DrSquirley
Member
I was just generally browsing the internet digging up as much info as i could for my new Fed 2 and i seem to get the impression that theres an issue with using fsu lenses on non fsu ltm cameras and using ltm lenses on fsu cameras. Something to do with the effective lens baselength.. yada yada yada. Is this true? Will focusing be off if i use a legit ltm lens on my fed? Or if use fsu lens on canon p or something?
Thanks.
Thanks.
Ash
Selflessly Self-involved
It may be down to the lens or camera. FSU's are notorious for poor quality control, but I think I read on here about people needing to re-adjust lenses.
Basically, the chances of an FSU lens working on any camera 'out of the box' is pretty slim, so you're gonna need to adjust everything sooner or later.
Thats my misinformed opinion anyways
Basically, the chances of an FSU lens working on any camera 'out of the box' is pretty slim, so you're gonna need to adjust everything sooner or later.
Thats my misinformed opinion anyways
fraley
Beware of Claws
Mr. Nuts, er Dr. Squirly
I've used a Cosina Voigtlander 50/2.5 and 35/2.5 on FSU bodies such as a Zorki 4 and Fed 2 without any problems. For some reason I've never put an FSU lens on my Bessa R2 other than to try out the look. I think it would be fine unless you are shooting up close and with a wide open aperture. Just my limited experience with this and my less than rigorous approach.
I've used a Cosina Voigtlander 50/2.5 and 35/2.5 on FSU bodies such as a Zorki 4 and Fed 2 without any problems. For some reason I've never put an FSU lens on my Bessa R2 other than to try out the look. I think it would be fine unless you are shooting up close and with a wide open aperture. Just my limited experience with this and my less than rigorous approach.
Jocko
Off With The Pixies
This is one of those stories that goes around endlessly, and is almost holy writ to some people - I suspect those who customarily denigrate FSU gear.
I use CV, Canon and Soviet lenses on Feds, a Bessa R and a Leica IIIF. I have never had any problems that were not lost in depth of field. As Ash rightly says, quality control was variable, but a properly adjusted Soviet lens will - in my experience - focus just as well as something from Leitz.
There are some minor compatibility problems:
A) The Jupiter 12 35mm lens will not fit in a Bessa due to the protruding real element.
B) Certain Canon and Leica lenses - for example the Serenar f2 85mm lens - use a tab to transmit lens movement to the rangefinder. Such lenses are not really suited to Soviet cameras.
C) Very early FEDs (c. pre 1948) and Canons (c.pre 1950) used a metric 39 MM thread, not the Whitworth thread used by Leitz. cameras and lenses from this period are not compatible with ordinary LTM threads. But those cameras and lenses are rare collector's items.
So really, there's no problem.
IMHO!
Cheers, Ian
I use CV, Canon and Soviet lenses on Feds, a Bessa R and a Leica IIIF. I have never had any problems that were not lost in depth of field. As Ash rightly says, quality control was variable, but a properly adjusted Soviet lens will - in my experience - focus just as well as something from Leitz.
There are some minor compatibility problems:
A) The Jupiter 12 35mm lens will not fit in a Bessa due to the protruding real element.
B) Certain Canon and Leica lenses - for example the Serenar f2 85mm lens - use a tab to transmit lens movement to the rangefinder. Such lenses are not really suited to Soviet cameras.
C) Very early FEDs (c. pre 1948) and Canons (c.pre 1950) used a metric 39 MM thread, not the Whitworth thread used by Leitz. cameras and lenses from this period are not compatible with ordinary LTM threads. But those cameras and lenses are rare collector's items.
So really, there's no problem.
IMHO!
Cheers, Ian
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DrSquirley
Member
As usual a vast pool of knowlege, thanks.
GeorgesGiralt
Established
Hi !
As for quality control, I remember, as a small child, (late 60's early 70's) my uncle, a "giant" for me yelling and crying everytime he came back from the lab with the picts from his brand new Leica. It was a foolish thing to do for people not so rich at the time, buy a brand new Leica and it's 50 mm lens. I do not remeber the model, an M yes, but which one ? He got blurry pictures, not one sharp enough to have it printed. The Leica and its lens retruned to Leica not one but twice. And finally was fixed by a local repairsman... Then, my uncle bought an extra 35 mm lens. After the first film came back from the lab, he sold the whole kit.... His wife telling him she file for divorce if the story repeated once more. You've guessed, the pictures where blurry with the 35 mm lens. And he bought a Yashica MAT if my memory serves me right.
So, quality control is as every thing, relative.... I remember that he got an ad from Leica telling that it took great craftsamnship to produce a perfectly aligned camera and that Leica was proud to achieve such high precision standards... I got the adv right after he read the 5 first lines and I delighted myself of the exploded views it contained.
