In the last week, I've seen three new RFF members have problems with their Canonet QL17 GIII's, bought from the usual place. Off hand I would say all need a proper CLA, typically running $85.
This is what I posted in Stephen's poll on the best Fixed-Lens Rangefinder for a new RF users:
Most of these 35+ year old Ebay cameras are going to require some work. Again, most being more than 50%. I've gotten lucky, but more times than not- some work was required. The "pad of Death" and electronics of the Yashica GS, GT, GSN, GTN are a problem: expect about 1/2 off of Ebay to require work beyond just seals. All of mine (four) did. Expect the RF patch of the Lynx 14 and exposure meter to need work. Two of my three did. The Konica S2: exposure meter problems, two of my three had problems. As for the Canonets and cost: look for the Ql17L model rather than the GIII. Made in Japan, better quality control, lower price. I've picked up three going between $10 and $40. My Hi-Matic 9 has not given problems since 1980.
Best advice for a Newbie: stay away from buying old cameras on Ebay unless you know how to repair them yourself. Buy cameras from a forum SUCH AS this one or nelsonfoto where the seller has actually used and tested the camera, or at least states it is in unknown working condition. My "unknown condition" GIII was $10 at nelsonfoto, a flood cleaning brought it back to life. It would have been an "Ebay mint, I see know reason why this camera will not work" auction. As for prices of Canonets on this forum, they range from $40 to $80+ after replacing seals, cleaning the viewfinder, and testing with film. At least that is what I sold 8 or so of them for.
This is what I posted in Stephen's poll on the best Fixed-Lens Rangefinder for a new RF users:
Most of these 35+ year old Ebay cameras are going to require some work. Again, most being more than 50%. I've gotten lucky, but more times than not- some work was required. The "pad of Death" and electronics of the Yashica GS, GT, GSN, GTN are a problem: expect about 1/2 off of Ebay to require work beyond just seals. All of mine (four) did. Expect the RF patch of the Lynx 14 and exposure meter to need work. Two of my three did. The Konica S2: exposure meter problems, two of my three had problems. As for the Canonets and cost: look for the Ql17L model rather than the GIII. Made in Japan, better quality control, lower price. I've picked up three going between $10 and $40. My Hi-Matic 9 has not given problems since 1980.
Best advice for a Newbie: stay away from buying old cameras on Ebay unless you know how to repair them yourself. Buy cameras from a forum SUCH AS this one or nelsonfoto where the seller has actually used and tested the camera, or at least states it is in unknown working condition. My "unknown condition" GIII was $10 at nelsonfoto, a flood cleaning brought it back to life. It would have been an "Ebay mint, I see know reason why this camera will not work" auction. As for prices of Canonets on this forum, they range from $40 to $80+ after replacing seals, cleaning the viewfinder, and testing with film. At least that is what I sold 8 or so of them for.
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
That's been pretty much my experience, Brian. But I always factor in the price of a CLA when I buy old cameras. You occasionally get a winner, but not very often. I think a lot of people expect these old cameras to work like new after laying in a drawer for 20 years and are disappointed when they don't.
lightshot
Established
Only one of the old cameras I bought off of eBay requires repairs. I looked for photographers selling off their gear, and all but two of the cameras I purchased had been recently CLA'd. I tried to be a smart buyer, not a dumb one, which is why I've had such good luck with my purchases. I read this forum and others a lot, and do a lot of research before buying - including asking questions of RFF members.
The best of the bunch are the Yashica 635 and the Retina IIa which came with all of the accessories and with the instruction manuals.
I do buy from RFF members too though - my Summaron 50mm and my Leica M2 came from RFF classifieds.
The best of the bunch are the Yashica 635 and the Retina IIa which came with all of the accessories and with the instruction manuals.
I do buy from RFF members too though - my Summaron 50mm and my Leica M2 came from RFF classifieds.
gb hill
Veteran
I've had two ebay camera's that I needed to do minor repairs on. One a Oly-Pen EES2 that needed cleaning & the other a Fed2. The fed worked well out of the box but after about the second roll it developed a sticky curtain on the slower speeds. I fixed it myself & it works perfectly.
jmkelly
rangefinder user
Most of the old cameras I have bought off eBay have needed repairs. My favorite seller line: "I'm not a camera person and don't know anything about this." = paperweight, no matter how good it looks.
