Dealing with an unhappy ebay buyer

eric4 said:
The guy got back to me saying he will bill me for the cleaning of the lens as it has to go to the camera shop.

I replied reiterating that he may send it back for a full refund, but I will not be offering him a partial refund.
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You're doing things right. Just stay polite at all times with your communications, and make sure it is explicit that the buyer is welcome to return the lens for a full refund if he is not happy with its condition. Ask him to provide tracking details when it has been shipped. If he wants to be difficult and open a case, all you should need to do is to clarify that you have no problem at all accepting a return of the item for a refund, and that you have invited the buyer to do precisely that. eBay will instruct the buyer to return for a refund. If the buyer digs his heels in or has the item worked on (ostensibly) without their prior approval of a partial refund to cover "repairs" eBay should reject their claim.
Cheers,
Brett
Edit:
More here
http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/item-not-as-described.html
 
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Here is what Ebay has to say on this matter. This direct from their website under the FAQ. You will notice a clause about freight forward is in the NOT covered section.

What's covered

Most transactions on eBay.ca are covered by the eBay Money Back Guarantee.

Covered
Purchases are covered by the eBay Money Back Guarantee when all of the following are true:
An item isn't received or it isn't as described in the listing.
A buyer reports that they didn't receive an item or requests a return within the eBay Money Back Guarantee timelines.
The buyer made the purchase on eBay.ca via checkout or an eBay invoice with one of the following payment methods:
PayPal
PayPal Credit
ProPay
Skrill
Credit card or pre-authorized payment
The item was paid for in a single payment (including payments with PayPal Credit).
If the listing was a live auction by an auction house seller, the buyer made the purchase on eBay.ca and paid by any payment method, the purchase is covered as long as the buyer provides a copy of the seller invoice and proof of payment. Items sold through Sotheby's are excluded.

Not covered
Buyer's remorse or any reason other than not receiving an item or receiving an item that isn't as described in the listing (see the seller's return policy for return options).
Items damaged during pick-up or shipping or not delivered when the buyer arranges pick-up or shipping of the item (for instance, the buyer arranges freight).
Duplicate claims through other resolution methods.
Items shipped to another address after original delivery.
Vehicles (see eBay Vehicle Protection), Real Estate, Websites & Business for Sale, Classified Ads, services, and some Business Equipment categories (see eBay Business Equipment Purchase Protection).
Items sold through Sotheby's.
Items purchased on half.com, eBay Wholesale Deals, or eBay Classifieds.
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And yes describing the item as not clear of dust, small scratches or other defects based on the age of the lens and sold as-is DOES protect the seller. It's only if the item received is not as described so "accurately" describing a lens as "mint", "near mint", "look goods", is "free from defects, fungus, haze" is dangerous from a sellers standpoint as all of these descriptions can be disputed by a buyer. Clear communication up front that the lens does or may have defects and is sold as-is is much harder for a buyer to dispute.
 
In this sort of transaction I have found the eBay always protects one side more than any other.


Themselves.

I gave up on EvilBay and PainPal years ago.

I hope you have better luck than I did.

B2
 
codester80 said:
Here is what Ebay has to say on this matter. This direct from their website under the FAQ. You will notice a clause about freight forward is in the NOT covered section.


And yes describing the item as not clear of dust, small scratches or other defects based on the age of the lens and sold as-is DOES protect the seller. It's only if the item received is not as described so "accurately" describing a lens as "mint", "near mint", "look goods", is "free from defects, fungus, haze" is dangerous from a sellers standpoint as all of these descriptions can be disputed by a buyer. Clear communication up front that the lens does or may have defects and is sold as-is is much harder for a buyer to dispute.
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Interestingly, any reference to an item "sold as-is" is conspicuously absent from their list of exclusions...
 
Had a few instances where I was on the receiving end.

Asked for partial refund because the item was really not as described. And I use a forwarder too.

I sent the items for repair and sent a scan of the receipt for the seller's reference

In cases where return shipping cost exceed the cost to repair, i just suck it up and have it settled on my end.

Cheers!
 
Please read the not covered section carefully. The first clause states buyer remorse is not covered and only receiving an item NOT AS DESCRIBED is a valid reason for refund. Describing the lens as NOT free from potential defects such as internal dust, haze, fungus, scratches and comes as-is makes it difficult for a buyer to say the item received wasn't as described.

By the way, as-is is a legal term used in commercial transactions. From the legal dictionary:

As is
A term used to describe a sales transaction in which the seller offers goods in their present, existing condition to prospective buyers.
The term as is gives notice to buyers that they are taking a risk on the quality of the goods. The buyer is free to inspect the goods before purchase; but if any hidden defects are discovered after purchase, the buyer has no recourse against the seller. Any implied or express warranties that usually accompany goods for sale are excluded in an "as is" sale.
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The examination would be the photos provided during the auction and the ability to ask the seller questions to clarify any misunderstanding in the description. If you do not want to take the risk or feel uncertain as to the condition of the item offered, do not bid. I believe the simple term for this is buyer beware.
 
Regardless of the legal definitions eBay interprets which ever way they want. It all boils down to he said she said..who's right and who's wrong..

When I describe an item I do my best to describe it to the best of my ability then if someone wants to complain I ask them to return for a full refund..

If the OP sticks to his guns and says full refund upon return eBay honors that..

One of the reasons I quit offering to overseas buyers is this very thing..and every complaint that was filed against me when I would only accept full refund upon return I won..
 
colyn said:
Regardless of the legal definitions eBay interprets which ever way they want. It all boils down to he said she said..who's right and who's wrong..

