Sid836
Well-known
I have gathered all ingredients to make some D76. It is not that I really need to use developer made by me, but I would like to try at least once all by myself.
Looking at the recipe it reads that the water in which metol, sodium sulfite and the borax should be mixed in (D76H), should be at 52 degC. How important that temperature is? Should I be dead accurate on this?
Thank you in advance.
Looking at the recipe it reads that the water in which metol, sodium sulfite and the borax should be mixed in (D76H), should be at 52 degC. How important that temperature is? Should I be dead accurate on this?
Thank you in advance.
Scrambler
Well-known
If you have a thermometer it's not hard - just mix warmer and cooler water to the required temp and tip off any excess. You get pretty close just averaging: 1/2 at 90 degrees and 1/2 at 15 degrees.
The temp is the same as required for Kodak D-76.
The temp is the same as required for Kodak D-76.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
Within a tenth of a degree :angel:
No!! It's a "cooking" temperature within 5 degrees, cooler better, more oxidation if hotter.
Dissolve a pinch of sulphite to the water BEFORE adding the metol, helps prevent oxidation of the metol. Metol can be a bit lumpy, a few stubborn bits, just crush them. Sulphite can be slow to go but a minute or two should do it.
No!! It's a "cooking" temperature within 5 degrees, cooler better, more oxidation if hotter.
Dissolve a pinch of sulphite to the water BEFORE adding the metol, helps prevent oxidation of the metol. Metol can be a bit lumpy, a few stubborn bits, just crush them. Sulphite can be slow to go but a minute or two should do it.
Sid836
Well-known
If it gets a lot cooler, say 40 degrees, will there be any serious trouble?
It goes like warm water + a bit of sulphite + metol + sulphite + borax + water till 1 lt. Am I correct?
It goes like warm water + a bit of sulphite + metol + sulphite + borax + water till 1 lt. Am I correct?
leicapixie
Well-known
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
A thermometer is required.
The tips given are all good.
I preferred Ilford ID-11 as it was always cleaner and purer.
It is the same developer.
Kodak always needed filtering...
Hopefully that has changed.
A great standard developer.
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
A thermometer is required.
The tips given are all good.
I preferred Ilford ID-11 as it was always cleaner and purer.
It is the same developer.
Kodak always needed filtering...
Hopefully that has changed.
A great standard developer.
Sid836
Well-known
About filtering, do you mean that there will be precipitate after mixing that will have to be removed?
leicapixie
Well-known
In my usage there was always dust, lint, hairs and gunk.
This is about Kodak D-76, not Ilford.
I used coffee filters if i had no chemical filters.
Let solution stand awhile, before filtering.
One tip i learn't from my Lady, to get a reasonable "ph" level.
let water stand in a jar a day or two..
Better than boiling or buying distilled water(which is better).
I prefer one time use.
So I now use HC-110.
D-76 is the standard.
This is about Kodak D-76, not Ilford.
I used coffee filters if i had no chemical filters.
Let solution stand awhile, before filtering.
One tip i learn't from my Lady, to get a reasonable "ph" level.
let water stand in a jar a day or two..
Better than boiling or buying distilled water(which is better).
I prefer one time use.
So I now use HC-110.
D-76 is the standard.
helvetica
Well-known
Tell me how this goes, I'm interested for similar reasons - just to say that you'd done it.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
I think Leiecapixie is referring to the ready mixed powder from Kodak and Ilford/Harmann NOT mixing from raw chemicals.
The Kodak "kit" has extra ingredients for storage (dry) stability, anti-caking, and water "softeners" so it is compatible with a range of domestic supplies.
You will get "stuff" if you mix or store in a "dirty" container. Dirty is relative, rinse out first, "stuff" falls in from the air.
In a perfect world use purified or de-ionised water for home brew, I have but not always and would not be able to tell you from results which was which.
Richard Henry in a classic book:
http://www.amazon.com/Controls-Black-And-White-Photography-Richard-Henry/dp/0240517881
Tested water deliberately contaminated and found a high tolerance within normal tap water limits. He also did other work debunking many myths around processing. Not all his work is perfect he was a little obsessed with roller processing which makes his results questionable in some areas to small tank agitation, edge effects etc.
Final tip, leave the fresh mix at least overnight before using it, D76 is notorious for being overactive when freshly prepared. Also don't keep it too long as again overtime the pH changes and the mixture changes to become more potent.
Don' worry, despite all these ifs and buts the vast majority have no issues with D76.
