jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
This isn't very relevant to anything, but I figured this was the forum where people were most likely to sympathize:
A rough-but-apparently-functional Contax IIIa with 50/1.5 Opton Sonnar went on eBay today for $131. I had been watching this with the idea of trying to bag it at the last minute, but the auction ended while I was at work and stuck in a meeting.
If I had just entered my planned $150 maximum bid, instead of being clever and trying to snipe, I would have bagged it. Even after paying its $285 tuition at the Henry Scherer Academy, I figure I would have been ahead.
Drat!
A rough-but-apparently-functional Contax IIIa with 50/1.5 Opton Sonnar went on eBay today for $131. I had been watching this with the idea of trying to bag it at the last minute, but the auction ended while I was at work and stuck in a meeting.
If I had just entered my planned $150 maximum bid, instead of being clever and trying to snipe, I would have bagged it. Even after paying its $285 tuition at the Henry Scherer Academy, I figure I would have been ahead.
Drat!
peter_n
Veteran
My sympathies. I have the same potential problem towards the end of the week, a meeting scheduled for when something is ending on eBay. I will try to avoid your fate...
R
Roman
Guest
Well, I feel for you - a Leica M3 I had on my watchlist went for 300-and-something Euros on Ebay today, but of course I came back a day later than expected from a trip. But then again, it is really an M2 that I'm lusting after (even more so after comparing 'denishr's M2, M3 and M6).
Roman
Roman
CleverName
Well-known
This is just my opinion, but all sniping at the last minute does is make the the sniper think he got a great deal and piss off the other guy who bid.
If you try to snipe something and the other guy already has a bid in for more than your bid, you're still gonna lose. It doesn't matter if you put your bid in the day it's listed or the last second, if it's the highest bid it wins.
I used to get mad at snipers, but I guess it's just part of the game. Now I just bid what I'm willing to pay and wait for the auction to end.
If you try to snipe something and the other guy already has a bid in for more than your bid, you're still gonna lose. It doesn't matter if you put your bid in the day it's listed or the last second, if it's the highest bid it wins.
I used to get mad at snipers, but I guess it's just part of the game. Now I just bid what I'm willing to pay and wait for the auction to end.
kiev4a
Well-known
Ah, but you are missing the point of sniping. Why put in your absolute highest bid right away when there is a possibility of getting it for a lot less at the last second? Besides, you never know when you will run into some newby with zero feedback who will top a bid placed early even if it's the absolute maximum the camera is worth. Same thing happens auctions around our area when someone who is experienced gets caught up in the bidding and pays more for a five-year-old air compressor than it would cost new at Sears.
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
CleverName said:
I know -- I've already worked out through game theory that sniping as a strategy doesn't pay, since there's no information available about how high other bidders would be willing to go, and ties always go to the earlier bid. But I don't want to get that argument started again! Some people enjoy sniping, and that's that.
I don't enjoy it, and usually I don't do it if I come across something I KNOW I want. What gets me into trouble (if you can consider getting to keep your money in your pocket "trouble") is when I'm not sure whether I want to bid or not... I procrastinate, think, "there are still a couple of days left to think it over, I can always jump in at the last minute if I decide to go for it..." and sometimes I get burned.
Ah, well, that Contax probably was a piece of junk anyway -- if I really, really wanted one, the smart thing to do would be to send Henry a sack of money and let him handle it...
JoeFriday
Agent Provacateur
I lost out on a very nice Summicron yesterday when I didn't make it back from the store before the auction ended.. so it seems to be contagious
but you do realize that it's entirely possible that you wouldn't have gotten it for your $150 max bid, anyway.. it's possible that would have beat out the actual winner.. and it's also possible that the winner had a max bid in at $200.. so don't lose too much sleep over it.. and there will always be another Contax/Sonnar coming up for sale
but you do realize that it's entirely possible that you wouldn't have gotten it for your $150 max bid, anyway.. it's possible that would have beat out the actual winner.. and it's also possible that the winner had a max bid in at $200.. so don't lose too much sleep over it.. and there will always be another Contax/Sonnar coming up for sale
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
JoeFriday said:
Yeah, I know. As I said, I've game-theoried this whole thing.
Still, that's what makes eBay work -- fear of irrational regret. It's like when you think, "Drat, I was only one number away from winning the lottery," even though every non-winning number is just as likely as every other non-winning number.
