ped
Small brown dog
A mate has asked me to photograph his wedding and I have said I would prefer him to book a professional DSLR toting photographer but I'll try taking some shots on B+W film with my 28mm lens and develop them by hand. he likes the idea and I think it will lend a certain aura to the photographs.
I have said for him not to get his hopes up in case I totally screw it up, but how much should I charge him for this? he says he will want to pay me, and I have learned to never do jobs like this TOTALLY free, but at the same time I don;t want to cost him too much. What would you suggest, adding perhaps 4 rolls of film into the budget (£15 ish)
Cheers
ped
I have said for him not to get his hopes up in case I totally screw it up, but how much should I charge him for this? he says he will want to pay me, and I have learned to never do jobs like this TOTALLY free, but at the same time I don;t want to cost him too much. What would you suggest, adding perhaps 4 rolls of film into the budget (£15 ish)
Cheers
ped
Moriturii
Well-known
Let him pay for the rolls of films and chemicals?
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Do it as a wedding present. Either it's a commercial job, at commercial rates, or it isn't.
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
bmasonoh
Established
Offer it as your gift to the couple. If they turn out well, get one or two printed and framed for them. They'll love it and it will be meaningful to them.
Once money enters the equation, then the relationship changes. You become a paid photog and the expectations change.
Once money enters the equation, then the relationship changes. You become a paid photog and the expectations change.
hexiplex
Well-known
I agree, if you don't want the pressure of delivering quality (which I am sure you will) don't take any money - give your time, your film and your prints as a wedding gift to the couple, I am sure they will be absolutely thrilled with it. Much more so than anything off of a wedding gift registry.
---f
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I've been in the same position, and I've said that I'd rather be a guest who's taking some decent pictures. Less pressure on everyone's part and no chance of putting the friendship at risk if you screw up. Also - if you get a few good pics, make prints, everyone's happy.
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
Whilst I completely understand Dan's irritation with the scenarios he relates I have to say it's not your day, buddy. It's the bride's and you just have to fit in. Frankly, I wouldn't hire a wedding photographer with such a hardline position that required everyone else to leave their cameras at home.
dcsang
Canadian & Not A Dentist
Meh.. do it as a gift 
that's how I'd handle it.
Film at weddings nowadays, from a "pro" perspective is almost unheard of. Riccis does it and a few others still do. I'm doing it this year but not all my weddings will be on film.
That said, with respect to Dan's comments - ya.. I've had to deal with all the aunts, uncles, etc. etc. etc. having cameras that are just as good if not better than what I was carrying. I just shrug my shoulders and go with the flow. No point in getting the wedding guests (or the bride/groom) upset or anxious - I just work around those folks or work them into / out of the frame. It's going to happen, especially with how "inexpensive" DSLRs have become (not to mention iPods, cell phones, blackberries, P&S cams etc. etc. etc. )
Cheers,
Dave
that's how I'd handle it.Film at weddings nowadays, from a "pro" perspective is almost unheard of. Riccis does it and a few others still do. I'm doing it this year but not all my weddings will be on film.
That said, with respect to Dan's comments - ya.. I've had to deal with all the aunts, uncles, etc. etc. etc. having cameras that are just as good if not better than what I was carrying. I just shrug my shoulders and go with the flow. No point in getting the wedding guests (or the bride/groom) upset or anxious - I just work around those folks or work them into / out of the frame. It's going to happen, especially with how "inexpensive" DSLRs have become (not to mention iPods, cell phones, blackberries, P&S cams etc. etc. etc. )
Cheers,
Dave
---f
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I make sure to stay out of the way of the pro-photographer, in fact, I take the documentary approach of capturing the scenes the pro-photog is NOT taking. I know those pro shots will be better than mine, and I'd rather see the "behind the scenes" anyways. At a recent wedding, a couple of my images were some of the best, not because of better quality or such - in fact I had developing errors, but because I was able to capture little expressions between the bride and family members. These weren't staged images, they were the "decisive moment" type of images. I'll have to get them up onto flickr to show later. **arista premium 400 developed in rodinal, and shot on my M6 and CV 35mm f/1.4 MC.
I will point out that the wedding photographer did an AMAZING job, and was worth every penny. I captured scenes that were important to me, and fortunately the bride loved them too.
Edit: Here's a couple of those images
and here's the rest of the images on flickr
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fireboycreative/sets/72157625876646595/with/5427506200/
I will point out that the wedding photographer did an AMAZING job, and was worth every penny. I captured scenes that were important to me, and fortunately the bride loved them too.
Edit: Here's a couple of those images
and here's the rest of the images on flickr
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fireboycreative/sets/72157625876646595/with/5427506200/
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calebk
Established
Like others have said, once money comes into the picture, more is expected of you, no matter how significant or insignificant the sum is. Just do it ass a gift if you are not confident of delivering, and like Dan has said, don't get in the way of the official photog.
We're all photographers so let's help each other out and not be a pain.
We're all photographers so let's help each other out and not be a pain.
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
If you choose to do this, just make sure you know who the pro is, probably tell him that you were "commissioned" and that you want to be out of his way.
I did something like this for my brother's wedding. The pro was so nice he even offered me to use his portable studio lights for bride-and-groom shots. I declined, saying I wasn't that good... and, of course, I was never in his way.
