folding 4x5 options

[Jani_from_Finland]

If I had cared to bookmark then I would but we're left to Google... so 15 seconds later I found the correct diagram in the middle of this thread: http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/006RYL

My old friends at the http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/ would be helpful, although you tend to get dozens of different expert opinions from people who have never used a large format camera... not unlike other photo forums ;-p

This guy is out to sell stuff but he has a lot of minutia to ponder: http://www.glennview.com/sinar.htm his whole website is kind of a treasure trove of overpriced but really cool stuff.

As for other tidbits, I just sort of picked them up over the years of owning and breaking cameras.

Well apprechiated. Thank you.

 

[redisburning]

actually looking at photobackpacker I think one of those cases and a field camera might cut it.

the Toyo or Wista still seems like a good option, too. Maybe one of those AND a case.

I am not interested in using a monorail, frankly. Im young enough that carrying the weight isn't such a big issue as long as I can stuff it in my regular backpack with some other stuff. This isn't for backpacking in the wilderness, btw. Just some city stuff. My Sinar is simply not going to fold up into that small of a space.

 

[sojournerphoto]

Don't know if it's quite what you want, but I have a Shem Hao. Mine is a 5 by 7, but I was also given and 4 by 5 back. It's lovely, but inevitably quite big. Only got a 210 lens, but toying with a 90

Mike

 

[thegman]

If you can live with only having shift, no other movements, then I just bought a Fotoman 45SPS which is a highly portable 4x5, particularly for wide angle lenses. Mine has a 75mm lens, and it's not very big at all.

 

[Keith]

This thread sent me off perusing the Razzle site ... nice but I don't see anything that gives me a huge advantage over my Crown Graphic.

Continue on!

 

[Frank Petronio]

This thread sent me off perusing the Razzle site ... nice but I don't see anything that gives me a huge advantage over my Crown Graphic.

Continue on!

Other than Dean is a peach of a guy ;-p But I bet even he'd tell you to get your feet wet with a cheaper Crown first.

 

[Jamesruff]

I had that same problem. I have a graphic view II, which has plenty of movements, but is a monorail, so a pain to carry around.

I just bought a Wista Feild 45DXII.
It has plenty of movements, folds up, is light, looks realllllly nice and can 75mm lenses with very limited movements.

 

[redisburning]

ok guys after some thought I think what's going to be right for me is a folding field camera with a case, not a clamshell. that way I can carry a smallish rectangle/cube and another small case with two lenses in it (a 150/5.6 and a 90, 90 tbd).

I was unaware of the existence of such cases and as they seem to not add too much bulk compared to the big metal field cases I would rather keep as many movements as possible while moving to a camera where I do not have to figure out what to do with the monorail. Completely breaking down the camera is too much hassle for me and I think the added ease of being able to fold the camera down will make this a bit of an easier exercise for me.

Thanks for all the advice, the only thing to do now is to look patiently for one.

Ill pick up a 90 later. I still have some lust for the 90/4.5 Nikkor =/

 

[oftheherd]

...

The 9x12 plate/sheet film cameras are really fun, but not sure how long sheet film in this format will be available. Mainly coming out of Europe these days. Of course u can cut 9x12 down from larger sheet film if u have access to good darkroom.. And u can find roll film backs for most of these old cameras. When I was really into these cameras, I did a DIY ugly as **ll 9x12 to 4x5 adapter for it. There was a time when there were third party companies that made these types of adapters for 9x12 when 4x5 became very popular. I have only seen on the web two of these for sale.
...

Not what the OP seems to want, but most 9x12 are very portable (especially the wooden ones but metal are a little heavier), and most have rise/fall and shift, but no other movements. The problem comes when a person such as the OP, wants more wide than about 35mm equivalent. There were two or three 9x12 with interchangeable lenses, but I don't think any went wider than the 35mm equivalent, and although I have a Bee Bee, I have never seen another lens other than the normal. Maybe someday. In the meantime, there were many wide and tele adapter lenses, as well as portrait lenses. They seem to work reasonably well, but of course will not be as good as a dedicated wide or tele.

But it looks like the OP has decided on what he wants, and it sounds like a good solution.

 

[GaryLH]

Yeah.. cameras like the voitlander berghail had bayonet mount capability. Someone on apug had custom made new mounts so he could mount his own modern lenses. I think if u go.that route then u could carry a second lens separately.

Gary

 

[Texsport]

I have 6x9, 6x12, and 6x17 cameras.

I have looked at Razzle and Byron cameras repeatedly.( Errr - see my 2nd signature statement
Below)

I have been held back by an unanswered question I have.

What size enlargement would make it worthwhile to shoot hand held 4x5 instead of what I have, which are usually shot on a tripod?

Texsport

 

[3rdtrick]

If you are considering the Polaroid conversions, I would like to add another choice. Nate from Polaroid Conversions does excellent work and has a variety of 4x5s. I have one of his conversions but it is just a packfilm version.
Pete

 

[sevo]

Not what the OP seems to want, but most 9x12 are very portable (especially the wooden ones but metal are a little heavier), and most have rise/fall and shift, but no other movements.

