Elmar Lang
Well-known
Hello,
recently, thanks to the kindness of a German dealer, I've acquired a Flektoskop set with the Sonnar 180mm. f:2,8 that, after the serial number, can be dated to the year 1948.
From what I've learnt from H.J. Kuc's books and the bullettin of the Zeiss Historica Society, this is a 2nd type Flektoskop made in the soviet occupied Germany (SBZ): its prism system, allows to see the image not upside-down like in the 1st type, prewar and in the 1st type postwar Flektoskope, but with inversed sides.
While the lens is in extremely fine condition, the mirror has the silver very faded and the reverse, matt black paint dried and with fissures.
One thing is strange: the 180mm. cannot be removed from the reflex housing, like it easily happens with the older type.
Does anyone knows how to accomplish this operation? this would allow the restoration of the mirror.
Any information or input would be most welcome.
All the best,
Enzo (E.L.)
recently, thanks to the kindness of a German dealer, I've acquired a Flektoskop set with the Sonnar 180mm. f:2,8 that, after the serial number, can be dated to the year 1948.
From what I've learnt from H.J. Kuc's books and the bullettin of the Zeiss Historica Society, this is a 2nd type Flektoskop made in the soviet occupied Germany (SBZ): its prism system, allows to see the image not upside-down like in the 1st type, prewar and in the 1st type postwar Flektoskope, but with inversed sides.
While the lens is in extremely fine condition, the mirror has the silver very faded and the reverse, matt black paint dried and with fissures.
One thing is strange: the 180mm. cannot be removed from the reflex housing, like it easily happens with the older type.
Does anyone knows how to accomplish this operation? this would allow the restoration of the mirror.
Any information or input would be most welcome.
All the best,
Enzo (E.L.)
Attachments
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Crazy Fedya
Well-known
I have never seen or handled Flektoskop before, but it looks like the lens is mounted on the ring, which seems to detach using silver sliding button on top. Try to slide that button andunscrew the ring. Most likely to the right, if you are looking at the lens.
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Hello,
the silver sliding button on the plate bearing the Zeiss Jena logo and the serial number, unlocks the ring with stops to rotate the system, in order to take pictures either horizontally, or vertically.
Thank you anyways,
Enzo
the silver sliding button on the plate bearing the Zeiss Jena logo and the serial number, unlocks the ring with stops to rotate the system, in order to take pictures either horizontally, or vertically.
Thank you anyways,
Enzo
Dwig
Well-known
I've never handled one, but from the pix my guess would be that tear down begins from the rear, with removal of the VF section being the first step. Basically, you don't remove the lens from the reflex section, but instead you remove the reflex section from the lens one piece at a time.
Bill Jones
Contax Lens User
Enzo,
Congratulations on a nice lens setup. The lens should unscrew from the flektoskop. The rotating mounting collar (ring) is the part of the flektoskop that the lens screws into and should remain attached to the flektoskop. As you know old screw joints that have not been opened in a long time are difficult to open and need a very penetrating oil and lots torque to open.
Best of luck with your restoration.
Bill
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Hello,
thank you for the kind words and info.
Looking at the base of the lens, I could see three tiny screws on that section of the lens barrel where the red sign and the depth-of-field scale is engraved: could they be retaining the lens to the Flektoskop's body?
The next week I will take further detail pictures and will be glad to share them here.
All the best,
Enzo
thank you for the kind words and info.
Looking at the base of the lens, I could see three tiny screws on that section of the lens barrel where the red sign and the depth-of-field scale is engraved: could they be retaining the lens to the Flektoskop's body?
The next week I will take further detail pictures and will be glad to share them here.
All the best,
Enzo
msarkki
Member
I have a Flektoskop but with chrome collar. At least in that version the lens unscrews just by turning it counterclockwise when looking lens from the front. There are no screws to be loosened, just a thread mount. My mirror is as well shot, how are you planning to fix yours? I could try the same....
Best,
Mika
Best,
Mika
View Range
Well-known
Flektoskops, and Flektometers, do not have retaining screws. The lenses simply unscrew in the normal counterclockwise direction. The Flektoskop used a very fine pitch given the thread diameter. The Flektometer has a course thread and is much easier to use. After all these years your lens is simply stuck. Get a rubber banded strap wrench from the plumbing section of your hardware store. Turn the lens to the closest focusing position to give yourself some working space on the lens barrel. Put the strap wrench as close a possible to the Flektoskop body. Take care to not use the Flektoskop finder for leverage; that finder is only held on with small screws. The lens will come off. Because the thread pitch is so fine, be careful remounting the lens because it is very easy to cross-thread the lens.
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Thank you very much for the contributions and advise.
