batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
On a hunch, I searched my local Craigslist for enlargers today and wouldn't you know, somebody two towns over had one (Beseler 23C Series II) free for the taking. Just back from picking it up.
I know zilch about printing. I was getting closer to finally turning our bathroom into a darkroom because I'm sick and tired of changing bags, and also need to cut and roll some bulk 46mm stock for 127. But wet printing was not really on my mind. Maybe a contact print here and there from a 6x9, just for the heck of it. I don't even shoot much B&W...
Anyway, I can't believe how friggin' huge the thing is. It immediately had to disappear into our basement, and I can already tell I won't like that schlep every time I want to use it. But that's the only storage space we got.
The story went that their son had gotten it for free years ago when the high school gave up the darkroom. Now they're moving, had been offering it on CL for a few weeks starting at $150, no interest. Included were the following:
50/4.5 Schneider lens
35mm neg carrier
A couple of Leitz filters (?)
Two more lenses with boards (Isco, 50 and 75)
A second neg carrier, also 35mm, but not yet sure it's for this enlarger
Two tanks, but one was cracked and what's worse, hadn't been rinsed, so the boxes with the filters and extra lenses have been getting fumed for who knows how many years
A bottle of Ilford paper developer. Still sealed, but could be 20 years old or more (what's an easy way to test it?)
I'm in no hurry to get this set up, and I'm sure there's plenty of info online and in our town library. But pointers are welcome. I would particularly like to hear from those of you who just got into printing recently.
I know zilch about printing. I was getting closer to finally turning our bathroom into a darkroom because I'm sick and tired of changing bags, and also need to cut and roll some bulk 46mm stock for 127. But wet printing was not really on my mind. Maybe a contact print here and there from a 6x9, just for the heck of it. I don't even shoot much B&W...
Anyway, I can't believe how friggin' huge the thing is. It immediately had to disappear into our basement, and I can already tell I won't like that schlep every time I want to use it. But that's the only storage space we got.
The story went that their son had gotten it for free years ago when the high school gave up the darkroom. Now they're moving, had been offering it on CL for a few weeks starting at $150, no interest. Included were the following:
50/4.5 Schneider lens
35mm neg carrier
A couple of Leitz filters (?)
Two more lenses with boards (Isco, 50 and 75)
A second neg carrier, also 35mm, but not yet sure it's for this enlarger
Two tanks, but one was cracked and what's worse, hadn't been rinsed, so the boxes with the filters and extra lenses have been getting fumed for who knows how many years
A bottle of Ilford paper developer. Still sealed, but could be 20 years old or more (what's an easy way to test it?)
I'm in no hurry to get this set up, and I'm sure there's plenty of info online and in our town library. But pointers are welcome. I would particularly like to hear from those of you who just got into printing recently.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Set up your darkroom IN the basement! Its easier to lightproof a basement room and basements usually have a sink in them or access to pipes to install one. My first darkroom was in my grandma's basement.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Thanks, that had crossed my mind but would add considerably to the complexity. The bathroom is much easier to lightproof, and cleaner! If I find out I like it, I may just need to look for a more portable enlarger.
pschauss
Well-known
When got back into printing 10 years ago after a 32 year hiatus I set up in a corner of my basement. I litteraly pushed aside enough of the things we had been storing to give myself about 10 square feet of space. I set up two tables with a narrow isle between them, one table for the enlarger and related stuff and one for the developing trays. Since the laundry sink, my only source of running water, was on the other side of the basement, I used an extra print tray filled with water to hold the prints after printing and processing. At the end of my printing session I washed all of the prints in the sink.
The only major changes I have made since them were:
- buying a second enlarger dedicated to contact prints (At $40 I couldn't pass it up.)
- replacing my wet-side table with a darkroom sink and plumbing the drain over to the laundry sink.
- buying an 8x10 vertical slot processor
- buying print drums and a roller to do 11x14 prints.
I still have no walls around my dark room so I can only print at night and I have to wait if my wife is doing the laundry.
I still have not bothered to install running water.
