4 macro I think). I have a similar Vivitar in FD mount that I've never really used.

If you shoot Nikon, Vivitar didn't reverse the focus direction for Nikon mount, so it'll focus in the opposite direction of your other lenses. That said, I find the long (>300mm) Nikon lenses are easier to find than the other brands.

 

[mugget]

Wow thanks for all the info & suggestions... now to just try and digest it all.

I didn't know about the Canon AC auto focus lenses - that could be handy. But I wonder how they compare to modern auto focus? Not that I would use it for any action, but for "walkabout" or event type photos is it adequate?

One other thing I'm not too sure on - can the T90 use the AC (auto focus) lenses? Or are the AC lens only compatible with the T80? It only compatible with the T80 I don't think the occasional use of auto focus would outweight the benefits of the T90.

Speaking of T80/90, I have found some that are fairly similar in price, so the T90 does qualify in my "cheap" criteria. Mind you, the T80 did include the AC 35-70mm and 75-200mm lenses... (I don't need anything that is in excellent condition, as long as it works I don't mind about brassing, scratches, etc.)

I did look up the Minolta X700 as well, the body is cheaper (around $70 compared to $120 for the T90 based on what I found) but I get the feeling that FD lenses will be more plentiful and cheaper in the long run? Or maybe it is just lots and lots of the 50/1.8 that are being sold? 😛

Actually I am thinking of starting with something like the Sigma 500mm f/7.2 APO. Guess I can always try it out and see how it goes, good thing that there seems to be a bit of a market for these older lenses and it's a relatively inexpensive tryout.

rivercityrocker - that shot is great! I did think about getting an old Canon rangefinder (~$60 or so) and a M39/screw mount lens so I could use it with an adapter on my M8 as well (since the 50/1.4 is the only lens I have for it now, having a longer lens to use on the M8 would only be a good thing) but the lenses are a bit more expensive and I'm not sure that I would be happy at 90 or 135mm. Even with a 2x converter... most racetracks around here place the spectators fairly far back, even when I had the 400mm lens I wished I had longer. I am leaning towards SLR and giving a 500mm lens a try...

Thanks David for that info. I will get the XG-2 checked out, no point letting it go to waste! What do you think about availability of the MD lenses? I am wondering if I would much prefer using the T90 over an older camera like the X-700. No way around it, I already started a spreadsheet to get an idea of prices, guess I will add the X-700 on there!

 

[mugget]

Find the lens you want, then get the body for it.

I like that methodology. 🙂

But it's not quite so easy because all of the lenses I would be interested in (at least as far as focal lengths) are available for both Canon & Minolta (FD and MD).

And I don't know enough about the individual lenses to make the choice based on that, which is why I'm thinking more about overall price/value and which camera would be easier for me to use.

As long as the lens (which ever lens) will perform better than an EF-S kit lens, then I'll be happy! Pretty sure that's a given... right?

 

[rwintle]

I shoot a LOT of motorsports... but very seldom with film (DSLRs, yeah yeah, whatever). I've shot some in the past with a Pentax MZ-50 + Pentax 100-300mm combination, with mixed (i.e., mostly poor) results, and some with scale-focus 35mm and even a TLR (yes really - it was an experiment 😀).

This year I will be taking a Spotmatic with a Bushnell 135/2.8 and see what I can get done with it. My guess is that something with a modern AF system would be much more satisfactory, but I am confident enough in my panning skills to prefocus on the track at relatively narrow apertures (I'm often at f/16 or so with the shutter speeds I use anyway). I think that head-on, or round-the-corner type shots will be a disaster given my manual focusing skills, but we will see. 😉

Sorry, that probably didn't answer your question other than to suggest that your idea of an old Canon body and manual focus might be a bit frustrating. Of course if you go that route and rock it, I will be very impressed. 😀

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

It's worth looking at your dad's Minolta; at worse it could be mended as a second body. Useful for back-up and, at shows etc, it pays to have a couple of cameras with different lenses on each. One for things you can't get too near to and the other wide to standard; I guess things happen at races to photograph that don't happen on the track..

The Canon T's are cheap and generally unloved apart from the T90 because Canon decided on the all new EOS AF etc, etc, mount and abandoned the T range quickly. I saw my T80 as a useful automatic body that takes FD and the few AC lenses. (Also it takes cheapo batteries, the T80 takes 4 AAA's; some cameras are dirt cheap as the batteries cost more than the body on ebay.)

BTW, I still think the T's were a good design; an all auto camera with few controls looks dreadful in this forum but you'll be very unlucky to catch it out.

Talking of zooms, beware of too much range. I go to air shows and the planes zoom up quickly and so you zoom to get them filling the frame at a distance and a split second later they are too near and you've over zoomed. A zoom that stops at about 200mm suits me fine: if I want portraits of the pilots I wait until they've landed.

Hope this is some help.

Regards, David

PS Have you thought about downloading manuals and studying them before deciding on the cameras?

 

[leicapixie]

Thread: Cheap 35mm SLR for sport/action photos, using manual focus lens? Reply to T

Thread: Cheap 35mm SLR for sport/action photos, using manual focus lens? Reply to T

There are a slew of SLR out there!
Some i bought, others donated.
Main thing to check, is it working?
2nd what batteries?
The later film EOS use expensive batteries..
Cameras requiring mercury cells are a problem.
All my SLR have a "bridge" circuit and unaffected by slightly higher voltage.
The Pentax Spotmatic, Fuji m-42 thread etc.
I have Canon AE-1P,Minolta XG series, Nikon Ftn,Pentax.
They are all great.

A different suggestion!
Get a 135mm Elmar or Tele-Elmar for your M8.
Not the Hektor..mine are all soft.
It becomes a slightly longer focal length.

 

[TXForester]

I'm with defconfunk. I have the vivitar series 1, 70-210/3.5 that I used for aerial shots at airshows. I used mine on the olympus om1 and om2. I used it last night on a dslr to shoot the eclipse.

 

[KoNickon]

You need to RUN over to APUG -- there's a T90 for $65 there.

 

[mugget]

Cheers for the heads-up on APUG, I never even knew about that forum - will check it out... That T90 looks to be US shipping only though... not to worry I found another one for a similar price if I decide to go that way.

Good advice to study the manuals before deciding on a camera, I will do that. Also Googling for more info on manual focus lens for motor/sport use... starting to doubt my ability with MF. I'll see what I can learn about that.

 

[Frontman]

A Nikon FE or F3 is a great choice, either can be had for very little. I use the Nikkor 50-300 ED zoom, which is a little more pricy, but only a tenth of its original $3500 price tag when new. The FE and F3 are solid cameras which are not plastic, have great meters, and AE capability.

 

[farlymac]

Cheers for the heads-up on APUG, I never even knew about that forum - will check it out... That T90 looks to be US shipping only though... not to worry I found another one for a similar price if I decide to go that way.

Good advice to study the manuals before deciding on a camera, I will do that. Also Googling for more info on manual focus lens for motor/sport use... starting to doubt my ability with MF. I'll see what I can learn about that.

When shooting sports cars, you can pre-focus on a spot you want to see the action in, and wait for the car to arrive.

PF