The German equivalent to 4x5" between the wars was 10x15cm - pretty closely 4x6", that is, more than 2cm longer on the long edge, but almost exactly the same width. While you can only get 10x15 film as special order (or by trimming from a larger format) these days, the fit across the wide edge is close enough that 4x5 sheets can be used in many (loose fitting) 10x15 holders, if you tape up the unsecured edge.

Quite a few of the "pocket" plate cameras of the period were sold in 10x15 as well as 9x12 and 6x9 versions - the Bergheil among them. The 10x15 cameras tend to be just as slim, just 1 respectively 3 cm longer in two dimension, so they are almost as pocketable.

 

[redisburning]

all interesting options, but right now I am looking at the Wista 45dx and some Shen Hao options (all second hand). If I find a good condition/price camera after Friday when I get paid and get home Im going to buy it.

Im probably going to sell the Sinar and add some cash to it for a 90 after a few months, maybe around Christmas.

 

[Frank Petronio]

I have 6x9, 6x12, and 6x17 cameras.

I have looked at Razzle and Byron cameras repeatedly.( Errr - see my 2nd signature statement
Below)

I have been held back by an unanswered question I have.

What size enlargement would make it worthwhile to shoot hand held 4x5 instead of what I have, which are usually shot on a tripod?

Texsport

Been there, done that with a lot of variations. My experience is that handheld 4x5 is less sharp than a good medium format rangefinder camera like a Mamiya 7 or Fuji 6x9 because of subtle shakiness, hitting optimal aperture and depth of field, etc.

But you can still have fun shooting 4x5 handheld anyway, even if the results are a wash, you get a lot of comments from bystanders and you blow a lot of shots, which helps keep the film makers in business.

 

[nikon_sam]

Pictures of my Zone VI View Camera with a Tessar 190mm lens mounted...
Among other lenses I have a 90mm & 75mm they both work fine with the bag bellows...

 

[keytarjunkie]

I have a nagaoka, similar to this one here: small, very light, and best of all it only cost me $300. Much more compact than Zone VI, Wista, Shen Hao, etc.

For your purpose, a small wooden camera might be best...the larger wooden ones aren't really any smaller than a crown graphic (which, by the way, is wood underneath that covering). Otherwise the metal Toyos and Wistas are the best bang for the buck. Linhof Tech IV is amazing if you have $800-1300 to shell out for it, but pretty fat and heavy.

What you need to protect the ground glass is one of these. I leave it on my camera all the time until I shoot. They're great!

 

[KM-25]

I want to expand my LF setup. Looking at my images with the big big negatives, and realize that my future photography will probably be less images and a higher IQ demand for each one, I am seriously considering investing some cash into 4x5.

Congrats on the upgrade, it took me awhile before I thought my image quality in both subject impact and darkroom technique were up to moving to large format, I personally figured why waste time and money on bigger boring negatives, lol! Overall emotional impact of the photograph's content is by far the most important image quality in my experience.

To cut to the chase, I use and will only use Chamonix 4x5 field cameras. They are quite inexpensive for what has got to be one of the most well thought out and constructed cameras I have ever used in my 23 years shooting professionally. Like Frank says, they are super rigid and come with nearly 400mm of bellows extension standard. To put it in perspective, I had a Sinar F2 for about a week, great legendary monorail camera with an amazing level of component flexibility. I got it to use with a dedicated macro lens for a fun new body of work I am doing. After wrestling with it for a week on macro shots of 1:1 up to 2x that are all straight down, I gave up and returned it to KEH for a gracious refund. It turned out that the Chamonix 45N2 blew it away in overall ease of use, was equally as stable and had slightly more bellows extension.
For a 90mm I use a Nikkor SW F8 which has a respectable 235mm image circle at F/22, awesome modern multi-coated lens and pretty small and light at that, one I rarely leave home without.

I plan on getting a second Chamonix next tax year for use when I have a specific shot set up and need to roam around with another rig not to mention as a backup. That's my feeling on it all anyway...

 

[redisburning]

Well I am seeing there are some availability issues with large format lol. Anyway I've put the Sinar up for sale in the classifieds and have a few cameras scoped out that and when I see a good deal on one of them I will go for that. I've talked myself into and out of several individual models, but right now I think a Toyo 45A is about where I want to be.

I see the pros as being:
Reasonable price
Takes 90/4.5 Nikkor
Adequate movements for my uses, especially with bed drop & back tilt
Folds into reasonable space, weight is a bit high but not undoable, may not need case depending
Fairly rigid to deal with moderate wind conditions

Im trying to decide if I really need front swing because the Wistas dont have it and appear to be a bit cheaper. And of course if I see a good deal on a Technika IV I might just spend up for that.

 

[Frank Petronio]

Wistas swing ~ the advantage of the Wista over the Toyo is that the Wista will close up with a moderate-sized lens mounted. The advantage of the Toyo is a longer bellows and focusing track. In practical terms, you can use a 300 on a Toyo for landscape; maybe a 210-240 on the Wista. There are work-arounds of course (tele lenses, extension tracks and bellows, top-hat lens boards....)