I still using a changing bag to load film into a developing tank and to handle bulk film. I would probably continue to use the changing bag even if I had walls around my darkroom since I know there is no danger of fogging my film in the bag.
Regarding the print developer, the best way to test it is to pour a few drops on a piece of print paper. If the paper turns black on those spots your developer is still good.
Good luck.
The only major changes I have made since them were:
- buying a second enlarger dedicated to contact prints (At $40 I couldn't pass it up.)
- replacing my wet-side table with a darkroom sink and plumbing the drain over to the laundry sink.
- buying an 8x10 vertical slot processor
- buying print drums and a roller to do 11x14 prints.
I still have no walls around my dark room so I can only print at night and I have to wait if my wife is doing the laundry.
I still have not bothered to install running water.
I still using a changing bag to load film into a developing tank and to handle bulk film. I would probably continue to use the changing bag even if I had walls around my darkroom since I know there is no danger of fogging my film in the bag.
Regarding the print developer, the best way to test it is to pour a few drops on a piece of print paper. If the paper turns black on those spots your developer is still good.
Good luck.
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Don't get a portable enlarger, get a wall-mount enlarger and make a fold-out baseboard with a strut (so that it sits horizontally and you can align the enlarger head 100% parallel to it).
Takes up less space, looks less intrusive.
The Laborator 1200 is a good choice, and as an added benefit you'll get to print 4x5".
Takes up less space, looks less intrusive.
The Laborator 1200 is a good choice, and as an added benefit you'll get to print 4x5".
Vics
Veteran
I don't know about the Schneider lens (it's probably very good.), but for small money, you can buy a El-Nikkor 50mm f2.8, and you'll love it! While you're buying that, get yourself a good 75mm as well (mine's a Nikkor f4). You'll hate the one you have.
Go slow, set it up in the basement, take your time and do some reading on the subject.
If you're not going to do much B&W, then ditch the whole thing and install a wet bar down there.
Go slow, set it up in the basement, take your time and do some reading on the subject.
If you're not going to do much B&W, then ditch the whole thing and install a wet bar down there.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Thanks again but, for various reasons I really don't need to explain here, the basement is out. Period. This will be a traveling circus to be set up in my bathtub, or not happen at all. Sorry if that wasn't clear enough.
As a mental exercise, I've been trying to list all the things that didn't come with it:
trays and tongs
safelight
paper safe
contact frame
drying rack
OK, the old hands among you can stop laughing now and gently remind me of my glaring omissions
Also, about half of what little B&W I've done so far was on 127 (both 3x4 and 4x4). How rare are those negative carriers?
Finally, I haven't even plugged it in yet. That circa 1958 power cord doesn't look too trustworthy anymore. Or never was to begin with, I find, but I grew up in a country with actual electric safety standards
As a mental exercise, I've been trying to list all the things that didn't come with it:
trays and tongs
safelight
paper safe
contact frame
drying rack
OK, the old hands among you can stop laughing now and gently remind me of my glaring omissions
Also, about half of what little B&W I've done so far was on 127 (both 3x4 and 4x4). How rare are those negative carriers?
Finally, I haven't even plugged it in yet. That circa 1958 power cord doesn't look too trustworthy anymore. Or never was to begin with, I find, but I grew up in a country with actual electric safety standards
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Most importantly you need a set of trays for processing the paper, and a place to put them while working.
If you have little space, I suggest you work vertically using a "tray rack" or "tray ladder" (like this or this) that you put on top of your bathtub. I used one for years. Developer at the top, then stop bath, then fixing bath, then a tray of plain water for collecting the prints for washing. Periodically I'd take them out of the last and put them into a separate washing tray with circulating water in the bathtub. I built my rack myself from a 20 EUR wireframe contraption I got at IKEA.
Instead of a drying rack a clothes line is enough for resin-coated paper. For fibre-based paper you can use wet adhesive tape to glue them onto wooden boards; the paper will shrink a little when drying, leading to tension on the paper and a perfectly flat print with a nicely broken sheen from drying on air.
