David Doler
Keeping Ilford in busines
Does anyone on the other side of the pond (I'm on the east coast of the US) have a feeling for the future Ilford? While Kodak's busy trying to reinvent the digital wheel, I was wondering what was in store at Ilford after the purchase and restructuring. I'd be lost without my HP5+ and Ilfosol if they decided they'd rather get out of the film & chemical business.
Stephanie Brim
Mental Experimental.
IIRC, Ilford is quite alright now.
egpj
50 Summilux is da DEVIL!
Amen on that! I have the entire Ilford line in my fridge. The last I heard their restructuring was working and they were expected to show a profit. One can only hope and buy their products to help support.
W
wlewisiii
Guest
It's my feeling that if they concentrate on their "core competancies" 
they should be alright for the forseeable future. Essentially Kodak seems to be handing B&W to Ilford and color to Fuji. Get used to those products and try to buy only them might be the best way to handle the near term future, in my view.
Personally I'll miss Plus-X and Tri-X when they're gone in the next couple of years, thanks to the mismanagement of Kodak rather than any lack of profitability, but that's the way it appears to be going. I'll stick to shooting the them because it's what I prefer, but when Ilford and the rest are all that's left, I'll do just fine shooting them.
William
they should be alright for the forseeable future. Essentially Kodak seems to be handing B&W to Ilford and color to Fuji. Get used to those products and try to buy only them might be the best way to handle the near term future, in my view. Personally I'll miss Plus-X and Tri-X when they're gone in the next couple of years, thanks to the mismanagement of Kodak rather than any lack of profitability, but that's the way it appears to be going. I'll stick to shooting the them because it's what I prefer, but when Ilford and the rest are all that's left, I'll do just fine shooting them.
William
julianphotoart
No likey digital-phooey
Ilfochrome
Ilfochrome
Does the restructuring include continued production of Ilfochrome paper and chemicals? I read the new management's statement and it only spoke of B&W. Have they said anything else?
Ilfochrome
Does the restructuring include continued production of Ilfochrome paper and chemicals? I read the new management's statement and it only spoke of B&W. Have they said anything else?
David Doler
Keeping Ilford in busines
I never really warmed up to Tri-X or Plus-X. I went to Ilford from the start. I'm hoping that they realize that with Kodak out of the game, they have the lion's share of the market for traditional B&W. Now the question is, will there be enough traditional shooters to keep them interested for the long haul. We'll have to wait and see.
phototone
Well-known
If people continue to purchase Tri-x and Plus-x in reasonable quantities, then I think Kodak will continue to provide them. Kodak built a new state-of-the-art coating plant for films a few years ago. The only thing Kodak has discontinued is their b/w photo papers. They have stated publically that they are continuing to manufacture film. I personally have not cared for Kodak b/w printing papers in many years, preferring ILford & Agfa. It is doubtful that Kodak would be willing to give up the manufacturing of film, as there is still a huge market in movie camera film for "Hollywood" type productions. Most cinematographers prefer film for capture, even when the program goes direct to TV. So if the budget allows it, the show is shot on film. About 98 percent of theatrical movies are still shot on film. About 98 percent of all movie theatres exhibit all their movies from 35mm film prints. Quite a few billion feet of 35mm film yearly.
Then there are the "specialty" formats such as IMAX which is totally dependent on film. There is no digital alternative.
I wonder where Ilfords color paper materials are manufactured. If, they are produced in Switzerland, then I would question whether they would continue to be available. It is the plant in England that went through administration and sale. This is a b/w only plant.
Then there are the "specialty" formats such as IMAX which is totally dependent on film. There is no digital alternative.
I wonder where Ilfords color paper materials are manufactured. If, they are produced in Switzerland, then I would question whether they would continue to be available. It is the plant in England that went through administration and sale. This is a b/w only plant.
phototone
Well-known
I believe that the way film is manufactured is that a "coating" is made at some point. This "bulk" coating is on large wide rolls of film stock. Perhaps a whole years worth of, lets say Tri-x is made at once and stored in total darkness in ideal conditions temperature and humidity wise.. We are talking about 6 ft or wider rolls many thousands of feet long. This is then brought out of storage and cut to size (120, 35mm) perforated (35mm) and packaged as needed to keep inventory at some pre-determined level. I don't think any film is continuously made from scratch every day. This way one coating line can make many different film types.
Considering this manufacturing technique. For a film to be discontinued there has to come a time when the demand just does not justify running a new batch. When this point is reached, then a product is discontinued. The amount of film made of any one film type is determined by the requirements of the manufacturing process. Perhaps some other manufacturers have different, or smaller, requirements for a new "run" of a particular film. Therefore we can speculate that Ilford may be able to continue to produce b/w films due to smaller and more efficient manufacturing than Kodak. It is a much smaller market now. I think Kodak had this in mind when buliding their new coating plant a few years ago also.
Considering this manufacturing technique. For a film to be discontinued there has to come a time when the demand just does not justify running a new batch. When this point is reached, then a product is discontinued. The amount of film made of any one film type is determined by the requirements of the manufacturing process. Perhaps some other manufacturers have different, or smaller, requirements for a new "run" of a particular film. Therefore we can speculate that Ilford may be able to continue to produce b/w films due to smaller and more efficient manufacturing than Kodak. It is a much smaller market now. I think Kodak had this in mind when buliding their new coating plant a few years ago also.
I have long preferred Ilford Pan-F and Agfa Isopan IF over Panatomic-X, and Ilford FP over Plus-X. But that fondness doesn't extend to HP, and I like the look of Tri-X. And then I'm a true devotee of Ilford XP too!
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Phototone, you are more or less right: the big roll is called a 'mother roll' and this is then 'converted' -- slit and (if necessary) perforated, though 35mm and 120 are usually on different base stocks (the big exception is 120 Delta 3200) and LF is a different (and thicker) base again.
This does however give rise to the opposite possibility from what you described: if demand is sufficient, a mother roll of an 'obsolete' or 'discontined' emulsion can be coated and converted, in between the mass production of the main lines.
The big rolls are coated incredibly fast -- as I recall, coating speeds are in metres per second -- and would normally be converted pretty quickly as there is a lot of silver sitting around in a mother roll, not earning any money.
Cheers,
Roger
This does however give rise to the opposite possibility from what you described: if demand is sufficient, a mother roll of an 'obsolete' or 'discontined' emulsion can be coated and converted, in between the mass production of the main lines.
The big rolls are coated incredibly fast -- as I recall, coating speeds are in metres per second -- and would normally be converted pretty quickly as there is a lot of silver sitting around in a mother roll, not earning any money.
Cheers,
Roger
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Trius
Waiting on Maitani
Julian: Ilfochrome and inkjet papers are not a part of this equation. Ilford in England is now a totally separate company, with the Ilfochrome and inkjet papers produced in Switzerland.
Trius
Trius
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Trius,
Not TOTALLy separate. I believe Ilford still does at least some of the coating for Marly.
Cheers,
Roger
Not TOTALLy separate. I believe Ilford still does at least some of the coating for Marly.
Cheers,
Roger