tron
Established
Hi, I am using the Fuji and I love it.
The thing that bugs me is, I am more comfortable with manual focusing and so i always wonder whether I should change over to the M7II.
I have tried the Mamiya out. The Biogon 43 is actually quite a lot wider, though I am not much a fan of an external viewfinder. The 65 is more or less the perspective of the wider end of my Fuji. The 80 is good for its large aperture and the 150's longer focal length is actually a plus when compared to my Fuji's focal range. I don't have much information about the differences in MOD.
Personally, i like the Fuji colour tone better because the contrast of the Mamiya seems quite high, not a problem with scenery but a bit awkward when shooting portraits.
Is it worth the move ?
The thing that bugs me is, I am more comfortable with manual focusing and so i always wonder whether I should change over to the M7II.
I have tried the Mamiya out. The Biogon 43 is actually quite a lot wider, though I am not much a fan of an external viewfinder. The 65 is more or less the perspective of the wider end of my Fuji. The 80 is good for its large aperture and the 150's longer focal length is actually a plus when compared to my Fuji's focal range. I don't have much information about the differences in MOD.
Personally, i like the Fuji colour tone better because the contrast of the Mamiya seems quite high, not a problem with scenery but a bit awkward when shooting portraits.
Is it worth the move ?
sf
Veteran
That's quite a big move. The M7II, with the lenses you mentioned, is going to set you back 10 times what you spent on the Fuji zi.
How about the PERFECT 645 RF? hmm?
You know. . . .see the avatar. RF645, baby. Best of all worlds. Big neg, but not too big, compact body, built like a Leica, well designed, and the glass is wonderful. AND, it won't set you back $5000+
I'll tell you, I've held them all, and the Bronica is the best of the bunch.
Go here and explore : http://www.shutterflower.com/RF645 review.htm
I'm a broken record with this camera. I know.
How about the PERFECT 645 RF? hmm?
You know. . . .see the avatar. RF645, baby. Best of all worlds. Big neg, but not too big, compact body, built like a Leica, well designed, and the glass is wonderful. AND, it won't set you back $5000+
I'll tell you, I've held them all, and the Bronica is the best of the bunch.
Go here and explore : http://www.shutterflower.com/RF645 review.htm
I'm a broken record with this camera. I know.
snowy
Member
I'm in the fortunate position of owning and using rather a lot of cameras, including the Mamiya 7II, Bronica RF645 and the Fuji GA645Zi (amongst others). I'm afraid I have to disagree with shutterflower - I think the M7II is the best of that particular bunch.
There's a big difference with 6x7cm format over 6x4.5 although the 10 frames per roll does eat film rather too quickly! There's no doubt that the M7 is a higher quality build than the Fuji, and the lenses are superb. The Bronica is close behind but not quite there. I've always had the impression that the film wind lever on the Bronica is fragile - just the way it feels I guess, but the Mamiya gives more confidence that nothing's about to break! The lens change on the M7 is a bit of a nuisance and the Bronica certainly handles that better, but you get used to it. If you don't like using external viewfinders for the wider lenses, both the Bronica 45 and the Mamiya 50 can be used at a push with the camera's viewfinder at a push, although it would be unwise to do so with the Mamiya 43 as it's substantially wider. That lens was one of the reasons I went for the M7 in the first place - there's nothing quite like it in any other MF camera other than the Hasselblad SWC.
The Fuji is easier to grab and go as it's much smaller and has the "advantage" of AF and a built-in zoom. I did a comparison of the results from a recent film with the GA654Zi and the Bronica RF645 and there's less in it than I'd expected. Everyone thinks the zoom is going to be inferior, but that's one very very good zoom. There's not a lot in it for aperture speed with any of them. I've found the metering on the Fuji to be the most reliable of the three.
Just my 2c. Let me know if there's anything you want me to check out for you
snowy
There's a big difference with 6x7cm format over 6x4.5 although the 10 frames per roll does eat film rather too quickly! There's no doubt that the M7 is a higher quality build than the Fuji, and the lenses are superb. The Bronica is close behind but not quite there. I've always had the impression that the film wind lever on the Bronica is fragile - just the way it feels I guess, but the Mamiya gives more confidence that nothing's about to break! The lens change on the M7 is a bit of a nuisance and the Bronica certainly handles that better, but you get used to it. If you don't like using external viewfinders for the wider lenses, both the Bronica 45 and the Mamiya 50 can be used at a push with the camera's viewfinder at a push, although it would be unwise to do so with the Mamiya 43 as it's substantially wider. That lens was one of the reasons I went for the M7 in the first place - there's nothing quite like it in any other MF camera other than the Hasselblad SWC.
The Fuji is easier to grab and go as it's much smaller and has the "advantage" of AF and a built-in zoom. I did a comparison of the results from a recent film with the GA654Zi and the Bronica RF645 and there's less in it than I'd expected. Everyone thinks the zoom is going to be inferior, but that's one very very good zoom. There's not a lot in it for aperture speed with any of them. I've found the metering on the Fuji to be the most reliable of the three.
