Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
Yes, I mentioned Deans creations in my original posting. Very nice indeed.
I've mulled over different options, from building everything from scratch, to chopping two Mamiya 6x7 of 6x9 backs (I like the Longfellow, but I know I could not bring myself to chop up two venerable folders). However, I think I'm going to settle on building a 4x5 rear frame/standard, add a 4x5 slide on adapter to allow any form of 4x5 international backs, be they 4x5, 6x7, 6x9 or 6x12. To the standard I,ll add a cone/lens adapter without movement (which might be added later). I won't be getting a 1:2.8 panoramic ratio, but the flexibility! Now to start shopping.
I've mulled over different options, from building everything from scratch, to chopping two Mamiya 6x7 of 6x9 backs (I like the Longfellow, but I know I could not bring myself to chop up two venerable folders). However, I think I'm going to settle on building a 4x5 rear frame/standard, add a 4x5 slide on adapter to allow any form of 4x5 international backs, be they 4x5, 6x7, 6x9 or 6x12. To the standard I,ll add a cone/lens adapter without movement (which might be added later). I won't be getting a 1:2.8 panoramic ratio, but the flexibility! Now to start shopping.
pagpow
Well-known
Sounds like a plan, Ezzie.
If you go that way, you might want to be aware of a couple of other possibilities to piggy-back on that plan.
1) The Shutterbug article on the Longfellow also featured a 6x17 back for a 4x5. It works on a graphic, say,because it moves the film plane back -- works w/o vignetting w. a 90mm -- which I think is what you were playing with.
2) Appreciate your thoughts about not massacring two folders, but you can find non-usable folders -- this would mean you are putting photo equipment back in service, not disfiguring working photo equipment.
3) Possible to consider one of the 6x17 Chines backs as an alternative.
If you go that way, you might want to be aware of a couple of other possibilities to piggy-back on that plan.
1) The Shutterbug article on the Longfellow also featured a 6x17 back for a 4x5. It works on a graphic, say,because it moves the film plane back -- works w/o vignetting w. a 90mm -- which I think is what you were playing with.
2) Appreciate your thoughts about not massacring two folders, but you can find non-usable folders -- this would mean you are putting photo equipment back in service, not disfiguring working photo equipment.
3) Possible to consider one of the 6x17 Chines backs as an alternative.
kuzano
Veteran
Mamiya PRESS 6X12 back, original.. not hacked????
Mamiya PRESS 6X12 back, original.. not hacked????
It appears that Mamiya may have actually sold a 6X12 back. I just found this back in a listing for a special camera on eBay. The back looks as if it may be factory made. The camera is a special from some other source and uses LF lens.
This looks like a fantastic hand held 12cm panoramic camera. This back looks like it forms the base for the camera, which is natural because of the S curve of the K style Press backs. These backs were touted for their film flatness due to the pin rollers at each end of the opening and the reverse curve they put in the film.
This particular back looks like it may have been made during the very early lever backs, since the covering material is the grey material which was used on the very early backs, prior to the black simulated covering on the later lever advance backs.
What a find... opens up a new search for me.
Mamiya PRESS 6X12 back, original.. not hacked????
It appears that Mamiya may have actually sold a 6X12 back. I just found this back in a listing for a special camera on eBay. The back looks as if it may be factory made. The camera is a special from some other source and uses LF lens.
This looks like a fantastic hand held 12cm panoramic camera. This back looks like it forms the base for the camera, which is natural because of the S curve of the K style Press backs. These backs were touted for their film flatness due to the pin rollers at each end of the opening and the reverse curve they put in the film.
This particular back looks like it may have been made during the very early lever backs, since the covering material is the grey material which was used on the very early backs, prior to the black simulated covering on the later lever advance backs.
What a find... opens up a new search for me.
Last edited:
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
That one: http://cgi.ebay.de/DAYI-612-6X12-CA...ViewItemQQptZFilm_Cameras?hash=item4cecd0bffd?
Well, I might believe in custom spec Mamiya backs, as they certainly supplied a modified back for the second Brooks Veriwide, which was more like 6x9.5 than the regular 6x9. But a early type (silver with screw-on plate, as far as I know already de-listed in the seventies, long before the first modern time 6x12 cameras were made) in 6x12 is unlikely. And that a Chinese maker of a 6x12 hack camera got hold of ten (or more) used previously entirely invisible backs is even more unlikely. I guess they purchased a couple of used early Mamiya backs and hacked them to 6x12.