Contax II and IIa: both had non-functional slow speeds, about $100 each, both sent to Eddy Smolov and now working perfectly.
Nikon S2: worked perfectly out of the box.
Four Pen-FT's; two worked and two didn't.
Two Leica IIIf's: one worked perfecty, the other did not, but was less than free (bought it for the Orion Contax-LTM adapter the seller knew nothing about). I turned it into a lovely black project camera with the help of Youxin Ye, Don Goldberg and Robert Jagitsch.
Fuji GW690III: worked perfectly.
Konica III: needed shutter repair by Dean Williams.
Leica M6: worked perfectly out of the box.
Hexar RF: perfect.
Hexar AF: perfect.
Contax G1: perfect.
So my eBay success rate is 9/15 - who knows if this is average, or better/worse. On the other hand, every camera I have bought here at RFF has been EXACTLY as described.
Contax II and IIa: both had non-functional slow speeds, about $100 each, both sent to Eddy Smolov and now working perfectly.
Nikon S2: worked perfectly out of the box.
Four Pen-FT's; two worked and two didn't.
Two Leica IIIf's: one worked perfecty, the other did not, but was less than free (bought it for the Orion Contax-LTM adapter the seller knew nothing about). I turned it into a lovely black project camera with the help of Youxin Ye, Don Goldberg and Robert Jagitsch.
Fuji GW690III: worked perfectly.
Konica III: needed shutter repair by Dean Williams.
Leica M6: worked perfectly out of the box.
Hexar RF: perfect.
Hexar AF: perfect.
Contax G1: perfect.
So my eBay success rate is 9/15 - who knows if this is average, or better/worse. On the other hand, every camera I have bought here at RFF has been EXACTLY as described.
35mmdelux
Veni, vidi, vici
Leica M6 (x2) -perfect
Leica M4-P (x2) - perfect
Leica M7 - perfect
Mamiya 7 - perfect
Mamiya 6 - perfect
My RZ - perfect
Nikon F5 - perfect
Nikon F6 - perfect
Hassie 501 - needed work
Hexar RF - broken, needed repair
Leica M4-P (x2) - perfect
Leica M7 - perfect
Mamiya 7 - perfect
Mamiya 6 - perfect
My RZ - perfect
Nikon F5 - perfect
Nikon F6 - perfect
Hassie 501 - needed work
Hexar RF - broken, needed repair
Al Patterson
Ferroequinologist
I purchased 2 Canon QL17s from the auction site. One worked well, one is a paperweight until I install new light seals. But both of the CLs I bought didn't need any repair.
Mablo
Well-known
I recently purchased a Ricoh Diacord L from -57. I was mentally prepared that it would need some repair work. Old cameras usually do.
This time I was lucky. The camera works like new. Even the selenium meter is responsive and accurate.
Generally I'm avoiding eB** more and more.
This time I was lucky. The camera works like new. Even the selenium meter is responsive and accurate.
Generally I'm avoiding eB** more and more.
cweg
Well-known
My Yashica GSN, CC, Olympus 35SP worked perfectly.
My Konica S2 had, like described, a jammed Shutter
My Leica M3 needed a CLA.....puh, but I knew the risk.
My Konica S2 had, like described, a jammed Shutter
My Leica M3 needed a CLA.....puh, but I knew the risk.
narsuitus
Well-known
Six of the six rangefinders that I bought on eBay were accurately described by the seller.
Two Minolta Hi-Matic 9 rangefinders worked out of the box.
Two Canon QL 17 rangefinders worked after I replaced the light seals.
Two Fuji medium format rangefinders worked out of the box.
Two Minolta Hi-Matic 9 rangefinders worked out of the box.
Two Canon QL 17 rangefinders worked after I replaced the light seals.
Two Fuji medium format rangefinders worked out of the box.
jl-lb.ms
John A. Lever
Epson R-D1; perfect
Leica M-8; perfect
CV Bessa R; perfect
Zeiss Ikon Contessa; perfect
Had one old reflex that I can't recall that didn't work.
My luck has been very good for ebay purchases!
Leica M-8; perfect
CV Bessa R; perfect
Zeiss Ikon Contessa; perfect
Had one old reflex that I can't recall that didn't work.
My luck has been very good for ebay purchases!