As for quality control, I remember, as a small child, (late 60's early 70's) my uncle, a "giant" for me yelling and crying everytime he came back from the lab with the picts from his brand new Leica. It was a foolish thing to do for people not so rich at the time, buy a brand new Leica and it's 50 mm lens. I do not remeber the model, an M yes, but which one ? He got blurry pictures, not one sharp enough to have it printed. The Leica and its lens retruned to Leica not one but twice. And finally was fixed by a local repairsman... Then, my uncle bought an extra 35 mm lens. After the first film came back from the lab, he sold the whole kit.... His wife telling him she file for divorce if the story repeated once more. You've guessed, the pictures where blurry with the 35 mm lens. And he bought a Yashica MAT if my memory serves me right.
So, quality control is as every thing, relative.... I remember that he got an ad from Leica telling that it took great craftsamnship to produce a perfectly aligned camera and that Leica was proud to achieve such high precision standards... I got the adv right after he read the 5 first lines and I delighted myself of the exploded views it contained.
oscroft
Veteran
I've used my CV 21mm lens successfully on my FED2 (but its depth of field is so great that minor focusing differences wouldn't matter). The CV15mm lens, however, isn't suitable for some FSU bodies because although the screw thread fits fine, individual FSU cameras all seem to have their threads terminate in different positions (My FED1, FED2 and FED3 are all slightly different), and so the "hood" of the 15mm lens often isn't square (mine's OK on my FED3 but is out of position on the other two).
OldNick
Well-known
I use a Jupiter 12 35mm f/2.8 lens on my Leica IIIf with no problem. I have not tried any other FSU lenses.
Jim N.
Jim N.
colyn
ישו משיח
OldNick said:
I just tryed my J-12 on my Leica IIIc and it works fine..
S
Scarpia
Guest
I have used an Industar 61 L/D on a Bessa L with excellent results. Also used an Industar 50 on a Leica M-1 with excellent results as well. I have no qualms about using FSU lenses on Leicas, Bessas, etc and visa versa with the provisos listed by the previous posters observed.
Kurt M.
Kurt M.
lmd91343
There's my Proctor-Silex!
I've used my jupiter 85/f2.0 on my Canon 7 and IV-IIS2 with good results.
I had to take apart, reassemble, and relocate the infinity focus stop due to assembly mistakes. I ran several test rolls after the rebuild and found that at f2.0 the DOF at minimal distance was not centered at the focus distance, but rather was 1/3 in front at 2/3rds behind. At other distances and openings, I did not observe that.
I have been able to use my jupiter 35/f2.8 on my 7. It fits ok. I opened up the back and set the shutter to T to check. It does not touch the light baffles or shutter. It also fits my IV-IIS2 without a problem. I have not tried it on my 7s.
I had to take apart, reassemble, and relocate the infinity focus stop due to assembly mistakes. I ran several test rolls after the rebuild and found that at f2.0 the DOF at minimal distance was not centered at the focus distance, but rather was 1/3 in front at 2/3rds behind. At other distances and openings, I did not observe that.
I have been able to use my jupiter 35/f2.8 on my 7. It fits ok. I opened up the back and set the shutter to T to check. It does not touch the light baffles or shutter. It also fits my IV-IIS2 without a problem. I have not tried it on my 7s.
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
With the exception of the J-12, I have successfully used all of my LTM(I do have some kiev mount lenses so I make this distinction) FSU lenses on a Bessa R. The collapsible Industar-50 worked well on the R but I decided that since I couldn't collapse it when it was on the Bessa, I wouldn't use it on that camera--I was always worried I would accidentally collapse it.
If the camera you are using has the correct flange-to-film distance (lens working distance) for LTM standards and the lens is correctly in tolerance, there should be no problems focusing. That said, the QC of the FSU cameras and lenses was a bit spotty.
If you already have some other LTM lenses, try 'em wide open and close up on the FED and see how they perform. And, if you have some other LTM camera, try the lens from your FED2 on that camera.
If you are just starting to build your glass collection and have only the FED, then the FSU lenses are what I would concentrate on. Good, cheap fun in my opinion. Pick a good dealer and it is hard to go wrong with these.
Rob
If the camera you are using has the correct flange-to-film distance (lens working distance) for LTM standards and the lens is correctly in tolerance, there should be no problems focusing. That said, the QC of the FSU cameras and lenses was a bit spotty.
If you already have some other LTM lenses, try 'em wide open and close up on the FED and see how they perform. And, if you have some other LTM camera, try the lens from your FED2 on that camera.
If you are just starting to build your glass collection and have only the FED, then the FSU lenses are what I would concentrate on. Good, cheap fun in my opinion. Pick a good dealer and it is hard to go wrong with these.
