first M mount film body

tortellini_man

tortellini_man

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hi,

i have been enjoying using my canon 7 with LTM lenses for a while now (even with a few minor issues), and i was looking to upgrade to a more repairable M mount film camera and keep compatibility with my LTM lenses (via adapter) while also being able to use more commonly available M mount lenses. i primarily shoot in natural light outdoors with either a 35mm or 50mm lens, and i would probably never using anything longer than an 85mm. i dont really care about any kind of auto modes or TTL metering.

it seems like they all of the bodies are pretty expensive for me, but i was wondering what people would recommend amongst the following (or others):
  • leica M2 (i probably would want 35mm framelines, so this instead of M3)
  • minolta CLE
  • zeiss ikon ZM
  • one of the bessa R series
thanks in advance
 
tortellini_man said:
hi,

i have been enjoying using my canon 7 with LTM lenses for a while now (even with a few minor issues), and i was looking to upgrade to a more repairable M mount film camera and keep compatibility with my LTM lenses (via adapter) while also being able to use more commonly available M mount lenses. i primarily shoot in natural light outdoors with either a 35mm or 50mm lens, and i would probably never using anything longer than an 85mm. i dont really care about any kind of auto modes or TTL metering.

it seems like they all of the bodies are pretty expensive for me, but i was wondering what people would recommend amongst the following (or others):
  • leica M2 (i probably would want 35mm framelines, so this instead of M3)
  • minolta CLE
  • zeiss ikon ZM
  • one of the bessa R series
thanks in advance
Click to expand...
If ttl metering does not matter, just buy the newest, most recently CLA’d by a reliable provider and in a provable way (ask for the CLA receipt) Leica M you can afford. Film Leica Ms are repairable, but they are mechanical, a bit touchy and fail in subtle ways as they age. If you look in the repair forum you’ll see light leaks, shutter capping and other issues and a lot of “I sent it to 3 repair guys and none of them could fix it” type posts. The above is the best way to start with a good working camera.
 
I love the CLE but you'd get 28mm and 40mm framelines...not 35 or 50.

Given your preferences I'd go with M2, or M4, M4-2, M4-P. Find one that needs work and send it to the best tech, or find one from a reliable seller that has already had service.
 
Bill Blackwell said:
Leica M2 - hands down the best camera on your list.
Just make sure to get one with a recent CLA.
Click to expand...
Completely agree. For 35mm lens use, the M2 is unequalled. Absolute nirvana.

If you are seeking comparable options, the following is very good advice

splitimageview said:
I love the CLE but you'd get 28mm and 40mm framelines...not 35 or 50.

Given your preferences I'd go with M2, or M4, M4-2, M4-P. Find one that needs work and send it to the best tech, or find one from a reliable seller that has already had service.
Click to expand...
 
You can find good unmetered M bodies in the $1500-$2000 range, and good M6 bodies in the $2800-$3300 range if you look around. Although more expensive than the other choices on your list, I feel they're better quality cameras and service/repair options for Leica Ms is much better than for the other cameras you list, and that includes the M5. (I personally wouldn't buy one of them, as they're pretty much a one-off and only a couple of specialists will service them.)

The M6TTL 0.85x I just acquired I bought from Tamarkin.com. It arrived today and is in much better shape than his photos indicated ... nearly perfect. Tamarkin has been a joy to work with and is a reliable, consistent dealer who takes care of his customers with a 14 day no-issue return policy and a 6 month warranty on used M bodies.

I have no financial interest in Tamarkin, just saying as I've been doing business with them for over 25 years; they always do the right things for me.

G
 
Nothing beats the M2 for emotion and value. I would, however, think about life expectancy at some point. From that perspective, the M6 makes sense. M5: not to be repaired.
 
The M4P can be a good value as alternative to the M2; but you said you shoot with 35mm and 50mm lenses, and nothing longer than 85mm. Assuming that the 90mm is close enough to 85 for you, then the M2, with its 35/50/90 frameline set is made to order for you; while you will find the M4P cluttered with 28, 75, and 135mm frames you won't use. So I will join with the others: you need an M2.
 
ZM
CL, don't bother with the internal meter, get a Sekonic 308 and be happy. Did some of my best film work with one.
 
I’d take an M4 over an M2 as I prefer the former take up spool and rewind crank, just for practicality.
Whatever you choose, by all means get it from a reputable seller with a documented CLA and a return policy. I went literally mad for 2 years with an M4 bought from abroad, non returnable, which I later discovered was affected by a small light leak from the shutter baffles. This was not solved by 3 different techs (one of them very well known), ended up selling it at a loss and getting an M6 (better shutter light traps). Happy ever since, touching wood…
 
Because of the age and the problems with loading and manually setting the count (and not bumping it) the M2 is absolutely last on my list. And I owned (and hated one). Best I've had was an M4-2, but the advice to pick something younger rather than older is solid gold. Currently I've got 2 M4s and they're OK, too. Really the only one you don't want is an M3.
 
The Voigtlander Bessa series have been creeping up in price since they were made, but if you do get one, make it the R2 or higher, as those are the ones that are made of tough magnesium alloy. With M-mount, metering, and in some cases aperture priority, they're basically the poorer person's M6/M7. I have the R2 and love it as much as my Leicas.

The Bessa-L, -R, and -T are plastic; and the R2S and R2C are Nikon and Contax rangefinder mount, respectively.
The Voigtlander rangefinder lenses are still being made and are some of the best and most economical quality lenses made for Leica screwmount and M mount. Highly recommended.
 
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If longterm repairability/reliability is of value to you, don't get a Zeiss Ikon or any modern Voigtlander. I love my Zeiss Ikon (I've had it since 2006)...and Zeiss Oberkochen will still work on them, but that window can't be too far away from closing. When the Voigtlander cameras were in production, their used prices were super reasonable and they were a great value proposition.

M2's and M4's are great.

M6's have meters, but their IC chips are beyond their service life and once they go you just have an expensive, more poorly built M4 with the risk of corrosion.

M5's are the thinking person's camera. I would buy two more right now, if I could. They have the best meter of any film M by a wide margin, best ergonomics (if using the camera is your goal) and they look gorgeous.

So yeah, can't go wrong with M2/M4/M5.
 
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