If you want to save space, yet have a semi-permanent darkroom, I suggest yet again to mount your 23C's column to the wall. There are wall-mount adapters available, one of them made by KBH. Put a fold-out baseboard underneath it, or work with a removable table. It will mean greatly reduced hassle in setting up your darkroom for printing.
Instead of a 127 negative carrier, just use a 6x6 or 6x9 carrier and mask the rest of the frame.
In "little tools" you need at least a darkroom timer, preferably a grain focusing device, and a set of Ilford contrast filters for variable-contrast paper.
If you have little space, I suggest you work vertically using a "tray rack" or "tray ladder" (like this or this) that you put on top of your bathtub. I used one for years. Developer at the top, then stop bath, then fixing bath, then a tray of plain water for collecting the prints for washing. Periodically I'd take them out of the last and put them into a separate washing tray with circulating water in the bathtub. I built my rack myself from a 20 EUR wireframe contraption I got at IKEA.
Instead of a drying rack a clothes line is enough for resin-coated paper. For fibre-based paper you can use wet adhesive tape to glue them onto wooden boards; the paper will shrink a little when drying, leading to tension on the paper and a perfectly flat print with a nicely broken sheen from drying on air.
If you want to save space, yet have a semi-permanent darkroom, I suggest yet again to mount your 23C's column to the wall. There are wall-mount adapters available, one of them made by KBH. Put a fold-out baseboard underneath it, or work with a removable table. It will mean greatly reduced hassle in setting up your darkroom for printing.
Instead of a 127 negative carrier, just use a 6x6 or 6x9 carrier and mask the rest of the frame.
In "little tools" you need at least a darkroom timer, preferably a grain focusing device, and a set of Ilford contrast filters for variable-contrast paper.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
By the way, judging from current ebay listings, that extra carrier appears to be a "Negatrans" which permits scrolling through a strip of film without having to remove and replace the carrier. Hah. That'll come in mighty handy for all those times I have more than one print-worthy frame per strip.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Thanks rxmd, that's great info.
Re: 127 carriers, I was wondering about reeducating a 110 or 126 carrier with a Dremel tool...
Re: 127 carriers, I was wondering about reeducating a 110 or 126 carrier with a Dremel tool...
Livesteamer
Well-known
If you know someone with a home machine shop it would be simple to mill out a smaller carrier to fit 127. Also, some tech schools might do it for free as a student project. Get a sturdy base for that 23C. They are heavy. Good Luck, Have fun. Joe
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Update: Turns out there is no easel. It was pictured in the ad but those photos were older, it seems. The description was also for a Componon-S 80mm lens, instead I got a Componar 50. I bet junior was smart enough to sell the Componon separately.
Ah well, free is free, but I'm beginning to wonder if this is one of those "free is too expensive" items, i.e. the cost to complete the outfit might be more than I'd pay for something that better matches my needs if I keep looking.
Lastly, those "filters" are actually Leica close-up lenses for R series. One each Elpro VIa and VIIa. I'll see if they clean up OK and then they'll be in the classifieds here.
Ah well, free is free, but I'm beginning to wonder if this is one of those "free is too expensive" items, i.e. the cost to complete the outfit might be more than I'd pay for something that better matches my needs if I keep looking.
Lastly, those "filters" are actually Leica close-up lenses for R series. One each Elpro VIa and VIIa. I'll see if they clean up OK and then they'll be in the classifieds here.
Turtle
Veteran
I work using my double garage as a darkroom. It remains used to garden gear, storage etc and has a dusty concrete floor. None of this is a problem once you find out what matters and what does not. You'd be amazed how imperfect lightproofing needs to be and there are tests you can do to see if yours is good enough.
I have not had a proper darkroom ever and it has not stopped me.
The most important things is not to rush and stress about it. With the initial light proofing in place, some time during the day with the lights out will tell you where needs more attention.
My enlarger is huge (10x8 devere) next to an almost as huge enlarher (5x7durst) and I mostly enlarge 35mm now
Have FUN!
I have not had a proper darkroom ever and it has not stopped me.