Last edited:
kuzano
Veteran
I would tend to agree with you.... but
I would tend to agree with you.... but
Looking very closely at those pictures, it was one hell of a "hack". I'd love to hole one of those in my hands and see where the cut and refit took place. There should be two cuts and weld points.
Some people with go to great lengths however. After WWII, the military destroyed thousands of M1 Garand rifles by cutting them into two pieces through the middle of the receivers. Some of these cut rifles found their way back into the collector market as the receivers were welded back together and reground/replated.
I know an inveterate military arms collector who got his hands on a couple. It turned out the only way to discover the weld was to put the rifle in the freezer for some time and then take it out into normal room temperature. The condensation on the receiver would reveal the weld line.
I would tend to agree with you.... but
Looking very closely at those pictures, it was one hell of a "hack". I'd love to hole one of those in my hands and see where the cut and refit took place. There should be two cuts and weld points.
Some people with go to great lengths however. After WWII, the military destroyed thousands of M1 Garand rifles by cutting them into two pieces through the middle of the receivers. Some of these cut rifles found their way back into the collector market as the receivers were welded back together and reground/replated.
I know an inveterate military arms collector who got his hands on a couple. It turned out the only way to discover the weld was to put the rifle in the freezer for some time and then take it out into normal room temperature. The condensation on the receiver would reveal the weld line.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
I've seen that 6x12 Mamiya backed DAYI camera too, I think two were listed originally. Most other custom 6x12 cameras with the Mamiya press back state clearly that the back has been hacked. The DAYI camera however looks very well done. Even the model plate states its a 6x12, Had I hacked a 6x9, the last thing on my mind would be to fake 6x12 plate, but who knows?
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
The model plate is odd, and gives the hack away, as it was phased out in the original long before non-rotational panoramics became popular.
Debusti Paolo
Well-known
how much does it costs?can be used handheld???
oftheherd
Veteran
Mr. Hicks, that is just a neat looking conversion. Also looks like something a competent machinist could help with. Thanks for showing this.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
They're expensive and out of production, but yes, they can be used hand held. That was exactly why Sir Kenneth designed them: for fast use, phtographing churches and the like from the middle of the road. Try to contact Gandolfi to see if they can make one up if you don't mind the price: they had a spare body or two, last time I asked (a long time ago).
Cheers,
R.
Debusti Paolo
Well-known
I've seen a number of "homemade" 6X9 cameras mainly using a super angulon (47mm/5,6 or 8) and mamiya backs..As I would like to try a schneider super angulon 47mm 5,6 (or 8 if too expensive...) i?m asking if anyone knows if where I could buy a relative cheap camera in 6x9 or 6x12 that can be used handheld and not too much big or bulky!!!!!!!!THANKS GUYS
fotoman617
Newbie
Fotoman Camera China (fotomancamera@yahoo.com.cn) can make relatively inexpensive lens cones, HFM's, and perhaps other parts.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
Their (Fotoman) homepage is still up, but they seem to be closing shop. Some of their distributors still have some items left, but are being cleared out. Pity, I liked the look of their stuff more than the other chinese stuff by the likes of Gaoersi, Shen Hao, Kang Tai and DAYI. Though they didn´t seem to sell their backs separately - I´d have one if they did. I not afraid, in fact I rather look forward to doing some manufacturing, how much depends on the budget. I´d like to keep it under $600 - but a ready 6x17 back might entice me to break that.
Building a 4x5 P&S type back which can be adapted to anything from 6x9 and 4x5 to 6x17 would be nice. However difficult without a bellows, as the 6x17 backs would need to sit back from the 4x5 plane, and I´d have to adjust the lens plane backwards accordingly. The other option would be to chop two 6x9 press backs, or folders and join these. Less flexibility, but more compact and sleek. The Longfellow is a piece of genius in that respect, the lens cone being integral to the structure of the whole camera, joining the two pieced back as it does. Decisions, decisions.
Anyone got two identical and faulty 6x9 folders lying around by the way? As I mentioned earlier, chopping up a working Bessa or Ikon would break my heart (very nearly).
Building a 4x5 P&S type back which can be adapted to anything from 6x9 and 4x5 to 6x17 would be nice. However difficult without a bellows, as the 6x17 backs would need to sit back from the 4x5 plane, and I´d have to adjust the lens plane backwards accordingly. The other option would be to chop two 6x9 press backs, or folders and join these. Less flexibility, but more compact and sleek. The Longfellow is a piece of genius in that respect, the lens cone being integral to the structure of the whole camera, joining the two pieced back as it does. Decisions, decisions.