When I describe an item I do my best to describe it to the best of my ability then if someone wants to complain I ask them to return for a full refund..

If the OP sticks to his guns and says full refund upon return eBay honors that..

One of the reasons I quit offering to overseas buyers is this very thing..and every complaint that was filed against me when I would only accept full refund upon return I won..
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Thanks for the encouragement everyone. I'll keep you updated on what happens with the buyer.
 
codester80 said:
Please read the not covered section carefully. The first clause states buyer remorse is not covered and only receiving an item NOT AS DESCRIBED is a valid reason for refund. Describing the lens as NOT free from potential defects such as internal dust, haze, fungus, scratches and comes as-is makes it difficult for a buyer to say the item received wasn't as described.

By the way, as-is is a legal term used in commercial transactions. From the legal dictionary:



The examination would be the photos provided during the auction and the ability to ask the seller questions to clarify any misunderstanding in the description. If you do not want to take the risk or feel uncertain as to the condition of the item offered, do not bid. I believe the simple term for this is buyer beware.
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Many sellers seem still to labour under the belief that the phrase "as-is" can yield some sort of "silver bullet" immunity to comeback for instances of goods being not as described. Clearly, this is not the case when transacting via eBay as both buyers and sellers agree to be bound by the terms and definitions in their user agreements and schedules, which are interpreted (outside a courtroom, at least) by eBay at their own discretion...
 
Did you use the Global Shipping Program? I really have trouble dealing with this Pitney Bowes scheme. Slow and unreliable with too much forwarding to minor couriers.
 
eric4 said:
The guy got back to me saying he will bill me for the cleaning of the lens as it has to go to the camera shop.

I replied reiterating that he may send it back for a full refund, but I will not be offering him a partial refund.
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Yup, cuz that 'cleaning bill' will cost far more than he paid for the lens.
He's trying to get a free lens and some money on top of that out of this.
 
Huss said:
Yup, cuz that 'cleaning bill' will cost far more than he paid for the lens.
He's trying to get a free lens and some money on top of that out of this.
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What if he draws up papers mimicking such of NASA optical lab? Leica owners will say now that's expensive.
I'm pretty sure ebay will not stand his side as there's no control what is done and if bill is even real.

goamules said:
I put something like this in all my ebay auctions now: "Remember, this antique camera was made in the 1950s, when cars had fins, man didn't yet fly in space, and I Love Lucy was a current TV show! It's 60 years old. ....."
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Enjoyed this very much )))
 
What is it with 24mm lenses?

I have over 600 feedback at 100% and pride myself on the accuracy of my descriptions.

I sold a Nikon AF-D 24mm in near perfect condition, listed it as "Excellent plus" as that is the condition KEH described it at the time I bought it from them a couple of years earlier. The buyer then demanded a refund because it had marks that were causing the pictures to have marks on them. When I explained that I'd sent a perfectly good lens, well within the condition of the description, he sent pictures that clearly showing he had crap on his digital sensor. Ebay intervened after I'd patiently explained that to him and, even though I explained again to them, sent them pictures and a description of what sensor dirt looks like, said that I owed him a full refund or work out some deal with the buyer. In the end I refunded him $60 just to end it.

More recently, I've sold a Canon FD 24mm that was in truly excellent condition - I know because it got a lot of use on my film cameras. Worked perfectly. Send it off and the buyer gets back to me and says that the mounting ring and aperture ring are stuck and won't move with his new adapter. I just refunded this one, knowing which way these things go with ebay and, sure enough, when I got it back it was terribly jammed up because presumably he tried to force it onto some cheap adapter. Cost me $88 to get fixed.

Ebay will not protect you as the seller at all, despite all the rubbish they print. As many have advised, just deal with it politely and try to cut your losses.
 
btgc said:
What if he draws up papers mimicking such of NASA optical lab? Leica owners will say now that's expensive.
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Doubtful. Service done at the NASA optical lab most probably would still be cheaper than sending it out to Leica...

;)
 
johnny scarecrow said:
Ebay will not protect you as the seller at all, despite all the rubbish they print. As many have advised, just deal with it politely and try to cut your losses.
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I would have to disagree with you on this. If you the seller offer a full refund eBay will side with you on this.
 
colyn said:
I would have to disagree with you on this. If you the seller offer a full refund eBay will side with you on this.
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They will side with you sure.
But they will not help you if the buyer returns a damaged item or even an empty box or pile of garbage.
As soon as the tracking shows the buyer returned the item, ebay/paypal will refund the buyer in a dispute.
I had a buyer return a camera which was not the one I shipped. It was a moldy old pos to make some weight in the box.
Not even the same model. He won the dispute since the tracking showed he returned it.
It became the buyers word against the sellers (me).
Ebay sided with the buyer.
Effin B astard that guy. Totally lied and won.
Ebay is not for the meek!
 
f16sunshine said:
They will side with you sure.
But they will not help you if the buyer returns a damaged item or even an empty box or pile of garbage.
As soon as the tracking shows the buyer returned the item, ebay/paypal will refund the buyer in a dispute.
I had a buyer return a camera which was not the one I shipped. It was a moldy old pos to make some weight in the box.
Not even the same model. He won the dispute since the tracking showed he returned it.
It became the buyers word against the sellers (me).
Ebay sided with the buyer.
Effin B astard that guy. Totally lied and won.
Ebay is not for the meek!
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I had a seller try this on me a couple of years ago. He sent an empty box. His downfall though was that he took the package to the PO instead of using eBay shipping. I took a photo of the shipping weight on the label with showed a shipping weight of 2oz when it should have been nearly 3lbs. eBay quickly sided with me once I threatened legal action if they make me refund..
 
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