K
Kin Lau
Guest
98% yes, and I've probably bought about a 100. I rarely buy a camera described as "mint".
robinsonphotography
Established
Only bought one off the 'bay, a 1959 M2, it was described as having been CLAd just a few years prior and being in perfect working condition--it was....so far as I can tell, it works perfectly.
nikon_sam
Shooter of Film...
I can't complain about the gear I've bought from ebay...
Nikon F2 (black body) still working, good meter no problems...
Nikon F4 (parts camera) I had the missing pieces for this one, just had to buy a finder and went with a WLF (NIB). So far it's been good...
Nikon F5 PERFECT...Like New...no problems...well, loose rubber grip by the Aperture Control knob
2 Nikon FM's both working fine...
3 Olympus 35-S Rangefinders...I knew the shutters had problems (oily blades) but I also know how to fix this...They are all working fine...
Mamiya m645 1000s...This has worked just fine...BUT the only problem with this one is when shooting @ 1/1000 sec. The mirror is not releasing quick enough at this speed and will create an underexposed band across the top of the neg...it's not the shutter because if I lock the mirror up all is fine...I have gotten a few quotes for a CLA and I will be sending this one in soon...
Nikon F2 (black body) still working, good meter no problems...
Nikon F4 (parts camera) I had the missing pieces for this one, just had to buy a finder and went with a WLF (NIB). So far it's been good...
Nikon F5 PERFECT...Like New...no problems...well, loose rubber grip by the Aperture Control knob
2 Nikon FM's both working fine...
3 Olympus 35-S Rangefinders...I knew the shutters had problems (oily blades) but I also know how to fix this...They are all working fine...
Mamiya m645 1000s...This has worked just fine...BUT the only problem with this one is when shooting @ 1/1000 sec. The mirror is not releasing quick enough at this speed and will create an underexposed band across the top of the neg...it's not the shutter because if I lock the mirror up all is fine...I have gotten a few quotes for a CLA and I will be sending this one in soon...
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rbsinto
Well-known
I've never bought any photographic item on ebay that didn't function perfectly "right out of the box" other than a lot of three non-working parts cameras which were described as such.
My first Nikon F was a chrome beater for $75.00 which eventually needed service six or seven years after I bought it about ten years ago.
A chrome beater Nikon S3 rangefinder that was a 7.5 cosmetic / 9.5 mechanical was purchased for $565.00 three years ago, and has been used continuously ever since without any problems or service.
A Nikon N65 body sold as refurbished by Nikon and which cost $78.00 was bought about five years ago, and has worked continuously and perfectly since I bought it.
My first Nikon F was a chrome beater for $75.00 which eventually needed service six or seven years after I bought it about ten years ago.
A chrome beater Nikon S3 rangefinder that was a 7.5 cosmetic / 9.5 mechanical was purchased for $565.00 three years ago, and has been used continuously ever since without any problems or service.
A Nikon N65 body sold as refurbished by Nikon and which cost $78.00 was bought about five years ago, and has worked continuously and perfectly since I bought it.
colyn
ישו משיח
I've only had a couple arrive in need of repair which except for one I fixed myself. The M3 went to DAG for curtain replacement and is still working fine today..
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I bought a IIIC from a supposedly reputable seller in the US that had a front screw missing from the body and thus a light leak ... turned out the thread was stripped then someone had tried to drill the hole out and made a real mess of it!
An M3 advertised as functioning as per normal had no rangefinder contrast at all and required a complete new assembly.
A IIIf bought from another seller promptly destroyed a shutter curtain first time I fired the shutter.
I can think of at least half a dozen more cameras I have bought from eBay that have required CLA's or more before working correctly that were advetised as functioning normally!
It's not just eBay though ... I have bought at least one dud here!
An M3 advertised as functioning as per normal had no rangefinder contrast at all and required a complete new assembly.
A IIIf bought from another seller promptly destroyed a shutter curtain first time I fired the shutter.
I can think of at least half a dozen more cameras I have bought from eBay that have required CLA's or more before working correctly that were advetised as functioning normally!
It's not just eBay though ... I have bought at least one dud here!
Penzes
Well-known
All my Yashica Electro's purchased through where fine. I'm selecting my business partner carefully.
