Film vs Digital, any figures....

[JonR]

We all know digital is taking over totally for all normal ways of taking photos - both professionally and for the consumer market. In fact the biggest camera seller in the world today must be Nokia and looking at my kids the take more photos than ever but they use their phones more and more...

Anyway - my question is about the remaining film market for special photo sessions and enthusiasts like us here at RFF. Have anyone seen any figures on the global film volume - is it going up or down or has it stabilsed at a certain volume !?? Can anyone share any facts on this ??

Jon

 

[sig]

http://www.kodak.com/eknec/PageQuer...eLocale=true&pq-locale=en_US&_requestid=43094

Film, Photofinishing and Entertainment Group second-quarter sales were $466 million, a 21% decline from the year-ago quarter, driven by continuing industry-related declines. Second-quarter earnings from operations for the segment were $29 million, compared with earnings of $51 million in the year-ago period. This decrease in earnings was primarily driven by industry-related declines in volumes and increased raw material costs, partially offset by cost reductions across the segment.

 

[JonR]

OK - so Kodak is going down but in a market undergoing as dramatic changes like the film market various players may make different strategic choices on how to act.... Maybe other players are doing better.... would be interesting to see a more total picture...

Jon

 

[sig]

http://www.fujifilmholdings.com/en/investors/ir_library/annual_reports/
From the annual report page 19.

P Results for Fiscal Year Ended March 31, 2010
Consolidated revenue declined 15.8% year on year to ¥345.5 billion due to decreased demand for color films and other products and the negative impact of the yen’s appreciation. The digital camera business has improved its operating income significantly and consequently returned to profitability on an operational basis for the period under review. This turnaround has enabled the segment to reduce its operating loss before restructuring and other charges from the previous fiscal year to ¥15.1 billion. Also, the segment posted an operating loss after restructuring and other charges totaling ¥69.2 billion, mainly attributable to the recording of ¥54.1 billion in restructuring and other charges.

 

[oftheherd]

It seems indisputable that digital is becoming more popular at the expense of film. Poloroid hurt other types of film as well. But film hasn't gone away yet, and isn't likely to do so quickly.

Even given the above, Kodak probably isn't the best model to choose from. They have been dumping their film market for a long time. I don't think it always made sense what they did. They just seem to not want to be a film company.

 

[wgerrard]

I

Even given the above, Kodak probably isn't the best model to choose from. They have been dumping their film market for a long time. I don't think it always made sense what they did. They just seem to not want to be a film company.

They want to make money. They'd sell Kodak-branded bubble gum if that turned a profit. Or, drop all film lines if they thought that would boost their bottom line. That's what corporations do.

Kodak, more than any other company, has, I think, been hit the hardest by digital. They were the dominant company when everyone had no choice but to use film. Then, digital arrived and Kodak pretty much missed the boat.

It would be interesting, though, to know if sales of Kodak's "professional" films have fallen at the same rate as sales of their consumer films.

 

[Carterofmars]

Lets start making our own film. 🙂

 

[Nikkor AIS]

We don't "all" know that digital is taking over. I'm shooting more film now than ever, despite having several fine digital cameras. My last 6 camera purchases have been film: an M3, M6, M7, MP Widelux, Speed Graphic😀. I hate to burst the bubble on the statistics but they don't tell you the whole story. I'm about to buy another fridge just to stock up on film.

"Film will outlive us all."

 

[Steve M.]

I don't think the film market has changed much in the last 5 years or so. It's a horrible economy in most countries, so sales of most things have been off. Not a good time to do any market estimating because everything is so skewed. The same people that shoot digital are probably still shooting it, and the same people that shot film are still shooting that. I suspect that many film users prefer B&W, and there has been no change in digital's ability to compete w/ film in that area.

I still use my digital for home snaps and classified ads. It's the best tool for that. For more serious work I use B&W film in a film camera because that's the best tool. Even Leica's M9 isn't going to make many people sell their rangefinder film cameras, as it's more for color work. Globally, film is a rather smallish niche market, and has been for quite some time now.

 

[Fujitsu]

Can anyone share any facts on this ??

The annual reports of both Kodak and Fuji show a decline in film sales. This decline has been constant for the last ten years.

I wonder when numbers will consolidate but so far they dont.

Also read here
http://www.japanexposures.com/2010/07/27/interview-with-shiyo-takahashi-leica-ginza-shop/

"(...) the demand for film cameras is comparatively low. (...) Film will get rarer and more expensive, almost like a luxury product."

And that from Leica Ginza, which is bastion of film photography.

 

[Finder]

A large consumer of film is the movie industry (I bet they get more keepers per roll than photographers do). With more theaters moving over to digital projection and production moving to digital, you are going to see less film sales.

 

[Chris101]

Thanks sig,

I took a closer look at Fuji's revenues, because Fuji's numbers are the most available in a broken down manner. Particularly, I considered color and black and film sales, photo paper (non-electronic) and chemical sales, and photofinishing equipment sales over the period of March 2007 to March 2010, in three yearly periods. I then normalized the Yen against the dollar, as a good deal of the declining revenue of Fuji in general was due to changing value of the Yen (2008: 1¥=0.008USD, 2009: 1¥=0.011USD, 2010: 1¥=0.012USD).

Revenue from these three sectors dropped from 2.2 billion dollars in 2008 to 1.9 billion in 2009, a 13.6% decrease. However they dropped from 1.9 billion in 2009 to 1.7 billion in 2010, a decrease of only 10.5%. Projections (albeit from Fuji) are for a 2% increase across the board in 2011, so we can expect the decline in film to be even less next year.

I do not have any figures from Kodak or Ilford (or any other Asian or European manufacturers), however I would tend to believe the trend is the same across the industry.

These numbers lead me to believe that the decline in film sales is slowing and that we will see a true plateau within five years.