The most important things is not to rush and stress about it. With the initial light proofing in place, some time during the day with the lights out will tell you where needs more attention.
My enlarger is huge (10x8 devere) next to an almost as huge enlarher (5x7durst) and I mostly enlarge 35mm now
Have FUN!
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Don't worry. Darkroom stuff is cheap nowadays. I'm pretty sure you can get whatever you need to start printing now for under $100 total, and it'll be a hell of a good investment. The joy of looking at prints you made yourself and the magic moment of seeing the latent image slowly appear in the developer under red light is one of the best things about photography.
Start with the Componar, it's OK for a starting lens. Wait for a cheap offer on an 80mm enlarging lens, you can get a really good one for $20 if you have the time (I paid 15 EUR for a Rodagon 105.) Regarding easels, you don't even need an easel at all to start, and you can always buy a cheap one for $5 to start with and wait for a good offer on a better one. It's one of those things where having a little time pays many times over
Contact prints can be made with a sheet of glass, etc. Regarding negative carriers, a little filing goes a long way, no problem. Edges will be a little rough, but that will look cool in the prints. You don't need a paper safe either, the boxes are lightproof. And in general, a little improvising can go a long way, too.
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shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Keep watching Craigslist, spending $100 for a complete and "ready to go" setup is worth it.
Better than hunting components one plank at a time because over time it'll diminish your enthusiasm if you can't see the result (your own prints) sooner.
If I may offer a tip: Look for color head enlargers, so you don't have to mess with filter (holders, etc.) while learning some basic printing techniques. Also, smaller ones like Fujimoto (or Focomat if you're lucky) are very easy to use and setup, and will get you cranking out 8x10 prints in no time, then when you're ready for more, you can start looking at 6x7 capable enlargers.
Better than hunting components one plank at a time because over time it'll diminish your enthusiasm if you can't see the result (your own prints) sooner.
If I may offer a tip: Look for color head enlargers, so you don't have to mess with filter (holders, etc.) while learning some basic printing techniques. Also, smaller ones like Fujimoto (or Focomat if you're lucky) are very easy to use and setup, and will get you cranking out 8x10 prints in no time, then when you're ready for more, you can start looking at 6x7 capable enlargers.
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batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Guys and gals, you may be reading a little too much enthusiasm into my posts. I'm very thankful for your help but I just want to be clear about one thing: I don't expect B&W to be more than an interesting side show for me. If this was still 1990, I'd be shooting slides exclusively, show them to my friends every now and then, and I wouldn't miss a thing. Now I'm mostly C-41 and some B&W because it's cheaper but man what a drag to have to print or scan everything just to see if it's any good. (Still more fun than digital, of course )
And yes, I have seen Blow Up. Nope, sorry, not my thing. But cheap enough to dabble in, for variety.
)And yes, I have seen Blow Up. Nope, sorry, not my thing. But cheap enough to dabble in, for variety.
filmfan
Well-known
What's wrong with the changing bag? You don't NEED to use this new stuff if you don't want to...
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Try rolling 127 from bulk stock in a changing bag. That's what's wrong, for starters. I also find it more disorienting than being in total darkness, but with space to lay stuff out logically.
mwoenv
Well-known
I have a Beseler 23CII and set it up in the bathroom when I print. It's too heavy to move the whole thing so I remove the whole enlarger assembly from the baseboard/column when I move it to and from the bathroom. Just slide the round bar out behind the condenser stage that holds the the enlarger assembly on the column and put it back together in the bathroom. You'll have to remove the 2 small clips on the ends of the bar. I pried them off and never put them back on because that bar is not sliding anywhere, except maybe if you tilt the head back a lot to make wall projections.
batterytypehah!
Lord of the Dings
Excellent idea, thanks!
A very quick Google search seems to indicate that bulbs are easily available and cheap, is that so? With all this moving around I doubt I'll get a lot of life out of them.
A very quick Google search seems to indicate that bulbs are easily available and cheap, is that so? With all this moving around I doubt I'll get a lot of life out of them.