dct
perpetual amateur
(corrected crosspost from another thread)
My expectation is to have at least a solution to match up with Nex and GXR-M bodies. That would mean EVF only with AF confirmation. If Fuji would go a few steps further than the competitors, they might add things like custom frame line in OVF (mentioned on page 70 of the user manual) or an adapter with focussing cam readout or whatever they are testing...
Apart from that I'm still not sure how the DoF prompt in the distance scale is computed, also for the own XF lenses. Does it come from a lens database (or directly from the lens) or is this something calculated "on the fly", derived from current AF readout during focussing and changing aperture?
My expectation is to have at least a solution to match up with Nex and GXR-M bodies. That would mean EVF only with AF confirmation. If Fuji would go a few steps further than the competitors, they might add things like custom frame line in OVF (mentioned on page 70 of the user manual) or an adapter with focussing cam readout or whatever they are testing...
Apart from that I'm still not sure how the DoF prompt in the distance scale is computed, also for the own XF lenses. Does it come from a lens database (or directly from the lens) or is this something calculated "on the fly", derived from current AF readout during focussing and changing aperture?
kanzlr
Hexaneur
indeed. Still better to focus than the NEX.
the solution to the problem for me was to sell the NEX, now I don't think about its nice EVF anymore
dreilly
Chillin' in Geneva
Two weeks have gone by and still no more details on focusing manual lenses. Well, I guess we have established beyond a reasonable doubt that the X-1 Pro does not have a split-beam rangefinder!
So for manual focus: if you're using the LCD or EVF, how do you magnify the view and how do you get back to full composition view?
And is there any kind of focus confirmation using the OVF?
Does anyone know?
So for manual focus: if you're using the LCD or EVF, how do you magnify the view and how do you get back to full composition view?
And is there any kind of focus confirmation using the OVF?
Does anyone know?
Benjamin Marks
Veteran
How does it work in the X100?
willie_901
Veteran
This is simply a wait and see situation. The Ricoh GXR A12 M-Mount unit is really the best mirror less solution right now as the A12 was designed with one single priority... work well with M/LTM optics.
Maybe Fuji is releasing their adapter because it's an easy way to sell a value added accessory. In this case their adapter is just an after thought.
Or, maybe Fuji knows that M optics will work well with the XP-1 sensor. Maybe they have a viable way to focus mechanical lenses ready for release with the M adapter. Maybe they are delaying a functional M solution until the initial wave of demand for the camera and X-mount lenses subsides.
Every one is guessing because anyone who knows the facts isn't talking.
Maybe Fuji is releasing their adapter because it's an easy way to sell a value added accessory. In this case their adapter is just an after thought.
Or, maybe Fuji knows that M optics will work well with the XP-1 sensor. Maybe they have a viable way to focus mechanical lenses ready for release with the M adapter. Maybe they are delaying a functional M solution until the initial wave of demand for the camera and X-mount lenses subsides.
Every one is guessing because anyone who knows the facts isn't talking.
Arjay
Time Traveller
One thing is for sure, neither the X100 nor the X-Pro 1 are using split-beam focusing. Fuji has never made any claims in that direction, and all technical data published to date prove that this camera is NOT a classical RF system.
There have been many speculations if an M-to-X adapter might contain a cam follower to read out the M lens' actual focusing distance as that would enable (a) OVF parallax correction, (b ) a distance and DoF-display in the viewfinder, and (c ) a simulation of a split-image focusing function.
However, some leaked photos of a Fuji M-to-X adapter prototype indicate that the adapter does not contain such a function. So all we're stuck with are speculations if, and what kind of MF focus assist functions Fuji might offer as firmware update if and when such an adapter would appear on the market.
I would just love to be proven wrong.
There have been many speculations if an M-to-X adapter might contain a cam follower to read out the M lens' actual focusing distance as that would enable (a) OVF parallax correction, (b ) a distance and DoF-display in the viewfinder, and (c ) a simulation of a split-image focusing function.
However, some leaked photos of a Fuji M-to-X adapter prototype indicate that the adapter does not contain such a function. So all we're stuck with are speculations if, and what kind of MF focus assist functions Fuji might offer as firmware update if and when such an adapter would appear on the market.
I would just love to be proven wrong.
Adanac
Well-known
The details remain the same. The X-Pro1 is, like the X100, first and foremost an autofocus camera designed to work best with the company's AF lenses. Manual focus, even with the company's own lenses, is an afterthought.
Current firmware provides no other focus assist other than zoom. There is a button on the back of the X100 and X-Pro1 you can depress to toggle the zoom on and off. The EVF in the X-Pro1 is said to be the same as the EVF in the X100. That being the case, my opinion is that only providing magnify as an assist will not be sufficient for the dedicated manual focus M lens shooter, based on my own experience with the X100. The current EVF has insufficient resolution to provide fine detail when zoomed.
