CRY FOR HELP (with image processing)

[willie_901]

Bill,

I suspect there are many solutions that can produce excellent prints.

Just use what works well for you. The combination of the user experience and the product (print) is all that counts.

The user experience means the application is easy for us to use. Someone who started out with Photoshop for 20 years ago will use PS. Someone who prefers applications with a user friendly, intuitive interfaces might hate PS.


For what it's worth:

I calibrate my monitor regularly.

For digital images

o I use Lightroom Classic CC (OS X).
o I always work with raw files.
o Sometimes I use the legacy (2012 Google) OS X version of NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 as a LR plug in

For 35mm B&W film

o I use a PlusTek 7600i scanner
o I do a one scan pass at 48 bits per pixel
o Then I use the Vuescan preview to optimize Skew and Crop parameters
o The scan is saved as a Vuescan raw DNG file using the Raw Output with Scan option (grain or IR correction not invoked)
o This DNG file is essentially a flat TIFF file - except for the Crop and Skew corrections there are no other VueScan rendering adjustments
o The DNG file rendering is then optimized in Lightroom
o I often use NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 when a negative was ill-exposed and, or ill-developed.
o I also use NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 when I film and digital images together for a project or series. It is difficult or impossible to render a film image comparably to a digital image. I find Silver Effex Pro 2 is a convenient way to render digital images similarly to film images.

 

[Bill Pierce]

Bill,

I suspect there are many solutions that can produce excellent prints.

Just use what works well for you. The combination of the user experience and the product (print) is all that counts.

The user experience means the application is easy for us to use. Someone who started out with Photoshop for 20 years ago will use PS. Someone who prefers applications with a user friendly, intuitive interfaces might hate PS.


For what it's worth:

I calibrate my monitor regularly.

For digital images

o I use Lightroom Classic CC (OS X).
o I always work with raw files.
o Sometimes I use the legacy (2012 Google) OS X version of NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 as a LR plug in

For 35mm B&W film

o I use a PlusTek 7600i scanner
o I do a one scan pass at 48 bits per pixel
o Then I use the Vuescan preview to optimize Skew and Crop parameters
o The scan is saved as a Vuescan raw DNG file using the Raw Output with Scan option (grain or IR correction not invoked)
o This DNG file is essentially a flat TIFF file - except for the Crop and Skew corrections there are no other VueScan rendering adjustments
o The DNG file rendering is then optimized in Lightroom
o I often use NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 when a negative was ill-exposed and, or ill-developed.
o I also use NIK Silver Effex Pro 2 when I film and digital images together for a project or series. It is difficult or impossible to render a film image comparably to a digital image. I find Silver Effex Pro 2 is a convenient way to render digital images similarly to film images.

We work in somewhat similar ways, except I have finally worn an old Imacon scanner down to the point where it is essentially unrepairable. The PlusTek sounds a lot more affordable; so, I guess we will be working in even more similar ways.

 

[kbb]

If you want to make high quality prints (inkjet), but don't want to fork over for a specialist RIP-type application, Lightroom is the best. I tried printing from C-1 v.12 during the free trial, and the printed result was not acceptable. The printed image deviated from the display image way too much.
Maybe I'm very habituated to Lightroom for printing...but I remember the very first prints I made from Lightroom to a nice printer (Epson 3800) looking as expected; the first prints from C-1 were funky.

 

[Evergreen States]

As mentioned in other posts, I'm running a 12 year old Mac that's on it's last legs, but I haven't figured out a photo processing solution for a new computer. I've been using Apple's Aperture since the beginning and Photoshop 4 up thru CS6 (the last stand alone), and the original version of SilverEfex Pro, and finally Photo Mechanic for work.

I've held off on buying a new Mac because I can't see myself ever being okay with the subscription model of software, so Photoshop & Lightroom are off the table. I'm not aware of what has happened to SilverEfex Pro and who owns it now and if there even is a current version that will run on the new Macs. Apple's Aperture is long dead and won't run on new machines. I do believe that Photo Mechanic will run on the current Apple operating system.

So I've been looking around for some time, might see if the last pre-subscription version of Photoshop Elements runs on the new operating system, but I haven't looked at that software since it's origins in 2001, so not sure how the user interface stacks up.