Just my 2c. Let me know if there's anything you want me to check out for you
snowy
tron
Established
Hi, flower, thanks for showing me your RF645 review. It's extremely informative.
Fact is, it is now extremely difficult to find a full set of RF645, I mean four lenses, flash and the viewfinder / flash adapter. If you do, it will cost you megabucks.
Since I like the colour of Fuji more, I think I will just sell other stuff of mine to get the M7II. After all, though they are both rangefinders, they have different frame sizes and their way of operations are slightly different. It is just like my G2 and TX-2 working hand in hand, kind of similar but different, can't live without either.
Fact is, it is now extremely difficult to find a full set of RF645, I mean four lenses, flash and the viewfinder / flash adapter. If you do, it will cost you megabucks.
Since I like the colour of Fuji more, I think I will just sell other stuff of mine to get the M7II. After all, though they are both rangefinders, they have different frame sizes and their way of operations are slightly different. It is just like my G2 and TX-2 working hand in hand, kind of similar but different, can't live without either
.tron
Established
Snowy, thanks for your reply.
Think I will slowly build up a M7II system - no hurry now that I decide to keep the Zi. In fact, it would seem quite common for people here to keep more than one, if not all three (RF645, M7II and one of the Fuji's). Why can't I do it, right ?
Think I will slowly build up a M7II system - no hurry now that I decide to keep the Zi. In fact, it would seem quite common for people here to keep more than one, if not all three (RF645, M7II and one of the Fuji's). Why can't I do it, right ?
sf
Veteran
tron said:Hi, flower, thanks for showing me your RF645 review. It's extremely informative.
Fact is, it is now extremely difficult to find a full set of RF645, I mean four lenses, flash and the viewfinder / flash adapter. If you do, it will cost you megabucks.
Since I like the colour of Fuji more, I think I will just sell other stuff of mine to get the M7II. After all, though they are both rangefinders, they have different frame sizes and their way of operations are slightly different. It is just like my G2 and TX-2 working hand in hand, kind of similar but different, can't live without either
3 lenses, not 4. You'd have to have two VFs for four. You COULD, but no framelines
sf
Veteran
snowy said:I'm in the fortunate position of owning and using rather a lot of cameras, including the Mamiya 7II, Bronica RF645 and the Fuji GA645Zi (amongst others). I'm afraid I have to disagree with shutterflower - I think the M7II is the best of that particular bunch.
There's a big difference with 6x7cm format over 6x4.5 although the 10 frames per roll does eat film rather too quickly! There's no doubt that the M7 is a higher quality build than the Fuji, and the lenses are superb. The Bronica is close behind but not quite there. I've always had the impression that the film wind lever on the Bronica is fragile - just the way it feels I guess, but the Mamiya gives more confidence that nothing's about to break! The lens change on the M7 is a bit of a nuisance and the Bronica certainly handles that better, but you get used to it. If you don't like using external viewfinders for the wider lenses, both the Bronica 45 and the Mamiya 50 can be used at a push with the camera's viewfinder at a push, although it would be unwise to do so with the Mamiya 43 as it's substantially wider. That lens was one of the reasons I went for the M7 in the first place - there's nothing quite like it in any other MF camera other than the Hasselblad SWC.
The Fuji is easier to grab and go as it's much smaller and has the "advantage" of AF and a built-in zoom. I did a comparison of the results from a recent film with the GA654Zi and the Bronica RF645 and there's less in it than I'd expected. Everyone thinks the zoom is going to be inferior, but that's one very very good zoom. There's not a lot in it for aperture speed with any of them. I've found the metering on the Fuji to be the most reliable of the three.
Just my 2c. Let me know if there's anything you want me to check out for you
snowy
I've used and fiddled with both the Mamiya AND the Bronica simultaneously (at Samy's cameras) and the Bronica feels better built, handles better . . . and has a sturdier winding lever.
BUT, the Mamiya is a cut above, if only for the glass and the price.
tron
Established
shutterflower said:
I thought you have the 45, 65, 100 and 135 (the latter two's production were both shortlived) ?
tron
Established
shutterflower said:
I am not the owner but I have tried out all three. I think the RF645 and M7II are both sturdy.
In terms of value for money Fuji has to be the winner.
In terms of value for money + operations, I'll choose the RF645.
Being a Fuji owner, I will do as I said, keep the Fuji and buy a M7II.
Cheers.
sf
Veteran
tron said:
I don't have the 135, but then, even if i did, I don't have framelines for it in my VF.
snowy
Member
tron said:
Yep, the 135 proved to be too long a focal length for the rangefinder base-length in the original Bronica bodies, so they replaced the 135mm lens with a 100mm lens and changed the frame lines in subsequent bodies. The whole RD line was shutdown quite soon after so neither tele lens lived very long :-( There are therefore two different RF645 bodies - one with the frame lines for the 65 and 135 lenses and the other with frames for the 65 and 100 lenses. Both need an external viewfinder for the 45mm lens.
The Mamiya 7 (both versions I and II) also need external viewfinders for the 43mm and 50mm lenses, and has framlines for 65, 80 and 150mm. The 210mm lens was a bit of an afterthought and also needs an external viewfinder and is not rangefinder coupled.