While you have the chemicals you have you may want to look at making D23 (simplest ever only two ingredients) I have used extensively particularly divided and with a few more simple ingredients TD-201 a D23 derivative from Anchell & Troop optimised for T-grain type film used as a two bath, see my Flickr link below & book link:
http://www.amazon.com/Film-Developi...08775327&sr=1-1-spell&keywords=anchell+trooop
Once you start mixing your own you will not look back.
J. Borger
Well-known
i can not relate to troublesome stories about mixing d76.
Easy as it gets and always great results. My favourite developer by far.
I use the small packages for 1L for convenience though.
I take 800ml hot water directly from the tap and fill it up with 200 ml cold water when the developer dissolved. I let it stand overnight before using it, also to get it.s temperature back to ca 20 C.
Easy as it gets and always great results. My favourite developer by far.
I use the small packages for 1L for convenience though.
I take 800ml hot water directly from the tap and fill it up with 200 ml cold water when the developer dissolved. I let it stand overnight before using it, also to get it.s temperature back to ca 20 C.
leicapixie
Well-known
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144177
Last edited:
Gareth Rees
Established
Fotohuis
Well-known
Avoid a temperature over 55C but under 35C it will be much more difficult to dissolve. If you have clean chemicals and destilled water you should not need any filtering. In this receipt there is no EDTA or Fotoplex or other additives which are needed when using tap water so it is necessary to use destilled water.
The procedure is further correct and simple.
In any commercial of self made developer you can filter with a coffee filter when for some reason dirt of perticipate is still in your stock solution after 12 hours when making it.
mdarnton
Well-known
I've mixed from chemicals for years. It's easy, and much cheaper. Buy a couple of bottles of raw chemicals, and you're not only set for life, but you never have to worry about running low. You can mix your own "dektol" too, with a couple of extra chemicals--potassium bromide, which is an anti-base-fog chemical not needed for film, and Arm & Hammer washing soda from the grocery store. It wasn't necessary to buy that borax you probably bought--washing maching borax is fine.
For years I used a cooking spoon set for quantities, a method outlined in one of the 70s photo magazines, but when digital scales became cheap and easy to get, switched. For measuring the smaller quantity chemicals, take a post-it note and fold the edges up to make a tiny tray.
Temperature is not critical for mixing, but the chemicals dissolve faster in warm water. I usually use water that I'd be comfortable taking a shower in, and dissolve the chemicals in about 1/3 the final amount (1/3L, for instance), then after everything's dissolved I add cold water to get to a temp that is appropriate for processing, if I need it immediately. That usually means adding all cold water, then, having still some space short of 1L and the temp still too high, I add a couple of ice cubes to cool it down the rest of the way.
You are supposed to start with the metol/elon, which will be the most difficult to dissolve, and harder if other chems are present. Traditionally, one threw in just a little of the sodium sulfite first ("a pinch", they say) to prevent the metol from oxidizing, but that's not totally necessary. Anyway, metol in, dissolve it as fully as possible, then throw in the rest and mix well. I use a big plastic serving spoon for stirring.
Some of the sulfite may not dissolve right away and sit on the bottom. Don't worry about it--it will eventually. I never filtered, and I always have used it right away, even with some undissolved sulfite, and never had any problems. D76 is one of the best, simplest, most foolproof developers there is. You can use it straight, 1:1 as a disposable, or replenished. For years I used it 1:1, but in recent years I'm developing 4x5 and 5x7 in big tanks, so I'm replenishing. The replenisher is easy to mix, too.
The metol will eventually start to turn brown in the bottle. Don't worry about it. I'm currently using a batch that's over 25 years old that looks tea-stained, and it works fine.
When you get tired of D76, you already have the chemicals now to make D23 and split D23, both of which are incredibly simple.
Be aware that home made D76 gets a bit "hotter" (more contrast and density) after a month or so, then calms back down. If you know this, you won't be surprised and can compensate when you see it. The pre-made stuff has buffers added to prevent this.
For years I used a cooking spoon set for quantities, a method outlined in one of the 70s photo magazines, but when digital scales became cheap and easy to get, switched. For measuring the smaller quantity chemicals, take a post-it note and fold the edges up to make a tiny tray.
Temperature is not critical for mixing, but the chemicals dissolve faster in warm water. I usually use water that I'd be comfortable taking a shower in, and dissolve the chemicals in about 1/3 the final amount (1/3L, for instance), then after everything's dissolved I add cold water to get to a temp that is appropriate for processing, if I need it immediately. That usually means adding all cold water, then, having still some space short of 1L and the temp still too high, I add a couple of ice cubes to cool it down the rest of the way.