Wish there was a way to update the hardware, without having to update the software, so I could keep using what I am comfortable with. Old Man Problems. Ha!!!

Best,
-Tim

Raw Power, is in fact made by the former Apple developers who made Aperture, so might be your best substitute.

I'm put off by the subscription model Adobe now uses, so during a 40% off sale I took the plunge with Capture One Pro 20. I need to put more time into learning how to make local adjustments on Capture One, so for now I'm exporting clone adjustments and dodging and burning to Photoshop CS5.5, which was bought for me by an institution back when it was the latest and greatest. My iMac stopped being eligible for OS upgrades a few years ago, so I am stuck with High Sierra, which fortunately is still 32 bit compatible so I can run Photoshop CS5 and the Nik Collection v.2. I used to make heavy use of Nik Silver Efex, but now I find my old pictures overprocessed and I do most of my black and white conversions in Capture One with sliders and curves, only occasionally doing conversions in Silver Efex.

Silver Efex and the rest of the Nik Collection was sold to Google, who bought it just for Snapseed. They made the rest of the Nik Collection free for a while, then made it clear they would discontinue updating it. Then it was bought up by DXO, whose first order of business was to release an update for 64 bit compatibility, beginning v.3. They have since made additional updates and added new presets. The link to the current home of the Nik Collection is here:

https://nikcollection.dxo.com

 

[Ko.Fe.]

To me real difference in digital images processing comes with printing. All good printers I'm aware of are using PS.
I'm printing for myself and don't mind re-print few times, if I have to.
I use LR and windows print on right moue click.

I also use old Nicks's Collection from Google for bw and free old DxO. But rarely.
I work with image processing equipment, software since nineties. Here is no lossless processing.
More picture gets processed crappier it looks to my eyes.
I prefer to take exposures correctly on the spot. To keep them as close to SOOC as possible.
But they say even for SOOC some applications are better than others.

Yet, if it is true, then some cameras might work better than others with LR, which I use most.
Olympus files are great in LR. Better than modern Canon R series and old, new M9 sensors.

 

[stevierose]

Some of this depends upon which camera system you use. Capture One seems to do a better job with Fujifilm Xtran Raw files than PS/LR. Also using X-transformer and then LR works well for some folks with those files. These days I shoot BW images with film and color with digital. For my BW workflow I now do "scanning" with a mirrorless camera and macro lens on a copy stand with the negative in a holder and a light panel behind it. The RAW file is brought into Lightroom where I use an excellent plugin called Negative Lab Pro to do the initial inversion and global tonal adjustments, completing the work in Lightroom. NLP is an excellent piece of software for film users. I use it for BW but it really helps with color negative films.

 

[Rob-F]

As mentioned in other posts, I'm running a 12 year old Mac that's on it's last legs, but I haven't figured out a photo processing solution for a new computer. I've been using Apple's Aperture since the beginning . . .

Apple's Aperture is long dead and won't run on new machines.

Wish there was a way to update the hardware, without having to update the software, so I could keep using what I am comfortable with. Old Man Problems. Ha!!!

Best,
-Tim

I'm running Aperture on my 2009 iMac, my 2009 Macbook, and my 2013 Macbook Pro. I agree, I'd like to be able to use it on a newer Mac and not have to start over with something else. I never could get Capture One to do anything. I had more luck with LR but its filing system is archaic compared to Aperture. I plan to stay with Aperture. Maybe I'll upgrade to a 2017 or so iMac that still takes Aperture. I feel the reports of Aperture's death are exaggerated.

 

[Out to Lunch]

A very distinguished and refined audience, indeed. Does no one use ACDSeePro10 or a later version?

 

[willie_901]

... I am stuck with High Sierra, which fortunately is still 32 bit compatible so I can run Photoshop CS5 and the Nik Collection v.2. I used to make heavy use of Nik Silver Efex, but now I find my old pictures overprocessed and I do most of my black and white conversions in Capture One with sliders and curves, only occasionally doing conversions in Silver Efex.

...

The 2012 Google version of the NIK Suite is 32/64 bit compatible. I downloaded this version in September. I am running these with Catalina OS X 10.15.7 (19H114).