What's really good about this is that by the time the next postwar Contax/West German 1.5 Sonnar comes up, I'll have remembered all the things I didn't like about the one I used to have (having to lift the shutter-speed dial to change speeds; the squinty eyepiece; the uncertainty about the location of picture edges in the non-framed finder; having to turn the camera over to see the revolving f/numbers...) and do something sensible instead, like keep my money in my pocket, or spend it on stuff for my more modern, more usable Canons and Bessa, and leave the Contaxes to the serious Contax enthusiasts.
Okay, I feel better now...
Someone has to fess up, who got it?
I bid on a Canon P then lost my connection to the internet at work. When I got home I learned I didn't win the camera, but later found out that ray_g did!!
At least I got to meet her in person and hold her.
I normally snipe when there is something I really want, but sometimes I just bid, and even win. Ebay is a hobby all by itself.
I bid on a Canon P then lost my connection to the internet at work. When I got home I learned I didn't win the camera, but later found out that ray_g did!!
At least I got to meet her in person and hold her.I normally snipe when there is something I really want, but sometimes I just bid, and even win. Ebay is a hobby all by itself.
ChrisN
Striving
CleverName said:
If every bidder would just bid their max, then walk away, there'd be no problem. The problem is the people who up their bid when they see someone else has topped it - a bidding war. I also get really stressed watching the last minute of an auction and waiting to drop my bid in late - my heart literally starts pounding like I've run up a set of stairs! These days, if I'm serious about an item, I'll lodge my maximum bid with a sniper service, then ignore it till after the auction has ended. That way I stick to my maximum bid and I don't contribute to a bidding war. And my heart rate stays relatively normal.
zuikologist
.........................
At lease you guys do not completely organise your lives around ebay ending times, or do you..............
oftheherd
Veteran
Although I bid both ways, I firmly set what my limit will be, and don't go above it. Sometimes as someone else stated, I worry that if I bid too early, someone else will just bid over it when I might get it by sniping. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I figure I win either way.
KoNickon
Nick Merritt
Hmm -- I probably do organize my life that way to some extent!
I am guilty of sniping recently. I bid early on a chrome 150 Sonnar for my Hasselblad and got outbid, but kept my eye on it. Ended up bidding $5 above the then-highest bid with just a few seconds to go and got it, for $310, which I think is the lowest I've ever seen that lens. I bid, as much as anything, to assure myself the high bidder in fact had bid higher than what I was planning to bid. I would have been ticked off to see the lens go for so cheap to someone else. I was quite surprised to get it.
I am guilty of sniping recently. I bid early on a chrome 150 Sonnar for my Hasselblad and got outbid, but kept my eye on it. Ended up bidding $5 above the then-highest bid with just a few seconds to go and got it, for $310, which I think is the lowest I've ever seen that lens. I bid, as much as anything, to assure myself the high bidder in fact had bid higher than what I was planning to bid. I would have been ticked off to see the lens go for so cheap to someone else. I was quite surprised to get it.
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
rover said:Someone has to fess up, who got it?
I bid on a Canon P then lost my connection to the internet at work. When I got home I learned I didn't win the camera, but later found out that ray_g did!!
Do you refer to Canon Ps in the feminine gender?
Or are you telling us something about ray_g that will come as a surprise to many?
jlw said:
Um, good point, let me rephrase....
"At least I got to see the CAMERA in person and hold her."
RJBender
RFF Sponsoring Member
jlw said:
Was the IIIa from the same seller that had the IIa that went for $176? The IIa was listed as a II and looked moldy to me.
R.J.
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
Yes, I think it was. And yes, now that you mention it, that IIa did look a little weird.
doubs43
Well-known
If I snipe and lose, at least I have the satisfaction of knowing that the winner didn't get it as cheaply as he would have if I hadn't bid at all.
Sometimes I snipe and I'm surprised at how cheaply I win something. Other times I'm surprised at how high someone else is willing to go.
If I really want something badly enough, I bid more than any sane person would. There are times when someone bids even more so I know they're insane!
The problem with showing your hand too early is that it allows others to convince themselves that they really want it badly enough to keep going higher until they exceed your bid. You must also be alert to shill bidders who try to run up the cost. They can only run you up if you have a bid on the table to be run up or you try to trump their bids. Sniping keeps them from running you up and if the bid gets higher than I'm willing to go then I forget about sniping and move on to something else that I want.