I did something like this for my brother's wedding. The pro was so nice he even offered me to use his portable studio lights for bride-and-groom shots. I declined, saying I wasn't that good... and, of course, I was never in his way.
sig
Well-known
At least do not worry about the 'pro', in this case he/she only got the job because the first choice (you) did not want to do it. If he/she starts complaining let them know.
You are not competing in or ruining the wedding photographer industry so you can charge whatever you feel like, giving it as a gift is a very good idea.
You are not competing in or ruining the wedding photographer industry so you can charge whatever you feel like, giving it as a gift is a very good idea.
---f
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- added those photos to my post above.
ped
Small brown dog
Fireboy, I like the idea of a 'documentary' approach. After reading everyone's advice perhaps that style would work well.
The more I think about it, the less I want to get involved in weddings at all. I can't think of a worse way to spend a whole day than at someone else's wedding (I don't know this guy that well) and there are so many pitfalls it all sounds rather daunting.
At the same time it's something I have to try, surely? What's the worst that could happen? (OK no answers needed there please)
ped
The more I think about it, the less I want to get involved in weddings at all. I can't think of a worse way to spend a whole day than at someone else's wedding (I don't know this guy that well) and there are so many pitfalls it all sounds rather daunting.
At the same time it's something I have to try, surely? What's the worst that could happen? (OK no answers needed there please)
ped
delft
Established
If he insists on paying you something, I think the going rate is 1 bottle of wine...
Greetings,
Dirk
Greetings,
Dirk
dave lackey
Veteran
Ped,
Either you like weddings, put up with them or hate them. I tend to put up with them when I have to attend but deep down I hate them. I have only done 3 weddings as a photographer but with each one, I dislike them progressively more.
No doubt that you can make good money with them. Especially if you have something classy and unique to offer. I am amazed at the sophisticated work of really good photographers but spending the money and working hard to get that good is just not what I want to do these days.
Have you considered being a second shooter with the film approach offering a documentary style? Just be sure your images are different than any old P&S or DSLR images. Other than that, jump in the water's fine. How else will you know if you like it or not?
Either you like weddings, put up with them or hate them. I tend to put up with them when I have to attend but deep down I hate them. I have only done 3 weddings as a photographer but with each one, I dislike them progressively more.
No doubt that you can make good money with them. Especially if you have something classy and unique to offer. I am amazed at the sophisticated work of really good photographers but spending the money and working hard to get that good is just not what I want to do these days.
Have you considered being a second shooter with the film approach offering a documentary style? Just be sure your images are different than any old P&S or DSLR images. Other than that, jump in the water's fine. How else will you know if you like it or not?
Roger Hicks
Veteran
If you don't know him that well, don't do it. Yes, it IS daunting, and I do it only when I can't get out of it. But I also take a camera along to weddings and take a few 'happy-snaps' when the paid guy isn't in my way (I stay out of his way for the same reason). If you do decide to do it, the following may prove useful: http://www.rogerandfrances.com/subscription/ps weddings.html. Here's the opening paragraph:
This is not a guide to shooting weddings commercially. We have never done this, and we never want to. Rather, it's about shooting weddings for friends. This may either be because they're too young and broke to afford anything else (which accounted for the first two that Roger shot), or because they're very old friends and really, really want you to shoot their weddings: you would offend them more by refusing than you would by doing it on your terms.
Cheers,
R.
NathanJD
Well-known
Hi Ped,
I have dabbled in both (and I often provide my 2c during these kinds of threads) but to touch on a few pointers; it's going to make a big difference to you. it's going to feel a lot more like a job if you're taking the place of a pro photog and you're likely to place preasures on yourself that may not go hand in hand with having an enjoyable day. the best experience (and resultant photos) that I have had was when I played the role of a casual photographer (while there was a pro photog there) - I was still able to enjoy myself and wasn't constantly concerned with getting every single shot the happy couple expected of the day - that was someone else's remit.
Also the 'what good can you do with such a funny old camera' effect works very well at weddings, and people tend to act naturally as they don't expect that the result will be something they could spoil if they don't pose just so.
I have dabbled in both (and I often provide my 2c during these kinds of threads) but to touch on a few pointers; it's going to make a big difference to you. it's going to feel a lot more like a job if you're taking the place of a pro photog and you're likely to place preasures on yourself that may not go hand in hand with having an enjoyable day. the best experience (and resultant photos) that I have had was when I played the role of a casual photographer (while there was a pro photog there) - I was still able to enjoy myself and wasn't constantly concerned with getting every single shot the happy couple expected of the day - that was someone else's remit.
Also the 'what good can you do with such a funny old camera' effect works very well at weddings, and people tend to act naturally as they don't expect that the result will be something they could spoil if they don't pose just so.
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dave lackey
Veteran
Dan,
I fully agree with the problem of other people getting in the way of the paid professional at weddings. THAT is just another reason that I don't like to do weddings and admire those who are good at, not only photography, but the people skills. What do you do?
Now, the OT is about film at weddings. Do you think that there is a possibility of the paid professional using a second shooter to shoot a film documentary and offer it as part of the wedding package?
I fully agree with the problem of other people getting in the way of the paid professional at weddings. THAT is just another reason that I don't like to do weddings and admire those who are good at, not only photography, but the people skills. What do you do?
Now, the OT is about film at weddings. Do you think that there is a possibility of the paid professional using a second shooter to shoot a film documentary and offer it as part of the wedding package?