Fickle Camera

[Derek_Teixeira]

Hey Guys:

Years ago, when moving into a previous home i lived in, we found a camera bag in the basement. In the bag was a Minolta X-370, with a 50mm lens, and a nice zoom lens. Anyway, I shot a roll (it was my first roll I had ever done), and went to get it developed only to be told when picking it up that, "It's a blank roll, man". I was shocked, upset, and disappointed. I decided that was why they had left it there and hadn't used it for years. I remember it being Kodak B&W Tri-X 400 (this will be important later)

Then, recently I thought about it and now having a better knowledge of things (the camera doesn't have an auto exposure option, so I was shooting manually back then without much clue, but understood enough to have gotten at least one of the 36 exposures!) But now, understanding such things I decided to give it a try, and bought T-MAX BW Non-c41 film. I shot the roll, not expecting it to work. Went to develop it and i was shocked to get back prints! And I was pleased with them. Here are some of the shots incase you care.

Being siked about this, and wanting to shoot a C41 film (so I could develop them closer to home and more cheaply), i bought a roll of Kodak Tri-X BW again, and spend a day in the city shooting. Really excited, I went to get them developed, but when I went to pick up the film, I was once again given a roll of blank negatives and was told "Man, the roll was blank"

What is going on? I don't think it being C-41 or not should matter, does it? Why is being fickle? Anything I can check? Thanks guys.

 

[David William White]

Needs clarification: Tri-X is not C-41 film, and no shop would process it as C-41.

Other than that, "blank" negatives (did they show you the film???) means no exposure, like the shutter didn't open. You should check the operation of the shutter first thing, by opening the back and firing it and making sure it opens.

 

[payasam]

Presumably the people who processed the film did not know that Tri X is not for C-41. The T Max showed pictures, so the camera should be all right.

 

[Derek_Teixeira]

When I had brought Walgreens the T-Max, they said they couldn't develop it because it was not C-41. So i brought it to B&H in the city. When I brought them the Tri-X they said no problem, but gave me back a blank roll ..

 

[pakeha]

what payasam says i`d go with also, fickle camera? on one 36 roll no prints and another all good, chances are that if it is a fickle camera you would have got a least one print on the bum roll-yes, or the film did not spool correctly and the `dude-man' who processed just went through his daily motions. I would give another roll of c41 - can you get 12 exposures at your place? i use em for testing, good luck

 

[rxmd]

When I give rolls to a lab for developing, it sometimes happens to me that I get confused and give them a blank roll instead, and the full roll remains at home. Admittedly unlikely in your case because it happened twice, but it happens to all of us (or so I hope).

Then again I do B&W at home so I'm reasonably certain it's not the lab's fault.

Try to find a better lab that knows what the difference between B&W and C41 is. If there's no better lab in your place, buy Ilford XP2 "chromogenic" (i.e. C41) black and white film, you can drop this off in any corner minilab. I started using that in Uzbekistan when it was difficult to get hold of chemicals, and now I've grown to like it.

 

[Roger Hicks]

If the shutter is opening, there should be an image: over- or-under-exposed in some cases, maybe, but still an image.

Is the camera bettery dependent? Perhaps the mirror is going up and down without the shutter opening.

Have you watched to see that the rewind knob is going around as you wind on, i.e. are you sure you are loading correctly, with the film attached to the take-up spool?

Suggestion: sacrifice a roll of outdated anything (your camera store may give you one), 'shooting' with the lens off to see if the shutter is firing -- try a range of shutter speeds.

Otherwise, yes, well, it is quite an old camera, and not top-of-the-line even when it was new, and old cameras (especially electronic old cameras) do die.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Jamie123]

Do you see edge markings on the developed roll? If not, it's a processing error.

 

[ZorkiKat]

Hey Guys:

the camera doesn't have an auto exposure option, so I was shooting manually b.

AFAIK this Minolta has an auto exposure option. Aperture priority AE mode in fact.

Chances are, your Tri-X was souped in C41.

Traditional BW films like Tri X form the image as metallic silver. So when the developed silver image passes through the bleach and fix steps of C41, everything gets eaten away and blank roll emerges on the other end of the processor.

C41 types, both colour and monochrome, develop a secondary dye image as well, which don't get removed in the bleach and fix steps.

I've seen this happen a lot, when new film shooters bring their trad BW films to ordinary colour labs which still process C41 film. A BW film which passed through C41 will be totally blank. No edge numbers. No developed black strip at the start.

 

[Merkin]

My vote is for mis-loading. What procedure did you use, in detail, to load the film, from the time you opened the camera to the time you fired the first shot?

 

[ZeissFan]

This camera is battery-dependent. The shutter won't release unless there are batteries in the camera.

It's manual advance and manual rewind. The shutter is electronically (and electrically) controlled.

The original poster should do two things:

1) Make sure there are fresh batteries in the camera. Use the S76 or LR44 -- two of them.

2) With no film in the camera, open the camera back, hold it up to a window and dry fire the camera through all of the shutter speeds. Do this twice -- once with the lens attached and again with the lens off the camera. You should see light in both cases, although it will get progressively dimmer with the higher speeds.

Test the camera in this manner and then let us know what happens.

 

[ZeissFan]

One thing that I just noticed while testing this camera (X-370) in the manner that I suggested above:

If the batteries don't make good contact, the meter will sometimes operate and shutter will release, but the mirror won't raise.

Thoroughly clean out the battery chamber with a cloth (old T-shirt will do fine). Make sure the battery surfaces are clean. And make sure that the battery chamber cover is tightly screwed in -- not insanely tight but tight.

 

[wgerrard]

You should eliminate lab error as a possibility, although that is very slim, and the business about Tri-X being run through a C-41 machine. Grab a roll of cheap drugstore C-41, shoot it, take it to Walgreen's and ask for processing only. My local Walgreen's charges $2 a roll for that. If the negs are blank, and you are sure the problem is not operator error, then you have a fickle camera, indeed.

 

[Dwig]

...
Being siked about this, and wanting to shoot a C41 film (so I could develop them closer to home and more cheaply), i bought a roll of Kodak Tri-X BW... I was once again given a roll of blank negatives and was told "Man, the roll was blank"...

First, as others have said, Tri-X is not a C-41 film.

The big question is "how blank was the roll". Anytime you get a "blank" roll the first thing to do is look for the frame numbers and film identification marking along the edges. These are "printed" with light and show up only after proper developement. If they are missing, the roll was not processed correctly, period.

Before you take another test roll, open the back and fire the camera will looking throught the shutter at the lens (be sure the lens cap is off). You should see a flash of light. If so, the shutter is functioning, at least at a rudimentary level. Next set a slow shutter speed manually and see if you get the appropriate delay between the first click and mirror lift and the second click (second curtain closing) and mirror return. With some cameras, you need to close the back, wind to frame 1 or further, take off the lens and look through the front, looking for the shiny pressure plate.

If the camera seems to be functioning to a reasonable degree try the test roll. Be very careful to load correctly and keep an eye on the rewind knob while winding. If you "rewind" gently (without pressing the button) after loading to take up any slack, it should turn a little while you wind confirming its loaded correctly.

Odds are, the lab misprocessed the film in C-41 chemistry which will leave a totally blank roll without any frame numbers or identification.