I also bought a M3 (no ebay transaction) , which needed some TLC at Solms. The shutter curtain was OK, but the exposure times not. :bang:
I also bought a M3 (no ebay transaction) , which needed some TLC at Solms. The shutter curtain was OK, but the exposure times not. :bang:
oscroft
Veteran
With a few minor exceptions, I've had very good results buying cameras via the famous auction site. (Though I'm not a technical perfectionist by a long way - if a lens focuses a centimeter out a distance of 1 meter fully open, I really don't care - I use them for photographing the real world out there, at everyday distances and everyday apertures, and I'm happy if I get good results with those kinds of shots)
Anyway, I've bought a number of FSU cameras, and all worked very well except for a few minor problems...
A couple had slightly sluggish slow speeds, but that didn't really bother me, because I really don't go around shooting at 1/5 second (or at least, whenever I do, I use more appropriate cameras). A Zorki 4K I got actually stuck on slow speeds, but it was cheap, and I didn't bother repairing it. And a FED 3B had a pinhole in a shutter blind, which I patched with black acrylic paint. But most - including various FED 1s, 2s and 3s, and a Zorki 3M - worked just fine (going by real world results rather than lab tests).
A Canon QL RF (can't remember which one) arrived completely non-functional, but the seller refunded and told me to keep the corpse - I gave it away for spares.
An Olympus OM2SP arrived with mechanical damage to the prism - it had been knocked out of alignment. The seller apologised and refunded my money.
Two Ricoh 500Gs I bought needed new seals, as they all seem to, but worked perfectly after I'd replaced them with Interslice materials.
Other than that, I've bought a Leica M2, an Olympus OM1n, five OM2ns (three for me, and two for friends), an OM4T, Olympus XA, Pentax MX and ME Super, a Leica CL (which was sold as needing a CLA, which I had done and ended up with a very good bargain), a Vivitar 35ES, and various others, details of which I can't remember.
And they were all either in good working order or (as with the CL), or in the condition as described.
Best,
Anyway, I've bought a number of FSU cameras, and all worked very well except for a few minor problems...
A couple had slightly sluggish slow speeds, but that didn't really bother me, because I really don't go around shooting at 1/5 second (or at least, whenever I do, I use more appropriate cameras). A Zorki 4K I got actually stuck on slow speeds, but it was cheap, and I didn't bother repairing it. And a FED 3B had a pinhole in a shutter blind, which I patched with black acrylic paint. But most - including various FED 1s, 2s and 3s, and a Zorki 3M - worked just fine (going by real world results rather than lab tests).
A Canon QL RF (can't remember which one) arrived completely non-functional, but the seller refunded and told me to keep the corpse - I gave it away for spares.
An Olympus OM2SP arrived with mechanical damage to the prism - it had been knocked out of alignment. The seller apologised and refunded my money.
Two Ricoh 500Gs I bought needed new seals, as they all seem to, but worked perfectly after I'd replaced them with Interslice materials.
Other than that, I've bought a Leica M2, an Olympus OM1n, five OM2ns (three for me, and two for friends), an OM4T, Olympus XA, Pentax MX and ME Super, a Leica CL (which was sold as needing a CLA, which I had done and ended up with a very good bargain), a Vivitar 35ES, and various others, details of which I can't remember.
And they were all either in good working order or (as with the CL), or in the condition as described.
Best,
johannielscom
Snorting silver salts
I bought a beater condition M2 off *Bay, was described as having a strange fogging issue, and recenlty had a CLA.
Turned out the seller had performed the 'CLA' himself, using plain oil for lubricating the slow speed mechanism.
I managed to rinse most of the oil out using lighter fluid and cleaned the insides up. Slow speeds still were sticky.
In general, I bought off a national internet site and sold on *Bay. I have always tried to describe my cameras as accurate as possible, only once did I sell a Konica IIIa that arrived in a jammed state, although it was working fine when it went. I paid for the repair. I sold close to a hundred cameras.
The M2 was the only problem I ever encountered.
Turned out the seller had performed the 'CLA' himself, using plain oil for lubricating the slow speed mechanism.
I managed to rinse most of the oil out using lighter fluid and cleaned the insides up. Slow speeds still were sticky.
In general, I bought off a national internet site and sold on *Bay. I have always tried to describe my cameras as accurate as possible, only once did I sell a Konica IIIa that arrived in a jammed state, although it was working fine when it went. I paid for the repair. I sold close to a hundred cameras.
The M2 was the only problem I ever encountered.