This morning I've bought a rubber-fitted wrench at a local plumbing store and the lens, after some effort, unscrewed off the Flektoskop mount. Actually there was some hardened grease in the mount-thread. I've removed it and cleaned the whole. Now, the lens can be mounted and removed with great ease.
The mirror, is held in place with steel clips retained by screws, to the hinged frame. It wont be difficult to change it, I guess.
It would be interesting, once the Flektoskop would be restored, trying to use it and enjoy the 180/2,8 "T" CZJ Sonnar.
This morning I've bought a rubber-fitted wrench at a local plumbing store and the lens, after some effort, unscrewed off the Flektoskop mount. Actually there was some hardened grease in the mount-thread. I've removed it and cleaned the whole. Now, the lens can be mounted and removed with great ease.
The mirror, is held in place with steel clips retained by screws, to the hinged frame. It wont be difficult to change it, I guess.
It would be interesting, once the Flektoskop would be restored, trying to use it and enjoy the 180/2,8 "T" CZJ Sonnar.
retinax
Well-known
Congrats, that's must be a wonderful lens and very affective at scaring children! Please post results (not scared children but any pictures taken with this)!
View Range
Well-known
Consider that it is not too hard or expensive to find the 300mm Sonnar and the 500mm Fernobjektiv lenses. These lenses were sold for Exakta and Contax S (M42) in numbers that don't make them too rare. The SLR lenses in fact are Flektoskop lenses with adapters which are removed in the same manner as from the reflex housing. You need to be able to visually recognize the difference between Flektoskop and Flektometer lenses on e-bay. The Exakta / Contax S Flektoskop-based lenses will work for your reflex housing while the Exakta / Contax S Flektometer-based lenses will NOT work for your reflex housing because the thread pitch is substantially different. Good luck hunting.
The threads on these lenses don't need any lubricant.
The threads on these lenses don't need any lubricant.
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Thank you for your reply with further data.
Actually, I already have a 1955-made CZJ-Sonnar 180/2,8 belonged to my late father: he used it with his Contax-S (that I still use).
Nearly 2 years ago, I've acquired an early-1954-made CZJ-Fernobjektiv, also with 42x1 mount. Actually, this Fernobjektiv (that, used with BW film, a yellow filter and -compulsory- its sun-shade, gives surprisingly good results!) has a screwn-on bottom, with the 42x1 thread. Perhaps, it can be adapted to the Flektoskop...
Once removed the Sonnar from the Flektoskop housing, the thread was like "dirty" with a relatively sticky, brownish material, looking like hardened, old grease or lubricant. I've carefully removed any remains of such stuff and -as said- the lens now goes perfectly on and off the reflex housing.
The Flektometer, appears on my Carl Zeiss Jena lenses catalogue from 1955 so, I assume that even if it's one year older, my Fernobjektiv is perhaps too late to be used on my Flektoskop.
How could I detect, whether a SBZ/DDR-made Sonnar 300 or Fernobjektiv 500 is resp. of the Flektoskop or Flektometer type?
While on further reading through H-J Kuc's "Auf den Spuren der Contax" vol.II (page 87), I've noticed that the author assumes that the 2nd type Flektoskop, like my one, could have been produced in no more than 10 pieces, a thing that surprises me.
All the best,
Enzo
Actually, I already have a 1955-made CZJ-Sonnar 180/2,8 belonged to my late father: he used it with his Contax-S (that I still use).
Nearly 2 years ago, I've acquired an early-1954-made CZJ-Fernobjektiv, also with 42x1 mount. Actually, this Fernobjektiv (that, used with BW film, a yellow filter and -compulsory- its sun-shade, gives surprisingly good results!) has a screwn-on bottom, with the 42x1 thread. Perhaps, it can be adapted to the Flektoskop...
Once removed the Sonnar from the Flektoskop housing, the thread was like "dirty" with a relatively sticky, brownish material, looking like hardened, old grease or lubricant. I've carefully removed any remains of such stuff and -as said- the lens now goes perfectly on and off the reflex housing.
The Flektometer, appears on my Carl Zeiss Jena lenses catalogue from 1955 so, I assume that even if it's one year older, my Fernobjektiv is perhaps too late to be used on my Flektoskop.
How could I detect, whether a SBZ/DDR-made Sonnar 300 or Fernobjektiv 500 is resp. of the Flektoskop or Flektometer type?
While on further reading through H-J Kuc's "Auf den Spuren der Contax" vol.II (page 87), I've noticed that the author assumes that the 2nd type Flektoskop, like my one, could have been produced in no more than 10 pieces, a thing that surprises me.
All the best,
Enzo
johank
Established
The later in your post I doubt very much since only in photoshops in Gothenburg where I grow up, had over 8 on there shelfs.
The 180 2,8 is a great Lens to use. I only have the previous Flektoskope. My 300 and 500 makes my RFs so much more of a universal camera.
