wontonny
Well-known
I just ordered some ilford fibre based paper to print on and try out. Are there any major differences visually between the two? Most importantly, what are the differences in processing and treating of the FB paper? I'll be using Dektol, water for stop, kodak fixer, and final water wash. With RC, I squeegee the final print and use a blow dryer to dry it. Can this be done with FB?
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aparat
Established
Most of what you need to know is in Ilford's guide to printing, which you can download from their website.
drewbarb
picnic like it's 1999
Fiber paper has several advantages to RC paper, but it does take a little more work to get the most out of it. The look and feel of a well processed fiber print just can't be matched by RC, and the fiber print will last much longer. The range of finishes and the textures of the many fiber papers out there generally make RC papers look sort of cheap in comparison.
As for differences in processing, as I said, fiber paper takes a little more work. First, it typically needs more time in the developer and fixing baths, not to mention the wash. Secondly, it tends to curl, and needs pressing to flatten prints once dry. RC paper generally needs 60-90 seconds in the developer, and about the same in the fix. Fiber paper, on the other hand, should get two to three minutes in the developer for complete development, and it needs four to six minutes in the fixer to clear completely. Many printers will fix fiber papers in two fix baths, splitting the time between them. The second fix bath will be cleaner, and this helps ensure proper fixing. Finally, fiber paper will need more time in the wash (typically three times as long as RC needs to wash)- especially if you aren't using a permawash. Fiber paper generally takes toning more readily than RC, too, so if you are toning, watch for faster and more radical color shift than you get with RC papers.
More information is available on the web and in print, and I recommend you do some research- but good fiber prints are really wonderful, and the extra effort is well worth the results. Have fun, and let us know how it goes!
As for differences in processing, as I said, fiber paper takes a little more work. First, it typically needs more time in the developer and fixing baths, not to mention the wash. Secondly, it tends to curl, and needs pressing to flatten prints once dry. RC paper generally needs 60-90 seconds in the developer, and about the same in the fix. Fiber paper, on the other hand, should get two to three minutes in the developer for complete development, and it needs four to six minutes in the fixer to clear completely. Many printers will fix fiber papers in two fix baths, splitting the time between them. The second fix bath will be cleaner, and this helps ensure proper fixing. Finally, fiber paper will need more time in the wash (typically three times as long as RC needs to wash)- especially if you aren't using a permawash. Fiber paper generally takes toning more readily than RC, too, so if you are toning, watch for faster and more radical color shift than you get with RC papers.
More information is available on the web and in print, and I recommend you do some research- but good fiber prints are really wonderful, and the extra effort is well worth the results. Have fun, and let us know how it goes!
sepiareverb
genius and moron
Double your development time, test to find your fixing time and use some hypo-clear before your final wash. Drying with a blow dryer will put you in the poorhouse- window screens or hanging the prints back to back on a string with clothespins at all four corners is simpler.
Chuck Albertson
Well-known
I generally develop RC paper for 60 seconds, FB papers for 2 minutes. An acid stop bath may mean it takes longer for your fixer to become exhausted. If you use film-strength rapid fixer instead of powder fixer, you can fix in 1 minute and also shorten your wash time. A wash aid like Perma Wash (there are others that do the job just as well) will also shorten your wash time for FB, not really necessary for RC which wash pretty quickly.
Al Kaplan
Veteran
I suspect that a lot of the reason that RC papers aren't considered permanent is because nobody actually knew. Kodak, Ilford, etc. were probably just hedging their bets. Before RC hit the market the various companies came out with "rapid access" papers and a processor that ran the paper through a series of rollers barely dampening the paper surface. The emulsion already had developing agents in it and the first chemical in the machine was an "activator" to get the developer working while the second was a "stabilizer" which neutralized the activator. It was called "stabilization processing".
Places like newspapers were thrilled and the prints held up for a few months just fine. You could run them through fixer and a decent wash afterwards and they'd be as good as "real" prints. The first RC papers were designed for stabilization processing so the newspaper editor wouldn't get damp prints thrown on his desk. Since the resin coated paper didn't soak up the activator it was possible to run a lot of prints through it. Again, they COULD be processed the old fashioned way, or the stabilized print could be fixed and washed later.
Now, thirty years later, a lot of us are discovering that our old contact sheets and work prints and such on RC paper held up very well, with no fading, discoloration, or staining. It's just that nobody knew that back in 1978.
Places like newspapers were thrilled and the prints held up for a few months just fine. You could run them through fixer and a decent wash afterwards and they'd be as good as "real" prints. The first RC papers were designed for stabilization processing so the newspaper editor wouldn't get damp prints thrown on his desk. Since the resin coated paper didn't soak up the activator it was possible to run a lot of prints through it. Again, they COULD be processed the old fashioned way, or the stabilized print could be fixed and washed later.
Now, thirty years later, a lot of us are discovering that our old contact sheets and work prints and such on RC paper held up very well, with no fading, discoloration, or staining. It's just that nobody knew that back in 1978.
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T
Todd.Hanz
Guest
I am probably the only one here that likes the look of RC prints, but thats just me.
Ilford FB tends to curl more than any other paper I have used, so be prepared. I like the look for some prints. A lot of guys use Ilford cool tone developer with Ilford warm tone paper, myself included...I just like the look. There seems to be more tonal range with FB papers, subtle shadow details show up better. Most FB papers don't have the gloss or plastic look/ feel that RC papers have, at least the ones I have tried.
Good luck,
Todd
Ilford FB tends to curl more than any other paper I have used, so be prepared. I like the look for some prints. A lot of guys use Ilford cool tone developer with Ilford warm tone paper, myself included...I just like the look. There seems to be more tonal range with FB papers, subtle shadow details show up better. Most FB papers don't have the gloss or plastic look/ feel that RC papers have, at least the ones I have tried.
Good luck,
Todd
sepiareverb
genius and moron
At my first studio job we ran fiber stabilization papers every now and again, though I can't remember what for as there was a 1620 RC paper processor in the darkroom. I don't have any of those stabilization prints, but I do have RC prints from that machine that look fine 25 years later- and that without any washing beyond what the machine did.