I'm not even convinced the current EVF provides enough resolution on which to overlay a focus peaking display, should Fujifilm get around to implementing one.
Given that the X100 still doesn't have a firmware update that moves the Auto ISO toggle into the ISO menu for quick and logical access, despite widespread calls from the user community to code up this very simple change, it seems foolish to me - or perhaps "false-confidence" is a better way of putting it - to purchase an early X-Pro1 with the hope that a firmware update will deliver a focus peaking feature down the road. It seems safer to wait.
Or buy the X-Pro1 with no expectations other than using it as an AF camera with the company's AF lenses.
There was never any expectation that this camera had such a feature. Probably you can safely rule out any digital camera having this feature other than Leica's digital Ms.
No.
The benefits of the OVF to manual focus lens users will be limited. Here's a workflow:
- Before using the lens(es), input your focal lengths into a table in the camera.
- Mount lens, select from table the lens you've mounted. This will cause the frame lines in the OVF to adjust to the calculated field of view. It'll probably also cause the OVF magnification to kick in to one of its three positions.
- Switch to EVF and focus. Either remain in EVF and make the image, or,
- Switch to OVF and recompose and make the image.
- Return to EVF for next focus.
Or you can use zone focus when that is appropriate.
Users will probably find that they remain in the EVF more than not, unless they need the specific properties of the OVF to make their photographs, namely a view greater than the frameline for the focal length as an assist for timing; and an optical viewfinder many will enjoy simply because it isn't a limited rendition.
That said with my X100 I used the EVF more often than not - subject dependent - because I like to frame more accurately when I can. The framelines in the OVF were not that accurate despite parallax correction in a fixed single lens camera and I don't expect them to be any more accurate in an interchangeable lens camera.
When I need to see outside the frame with an electronic finder camera (like the NEX or GXR) I pull my eye away from the EVF and use the rear live view display. Despite being a viewfinder die-hard and something of a curmudgeon on the topic, I've found that using the rear display actually works quite well - a window on the world if you will - that does give me the opportunity to time shots where a subject will enter the frame thanks to the heads up you get seeing beyond the frame, just as with an optical viewfinder.
250swb
Well-known
I don't know that this will be any more complicated than using an M adapter on a m4/3 body like a Panasonic G1 etc. To start with the EVF causes the image to really 'pop' when you hit the correct focus, its very easy to see. And you can press a button to magnify the area you want in focus as well. So OK, no focus confirmation other than your own eyes, but hasn't that mostly been the case since photography was invented?
Steve
Steve
Adanac
Well-known
Sure - we use our eyes to focus manual focus lenses on film cameras, but most of those cameras benefit from some sort of focus assist. Focus screens designed to make focus faster and more accurate - such as microprism collars or split centres - those are focus assists. Some photographers need fast focus, some only need accurate focus, many need both. An assist can get you there.
The same is true with electronic display of focus information.
If a camera has a poor resolution EVF - and any EVF is already far behind an optical display in terms of resolution / resolving power - then yes, certainly it can get in the way of achieving focus accurately or quickly. No?
I've not used the G1 but have extensively used the X100 and the X-Pro1 shares the same EVF according to Fujifilm. I'm dead certain that I would not want to be using manual focus lenses extensively while chained to a hobbled EVF like that one. Maybe the G1's is better; the X100/X-Pro1 EVF is insufficient to the task.
The same is true with electronic display of focus information.
If a camera has a poor resolution EVF - and any EVF is already far behind an optical display in terms of resolution / resolving power - then yes, certainly it can get in the way of achieving focus accurately or quickly. No?
I've not used the G1 but have extensively used the X100 and the X-Pro1 shares the same EVF according to Fujifilm. I'm dead certain that I would not want to be using manual focus lenses extensively while chained to a hobbled EVF like that one. Maybe the G1's is better; the X100/X-Pro1 EVF is insufficient to the task.
dreilly
Chillin' in Geneva
Just to be clear, I was never under any impression that the X-1 Pro had an actual rangefinder mechanism. Posters earlier in the thread seemed to be treating it as a possibility, which was clearly the most wishful of thinking.
I use the GXR with manual lenses and that has focus peaking and magnification...it works fine. It's just too bad that the neatest thing about the X-1 Pro, which is the OVF and its overlay, appears useless, making the X-1 Pro a lot less special if you're using M glass on it.
That doesn't mean it isn't a cracking good camera in its own right, with its own lenses. Thanks for clarifying the MF functions, however.
I use the GXR with manual lenses and that has focus peaking and magnification...it works fine. It's just too bad that the neatest thing about the X-1 Pro, which is the OVF and its overlay, appears useless, making the X-1 Pro a lot less special if you're using M glass on it.
That doesn't mean it isn't a cracking good camera in its own right, with its own lenses. Thanks for clarifying the MF functions, however.
DougFord
on the good foot
...as others have stated, these cameras are designed as AF cameras from the get- go. Manual focus capability is an after, after thought