Russians makes new rear adapters to these lenses to for SLRs. Ebay have from time to time adapters to the 300 and 500.
The 180 2,8 is a great Lens to use. I only have the previous Flektoskope. My 300 and 500 makes my RFs so much more of a universal camera.
Russians makes new rear adapters to these lenses to for SLRs. Ebay have from time to time adapters to the 300 and 500.
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Hello Johan,
interesting to know, that in the past, at least in Gothenburg, many Flektoskope of this transitional type appeared, thus the info given by H.J. Kuc has to be considered as his own personal opinion.
Perhaps, Carl Zeiss Jena, had more chances to sell their post-war products to Sweden (if I correctly remember, the Contax-S was presented in Sweden first, even earlier than the Leipzig fair), thus the appearing of more of such pieces in your country, than anywhere else.
By the way, in all auctions of Westlicht, this identical type of Flektoskop, appeared 1 time only (Auction 21, lot nr. 429).
Best,
Enzo
interesting to know, that in the past, at least in Gothenburg, many Flektoskope of this transitional type appeared, thus the info given by H.J. Kuc has to be considered as his own personal opinion.
Perhaps, Carl Zeiss Jena, had more chances to sell their post-war products to Sweden (if I correctly remember, the Contax-S was presented in Sweden first, even earlier than the Leipzig fair), thus the appearing of more of such pieces in your country, than anywhere else.
By the way, in all auctions of Westlicht, this identical type of Flektoskop, appeared 1 time only (Auction 21, lot nr. 429).
Best,
Enzo
johank
Established
Contax S, Contax IIa and IIIa aswell as Flektoscopes with long Lenses where at many photshops while I was youngster and could not afford any of them. Cameras and Optics trade between DDR and Sweden was substantial for DDR. Practica, Exacta Varex and Exa where freqvent too.
I had one old Kiev, with 35 and 8,5 and and good Ikoflex. With good conection to the camerarepairmen I traded up my used gear for modest money.
I had one old Kiev, with 35 and 8,5 and and good Ikoflex. With good conection to the camerarepairmen I traded up my used gear for modest money.
View Range
Well-known
There is very little published information on the Zeiss reflex housings. Perhaps the most useful is Charles Barringer's article in Zeiss Historica, Volume 11, Number 1, Spring 1989. The article is available on the Zeiss Historica website. Barringer thinks fewer than 500 post-war Flektoskops were made. Lawrence Gubas on page 700 of his fabulous book Zeiss and Photography puts the number at less than 100. It is well known and confirmed by serial numbers that only 200 Flektometers were made.
I have collected a few serial numbers. I have serial numbers of 8 post-war Flektoskops of the first version, starting at 10614 and ending at 10741. I only have three serial numbers for post-war Flektoskops of the second version: 15484, 17823 and 17888. SN 15484 is confirmed, suggesting that there were two series of these housings because there was no way that at least 2404 were made.
I have collected a few serial numbers. I have serial numbers of 8 post-war Flektoskops of the first version, starting at 10614 and ending at 10741. I only have three serial numbers for post-war Flektoskops of the second version: 15484, 17823 and 17888. SN 15484 is confirmed, suggesting that there were two series of these housings because there was no way that at least 2404 were made.
View Range
Well-known
E-bay item 311757929582 is a Flektoskop 300mm Sonnar. E-bay item 401511202041 is a Flektometer 300mm Sonnar. Both of these have M42 adapters. The 500mm Fernobjektiv that is on E-bay is a Flektometer lens. After further thought, I believe Flektoskop Fernobjektiv lenses are very rare.
wes loder
Photographer/Historian
If you think 50cm fernobjektiv in either Flektoskop or Flektometer are rare, try finding one in Panflex mount. I have one and it is a nice lens, usable on a Nikon F with BR-1 ring. Also usable on Nikon S with Panflex.
Elmar Lang
Well-known
Hello,
my Flektoskop (I'm not sure that the no. would be visible enough in the pictures), is number 17832; the Jena Sonnar 180/2,8 bears the number 3114372.
I know Charles Barringer's article in the ZHS bulletin: actually, very few has been written about the Flektoskope and I also look forward to buying the mentioned book, also written by Barringer.
Best wishes,
Enzo
P.S.: to Wes: my Panflex has the Contax "outer" bayonet: does your CZJ-Fernobjektiv 500 have this mount too?
my Flektoskop (I'm not sure that the no. would be visible enough in the pictures), is number 17832; the Jena Sonnar 180/2,8 bears the number 3114372.
I know Charles Barringer's article in the ZHS bulletin: actually, very few has been written about the Flektoskope and I also look forward to buying the mentioned book, also written by Barringer.
Best wishes,
Enzo
P.S.: to Wes: my Panflex has the Contax "outer" bayonet: does your CZJ-Fernobjektiv 500 have this mount too?