Rob
Ash
Selflessly Self-involved
lmd91343 said:
As far as I was taught, that is EXACTLY how it should be. DoF affects twice as much behind as in front.
wamjam
Well-known
i interchange my industar 61 and summarit 50mm on both my fed2 and leica m3...no problem
ZorkiKat
ЗоркийК&
No problems with J-12 on my Leica IIIc or Leica M3. My J-9 (85mm/2) even works better - read: focuses with more accuracy- on my Leicas than on most of my FED or Zorki. And the J-3, which some of those supposed 'experts' who've said that it won't focus on Leicas because of camming issues (ie, having camming movement more apt for the Contax/Kiev than the Leica) focus quite correctly on my Leicas. Ditto with my Canon IIb and IVSB.
The only FSU lenses I'd be wary on using with Leica or Canon are the Industar -10 (often marked as "FED50") made for the prewar and immediate post-war FED. Not only is their thread mount pitch and focus registers non-standard, they won't even fit later FED or Zorki.
Jay
The only FSU lenses I'd be wary on using with Leica or Canon are the Industar -10 (often marked as "FED50") made for the prewar and immediate post-war FED. Not only is their thread mount pitch and focus registers non-standard, they won't even fit later FED or Zorki.
Jay
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
I guess build quality variation is a greater problem than effective baselength or normal focal length of the rangefinder system. So with critical lenses like the J-3 and J-9 (for which you probably hear the largest relative proportions of remarks about their focusing being off) one should be prepared to have a new lens adjusted anyway because of their large aperture and low tolerances. I tested a J-3 on a Bessa and a Zorki-6, and it was fine on the Bessa while slightly off on the Z-6, which, on the other hand, focused all my other FSU lenses nicely. So I guess tolerances just didn't work out at some point.
There can be other problems, too; my Industar-22, for example, can't focus to infinity on my Bessa because the focusing tab's infinity lock gets in the way. This is only indirectly related to the mount though.
BTW Jay: "Sharp-eyed kitty" in Russian is зоркий кот
Philipp
There can be other problems, too; my Industar-22, for example, can't focus to infinity on my Bessa because the focusing tab's infinity lock gets in the way. This is only indirectly related to the mount though.
BTW Jay: "Sharp-eyed kitty" in Russian is зоркий кот
Philipp
ZorkiKat
ЗоркийК&
rxmd said:BTW Jay: "Sharp-eyed kitty" in Russian is зоркий кот
Philipp
Hi Philipp
"ZorkiKat" is the name of one of my cats (got four- and the one in the avatar isn't him), and the "sharp-eyed kitty" tag was meant to describe him, having just one good eye...not really meant to translate 'sharp-eyed kitty' to Russian.
Jay
Xmas
Veteran
DrS
Recieved advise is that the Ru and Nikon rationalised their lens manufacture.
The Ru built all their lens to the Contax focal length (standard), with a rngfdr this is critical.
Nikon built all their lens to the Leitz focal length, ditto.
So unless you bodge things only the short lens will focus well, on the other standard of body, If you try swapping wide aperture 85mm or moderate 135mm the plane of focus for portaits will be way off the eye that you focus on.
Some people will bodge a lens for you.
You can get good Ru lens for your Ru bodies, so dont worry.
Noel
Recieved advise is that the Ru and Nikon rationalised their lens manufacture.
The Ru built all their lens to the Contax focal length (standard), with a rngfdr this is critical.
Nikon built all their lens to the Leitz focal length, ditto.
So unless you bodge things only the short lens will focus well, on the other standard of body, If you try swapping wide aperture 85mm or moderate 135mm the plane of focus for portaits will be way off the eye that you focus on.
Some people will bodge a lens for you.
You can get good Ru lens for your Ru bodies, so dont worry.
Noel
Xmas
Veteran
Guys
Ok I lied Nikon built some lens to the Contax standard and marked them C.
But not every one who bodges a lens will mark them like Nikon?
Just let me put on by asbestos suit now...
Noel
Ok I lied Nikon built some lens to the Contax standard and marked them C.
But not every one who bodges a lens will mark them like Nikon?
Just let me put on by asbestos suit now...
Noel
ZorkiKat
ЗоркийК&
Xmas said:
Noel
Would this be the "Contax-camming-adapted-to-LTM-lenses-without-modification" issue?
I believe that the Russians/Soviets did modify their LTM lenses to suit the requirements of LTM cameras built after Barnack's standards. How well they imposed on the quality of doing this is another issue.
That wide-aperture 50mms like the Ju-3 (50/1,5) and Ju-8 (50/2) can focus properly with non-soviet cameras should say something about this. I've shot
the Ju-3 at f/1,5 with my IIIc and focus was always on the dot. I've got another Ju-3 (with an adapter) which is now the standard lens of my Leica M3.
The same could be said about the Ju-9 (85/2). It always focuses right with my M3 or IIIc. Even my 'worst' Ju-9, which I suspect to have been tampered, gave me a pleasant surprise when it focused right on the spot when I tried it on my Leica III as a stunt.
That said, I would opine that any focusing problem encountered with using Jupiters or other FSU LTM lenses (excluding those made for the early and immediate post-war FED cameras) on non soviet LTM RF cameras is likely with shimming or focusing helix assembly issues.
Jay
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