Silver Efex Pro 2:

Version: 2.2.24
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Silver Efex Pro 2.app
Kind: 32/64-bit

Analog Efex Pro 2:

Version: 2.0.12
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Analog Efex Pro 2.app
Kind: 32/64-bit

Color Efex Pro 4:

Version: 4.3.24
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Color Efex Pro 4.app
Kind: 32/64-bit

Dfine2:

Version: 2.2.21
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Dfine2.app
Kind: 32/64-bit
Get Info String: 2.2.21.10, Copyright ©2000-2014, Google

HDR Efex Pro 2:

Version: 2.2.24
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/HDR Efex Pro 2.app
Kind: 32/64-bit

Sharpener Pro 3 Output Sharpening:

Version: 3.1.21
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Sharpener Pro 3 Output Sharpening.app
Kind: 32/64-bit
Get Info String: 3.1.21.10, Copyright ©2000-2014, Google

Sharpener Pro 3 Raw Presharpening:

Version: 3.1.21
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Sharpener Pro 3 Raw Presharpening.app
Kind: 32/64-bit
Get Info String: 3.1.21.10, Copyright ©2000-2014, Google

Viveza 2:

Version: 2.1.21
Obtained from: Identified Developer
Last Modified: 1/25/21, 11:30 AM
Signed by: Developer ID Application: Google Inc., Developer ID Certification Authority, Apple Root CA
Location: /Applications/Nik Collection/Viveza 2.app
Kind: 32/64-bit
Get Info String: 2.1.21.10, Copyright ©2000-2014, Google

In two to three years Apple will cease support for Intel processors. So, in four to five years the DxO version will be the only way to access these applications.

 

[willie_901]

We work in somewhat similar ways, except I have finally worn an old Imacon scanner down to the point where it is essentially unrepairable. The PlusTek sounds a lot more affordable; so, I guess we will be working in even more similar ways.

I know next to nothing about today's most cost effective scanner hardware options. I am happy with the 7600 even though is at least one generation behind their newer products (8200i and 8100). Fortunately VueScan has drivers for both 8000 series scanners.

 

[Godfrey]

Looking at Gentlemen Coders RAW Power 3.0, it looks like a possible replacement for Apple's now retired Aperture software, sort of a competition with Lightroom, and looks to be oriented to organizing as well as processing photo files. Am I reading that right?

Aperture's operations are based on the same photography oriented system frameworks that iPhoto and now Photos are based on. Aperture opened up more of the specific framework functions to user control, where iPhoto/Photos uses those functions 'under the covers' to do the job. Photos allows doing most of what Aperture once allowed in the past, minus some of the more professionally oriented things.

RAW Power operates symbiotically with Photos and the same underlying Apple system frameworks and once again exposes more of their specific functionality to user control, while leveraging Photos use as a content manager (a simple DAM). I haven't worked with v3 yet ... Gentlemen Coders may have added more functionality standalone in this version ... but I believe the model remains the same. It's a very nice adjunct to Photos: the two working together gives one much of what Aperture once did.

One nice key thing about this setup is that RAW Power is available for macOS, iOS, and iPadOS, which means you can have the same image processing system running on all Apple devices and sharing data seamlessly.

It's very good stuff. I've now got the latest versions installed on all systems (Mac mini, iPhone 11 Pro, iPad Pro 11...) and one of my projects is to evaluate its use and see whether it is capable to be my complete replacement for Lightroom et al. Between Photos/RAW Power and Hasselblad Phocus, I might be able to give Adobe the boot completely... LOL!

G

 

[ColSebastianMoran]

I say:
- Photoshop for ultimate massaging of one image
- Lightroom is damn good for post processing and also manages the whole universe of your photos (non-destructive editing, master photos ready to export, keywords, people, map locations, files in locations you can access).

I use specialized programs for other purposes:
- Pick your favorite noise reduction... Miine is Topaz DeNoise
- Could be a little sharper... Focus Magic applies Richardson-Lucy deconvolution
- Inspect your RAWs... RAWDigger
- Touch up portraits... Portrait Pro and Portrait Pro Body