Anyone got two identical and faulty 6x9 folders lying around by the way? As I mentioned earlier, chopping up a working Bessa or Ikon would break my heart (very nearly).
Last edited:
Debusti Paolo
Well-known
yesterday i'VE SEEN ON EBAY.COM a technorama 612pcII with super angulon 58/5,6 xl with a BIN of 1800 usd! I wrote to the seller that haven't answered and the listing is no nmore active.What do you think about the price????
KenR
Well-known
As Ezzie doesn't want to chop up 2 venerable folders, how about chopping up 2 Holgas and pasting them together. Plenty of sheet styrene availble to strenghten it. Put a good lens on it and a lot of duct tape and it might even work fairly well.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
Another camera has been relisted today for much less, didin´t sell last time around. Not sure why, including lens, its not a bad deal: Fotoman?
I´m guessing its a Fotoman, but I´m not sure - as the the seller doesn´t say.
And Ken, fusing two Holga 120´s together has crossed my mind. At least it won´t cost much, and may serve as a prototype. I´d mount them to a camera body of my own making. It might even work.
Wrt ready made backs. Even the Chinese 617 backs aren´t cheap, I´d rather not spend that much on back to begin with. And most are meant to be mounted to a original 4x5 back, meaning they move the film plane backwards, which I don´t need nor want - since I can manufacture the body myself. The Shen Hao 617 back however can be had with adapter for a 5x7 back, and therefore has the standard film plane. The adapter plate can be removed and Bob´s your Uncle. Still $550 + shipping + local VAT (for me) though.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
And since I´m new to MF/LF photography, and maybe more importantly Panoramic photography - I´m having second thoughts as to 6x17 as a format, vs 6x12 or other not quite so extreme panoramic formats. The technique involved more specifically. Filling a frame 1:3 wide with content takes some doing. How often will one find a motif with enough interest to merit the use of a 6x17? Stupid me thinks its easier to start of with a format closer to 1:2. Thoughts?
P.S. Lots of "nice" panoramic pics on the net, but quite honestly, not many actually make that good use of the benefits of the 1:3 ratio. I.e. not many panoramas are quite as good as the ones that got me hooked on the format in the first place.
P.S. Lots of "nice" panoramic pics on the net, but quite honestly, not many actually make that good use of the benefits of the 1:3 ratio. I.e. not many panoramas are quite as good as the ones that got me hooked on the format in the first place.
kuzano
Veteran
Well, the answer to this is in the viewing.....
Well, the answer to this is in the viewing.....
I would concur with you on this, BUT.....
Then I saw a well composed 6X17 image printed up to about 7 or 8 feet, matted and framed by the most professional shop we have in our area.
WOW!!!
Try to get a look at a large, high quality panoramic print in the 1:3, or even 1:4 aspect ratio.
In fact, where I would concur the most with your post is in creating and posting images only for viewing on the web.
Panoramic images starting at a 1:2 ratio and going up from there, almost demand printing to hang in appropriate spaces that need filling with art.
Well, the answer to this is in the viewing.....
I would concur with you on this, BUT.....
Then I saw a well composed 6X17 image printed up to about 7 or 8 feet, matted and framed by the most professional shop we have in our area.
WOW!!!
Try to get a look at a large, high quality panoramic print in the 1:3, or even 1:4 aspect ratio.
In fact, where I would concur the most with your post is in creating and posting images only for viewing on the web.
Panoramic images starting at a 1:2 ratio and going up from there, almost demand printing to hang in appropriate spaces that need filling with art.
Last edited:
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
I know, that´s what got me hooked. You only need that one gobsmacking image.. at least I did.
I´m going to post process in the digital domain, I could always stitch. Scanning 6x12 is also easier. I know, I know - its not the same. There is a feeling of accomplishment when things are right straight from the camera. More to mull on..... Heart says 6x17, head and wallet says 6x12.
I´m going to post process in the digital domain, I could always stitch. Scanning 6x12 is also easier. I know, I know - its not the same. There is a feeling of accomplishment when things are right straight from the camera. More to mull on..... Heart says 6x17, head and wallet says 6x12.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
I've taken the plunge
I've taken the plunge
and started ordering parts to build a camera along these lines: http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2006/12/darth_handy_homemade_came.html
I've taken the plunge
and started ordering parts to build a camera along these lines: http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2006/12/darth_handy_homemade_came.html