You are supposed to start with the metol/elon, which will be the most difficult to dissolve, and harder if other chems are present. Traditionally, one threw in just a little of the sodium sulfite first ("a pinch", they say) to prevent the metol from oxidizing, but that's not totally necessary. Anyway, metol in, dissolve it as fully as possible, then throw in the rest and mix well. I use a big plastic serving spoon for stirring.
Some of the sulfite may not dissolve right away and sit on the bottom. Don't worry about it--it will eventually. I never filtered, and I always have used it right away, even with some undissolved sulfite, and never had any problems. D76 is one of the best, simplest, most foolproof developers there is. You can use it straight, 1:1 as a disposable, or replenished. For years I used it 1:1, but in recent years I'm developing 4x5 and 5x7 in big tanks, so I'm replenishing. The replenisher is easy to mix, too.
The metol will eventually start to turn brown in the bottle. Don't worry about it. I'm currently using a batch that's over 25 years old that looks tea-stained, and it works fine.
When you get tired of D76, you already have the chemicals now to make D23 and split D23, both of which are incredibly simple.
Be aware that home made D76 gets a bit "hotter" (more contrast and density) after a month or so, then calms back down. If you know this, you won't be surprised and can compensate when you see it. The pre-made stuff has buffers added to prevent this.
clcolucci58
Established
Thinking of doing the same, may I inquire as to where and how you got the chemicals needed?
Thanks,
CLC
Sid836
Well-known
Found metol through ebay. It is not cheap though. Paid 20 euros for 100grams.
The rest, Sodium Sulfite, Borax and Sodium Sulfite, I have bought them locally.
Borax has been the cheapest (2 euros for 2.5 kilos, what can I do with the rest of it
).
The rest, Sodium Sulfite, Borax and Sodium Sulfite, I have bought them locally.
Borax has been the cheapest (2 euros for 2.5 kilos, what can I do with the rest of it
).clcolucci58
Established
Found metol through ebay. It is not cheap though. Paid 20 euros for 100grams.
The rest, Sodium Sulfite, Borax and Sodium Sulfite, I have bought them locally.
Borax has been the cheapest (2 euros for 2.5 kilos, what can I do with the rest of it
Thanks,
CLC
Nokton48
Veteran
Found metol through ebay. It is not cheap though. Paid 20 euros for 100grams.
The rest, Sodium Sulfite, Borax and Sodium Sulfite, I have bought them locally.
Borax has been the cheapest (2 euros for 2.5 kilos, what can I do with the rest of it
Wash clothes in the extra Borax.
Again, add a pinch of the sodium sulphite first, or the Metol wil oxidize.
Other than that, filter if there is a precipitate (which I have gotten frequently).
I let mine stand overnight, then filter.
Mike-D
Member
We have well water here. I can see it oxidize certain solutions, so I always use the "distilled" water from the grocery store when making my stock solutions. Some plastic bottles aren't really dyed but coated and those will react with some chemicals like borax. With these precautions homebrew D-76 is great. Some say it is better than the pre-mixed formula. I always throw any left over stock after a month. I always got too high contrast when I didn't.
Ronald M
Veteran
I have tried with distilled and filtered Chicago tap water. Really large grain results with distilled. A friend has had the same experience.
Start at 125 deg F. The mixing reaction is exothermic and solution temp stays up by itself.
The amount of sulphite to start is what sticks between a thumb and finger, no more as excess will keep metal from dissolving.
After mixing, lay some food wrap over the vessel to stop oxidation as it cools. Allow to touch surface. After 2 to 4 hours, decant to small one time use bottles, glass if you can. It is perfect for 6 months if well sealed after which a slow deterioration starts. Do not use any for first 24 hours as it needs to age.
Never leave a partial bottle more than 4 to 8 hours. It become very active , then dies fast. Rates seem unpredictable. This is why I say cool, then one time use bottles.
Start at 125 deg F. The mixing reaction is exothermic and solution temp stays up by itself.
The amount of sulphite to start is what sticks between a thumb and finger, no more as excess will keep metal from dissolving.
After mixing, lay some food wrap over the vessel to stop oxidation as it cools. Allow to touch surface. After 2 to 4 hours, decant to small one time use bottles, glass if you can. It is perfect for 6 months if well sealed after which a slow deterioration starts. Do not use any for first 24 hours as it needs to age.
Never leave a partial bottle more than 4 to 8 hours. It become very active , then dies fast. Rates seem unpredictable. This is why I say cool, then one time use bottles.