But, we each have our methods, our own reasoning and our own way of bidding. I'm comfortable with how I do things so I'll continue doing it my way. For every "stinker" I've gotten, I've won many more good - and sometimes great - deals. I'm doing something right I suppose. I hope that all of the RFF members have success in their efforts to nab a good deal.
Walker
Sometimes I snipe and I'm surprised at how cheaply I win something. Other times I'm surprised at how high someone else is willing to go.
If I really want something badly enough, I bid more than any sane person would. There are times when someone bids even more so I know they're insane!
The problem with showing your hand too early is that it allows others to convince themselves that they really want it badly enough to keep going higher until they exceed your bid. You must also be alert to shill bidders who try to run up the cost. They can only run you up if you have a bid on the table to be run up or you try to trump their bids. Sniping keeps them from running you up and if the bid gets higher than I'm willing to go then I forget about sniping and move on to something else that I want.
But, we each have our methods, our own reasoning and our own way of bidding. I'm comfortable with how I do things so I'll continue doing it my way. For every "stinker" I've gotten, I've won many more good - and sometimes great - deals. I'm doing something right I suppose. I hope that all of the RFF members have success in their efforts to nab a good deal.
Walker
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Considering an eBay auction as a "game" is I think a losing idea, though fostered by eBay through their use of the word "Win" to describe what the eventual buyer has done... which is actually paying more for something than anyone else would pay!
Sniping can be a way to avoid "playing the game". First, a last-second bid does not give other bidders an opportunity to "play" by responding to your bid. Secondly it does not give YOU the opportunity to bid again, enforcing some discipline. Figure how much you'll pay, bid at the last second, and you know that's your one and final bid. If some other bidder's maximum was higher, so be it; your bid what was right for you.
Some recent eBay purchases have shown me that I'm having problems with item condition. Three cameras have had expensive problems... internal problems from impact, from sitting wet and corroding, and the third now is found to have a fastener come loose inside and break a shaft in the film transport. The seller of the corroded item was surprised at that discovery, as he'd bought it on eBay himself and only knew the meter wasn't working. So it's still a gamble, maybe a "game" in that respect.
Sniping can be a way to avoid "playing the game". First, a last-second bid does not give other bidders an opportunity to "play" by responding to your bid. Secondly it does not give YOU the opportunity to bid again, enforcing some discipline. Figure how much you'll pay, bid at the last second, and you know that's your one and final bid. If some other bidder's maximum was higher, so be it; your bid what was right for you.
Some recent eBay purchases have shown me that I'm having problems with item condition. Three cameras have had expensive problems... internal problems from impact, from sitting wet and corroding, and the third now is found to have a fastener come loose inside and break a shaft in the film transport.
The seller of the corroded item was surprised at that discovery, as he'd bought it on eBay himself and only knew the meter wasn't working. So it's still a gamble, maybe a "game" in that respect.
doubs43
Well-known
Doug said:Considering an eBay auction as a "game" is I think a losing idea, though fostered by eBay through their use of the word "Win" to describe what the eventual buyer has done... which is actually paying more for something than anyone else would pay!
<Snip>
Some recent eBay purchases have shown me that I'm having problems with item condition. Three cameras have had expensive problems... internal problems from impact, from sitting wet and corroding, and the third now is found to have a fastener come loose inside and break a shaft in the film transport.
Doug, you've made some good points. I only think of my bidding as a "game" in the sense that I'm competing and trying to defeat competitors. My "goal" is to acquire something I believe will be of benefit to me.
I, too, have had limited problems with condition of items. High quality pictures make it easier to identify defects while questioning the seller is necessary sometimes. I'm waiting for an answer to a couple of questions I've sent right now.
Last week I received a Yashica TL Electro-X that was inadequately described. It's dirtier than it should be and the lens has a pretty severe dent in the filter ring. The collar surrounding the lens that has a "window" and provides a reference mark for focusing distance and the f-stop rotates freely as well. The good news is that a new battery brought the meter and shutter to life and both work great. As soon as I replace the foam seals and clean the body's exterior I'll have a nice M42 mount camera. Securing the lens collar won't be difficult and except for screw-in filters, the lens should be fine.
I gave a positive feedback to the seller but anyone who reads it will see that it's less than a glowing endorsement. I did it to protect my own feedback rating.
Walker